The HW division is the most competitive...

So you are completely disregarding the facts I showed you? Jones is not in shape at 238 lbs.

And yes, Jones is usually 217 lbs to 223bs in cage, which makes him a small to average LHW.

Cormier was 236 lbs in cage at 205
You goofy motherfucker!!! Do you weigh more than 205lbs on fight night??? Do you have to CUT weight to make 205???

Then YES you are a hw.
 
You goofy motherfucker!!! Do you weigh more than 205lbs on fight night??? Do you have to CUT weight to make 205???

Then YES you are a hw.
And he's been fighting heavier LHWs

I wonder why you are not calling out DC for being almost 20 lbs heavier than Jones fight night

And anyway Jones was eager to fight 300 lbs Brock Lesnar
 
Lol.

Now people are defending the HW division by saying skills aren't necessary. That's how bad HW talent has become.

HWs in the past had just as much power and strength, plus the skills on top of that.
 
I know that people talk about the HW division being garbage and that the real competition is at lower classes but remember, the lower classes were created to protect competitors from the big dogs. All of the skill in the world flys out of the window, along with your teeth, when you get clocked. I hear that certain fighters won't move up because there is no competition but that makes zero sense. They all want to be the big dog at the top of the hill and that is at HW. I don't see how anyone would want to starve and dehydrate themselves to "fight better competition" when they could jump right in and fight at their natural/walk-around weight but we all know that is not the goal.


100% truth.

Strength, size, power all matters. It's why the lower divisions all do massive weight cuts to try to get the size advantage.

HWs might not be the most athletic but someone like Black Beast would absolutely murder someone like George St Pierre in a fight.
 
100% truth.

Strength, size, power all matters. It's why the lower divisions all do massive weight cuts to try to get the size advantage.

HWs might not be the most athletic but someone like Black Beast would absolutely murder someone like George St Pierre in a fight.

To me, the cutoff is around MW. There are some MWs out there who could definitely hold their own against most HWs.

WW down, there's little chance.
 
First of all, have you ever seen Jon's faced sucked in at weigh ins, him using a towel or having any sign he has difficuly cutting? No. Because he ain't that big. He has very big upper body, but his legs are super skinny. That is the illusion of him being giant LHW. He has upperbody of a heavyweight and lower body of a welterweight.

245... ? Yeah, about that. If you believe this shit I don't know what to tell you <36>
He is not even close to 245. The only time that he weighted that much was when he actively weighlifted and has become absolutely enormous. Before the OSP fight. And was 240, not 245.
Jones is perfectly sized for 205. His weight in cage for the Gustafson fight was 222lbs. And I won't give you link to that, because you didn't give me link to where Jon said for the 245lbs. and I had to search for it. Bottom line - you didn't do your homework, Jon is normal sized LHW and there is a lot of available data about that, but you didn't looked for it, you looked for only what suits your opinion and you just talk out your ass.
Cutting weight has nothing to do to facing or avoiding better competition. I don't know how in the hell you are mixing these things???
Everybody cuts weight. And the people who don't are willingly handicapping themselves. You don't cut weight to avoid or seek any competition. You cut weigh to not suffer big size disadvantage. Big size distadvantage is just fucking unfair and gets peope careers cut short. Because when you have relatitvely similar skills with the opponent, a 15-25lbs of not just bodymass, but active musclemass and bigger bonestructure is a huge, huuge edge. Bigger guys are hitting harder, can take harder hits, have bigger reach, more strenght... I don't need to countinue.
https://www.mma-core.com/videos/Jon..._next_fight_230_w_a_six-pack_UFC_247/10336924
 
The lower classes are more skilled, but not skilled enough to make up the gap in physical attributes.

Pretty simple.

There is potentially some blending between LHW and HW. There are definitely some fighters at LHW that can beat some HWs (while having a better advantage at LHW).

You might even pick up a few of the larger MWs as well, but those would be extreme physical cases or legendary talent like Anderson Silva. Probably fighting the lighter guys at HW.
 
And he's been fighting heavier LHWs

I wonder why you are not calling out DC for being almost 20 lbs heavier than Jones fight night

And anyway Jones was eager to fight 300 lbs Brock Lesnar
We've already discussed why Cormier moved down... to avoid fighting a friend. You cut weight to avoid fighting guys your size or bigger. I call it chickenshit and you call it smart. At the end of the day, it is your face getting punched.
 
To me, the cutoff is around MW. There are some MWs out there who could definitely hold their own against most HWs.

WW down, there's little chance.

For sure ...
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I think one huge benefit of weight classes is that it has allowed the UFC to attract smaller talent who are otherwise athletes that are outside of the UFC's league. A ridiculous athlete like Henry Cejudo would be in the NFL or something if he wasn't 5'nothing.

Also, I'm pretty sure Henry couldn't make HW lol
 
Being able to hit the hardest is only a fraction of what makes a fighter. It's just more common with larger athletes that they'll hit harder. Doesn't make them technically better.... George Foreman is one of the greatest power punchers in boxing history. And he's forever known as the guy who was out worked, out smarted and out boxed by a smarter more technical Ali. So yeah, a 135 pound fighter doesn't want to get punched by a person twice their size. Who would? Doesn't change the fact the talent and skill at lighter weight classes is vastly superior.
 
Being able to hit the hardest is only a fraction of what makes a fighter. It's just more common with larger athletes that they'll hit harder. Doesn't make them technically better.... George Foreman is one of the greatest power punchers in boxing history. And he's forever known as the guy who was out worked, out smarted and out boxed by a smarter more technical Ali. So yeah, a 135 pound fighter doesn't want to get punched by a person twice their size. Who would? Doesn't change the fact the talent and skill at lighter weight classes is vastly superior.
Bad analogy... Foreman and Ali were both HWs. Try Ali vs Mayweather.
 
the bigger you are the better you are usually. However i think some guys from ww up would be capable of beating some heavies. Usman for example might be competitive vs the lower ranked heavies. A stiker would struggle but maia might also do alright as another example of a much smaller guy possibly beating a hw.
 
I already provided you a link, jon, at one of your other accounts you forgot you used to ask the question... @Kyle Stephens
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Yes, because if I was Jon Jones or a fan of Jon Jones, then me making this thread totally makes sense.

Me correcting you on Jones' weight does not thereby mean that I'm a fan of Jon Jones, but you played that card because you had no means to argue the point.

Just mentioning that Jones said something at a press conference is not a citation. Case and point: on Twitter, Jon Jones said you made a fool of yourself for arguing with me over his weight.
 
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Yes, because if I was Jon Jones or a fan of Jon Jones, then me making this thread totally makes sense.

Me correcting you on Jones' weight does not thereby mean that I'm a fan of Jon Jones, but you played that card because you had no means to argue the point.

Just mentioning that Jones said something at a press conference is not a citation. Case and point: on Twitter, Jon Jones said you made a fool of yourself for arguing with me over his weight.
I don't use twitter, jon.
 
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