The Greatest of All? Time.

Spirit Breaker said:
It probably has a lot to do with nutrition and physical exercise/exertion. The hunter gatherers ate just enough to stay alive and functional. We eat and exercise for pleasure. More calories to burn, more muscle gets put on, training techniques are made more efficient etc.
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that is the theory, I don't know though, i just don't know. My people, the Indians had to hunt, run down game before the horse, they had plenty to do. My aunt tells me they were up at 4 in the morning getting ready for the day. We may excercise for fun but I tell you, recently I did some labor jobs, old school all the way, they were the hardest things i've done in my life. 8-12 hours of swinging a pickaxe, shoveling, wheeling gravel. In 90 degree weather. I've trained and done hard grueling workouts, but I don't think it compares to that kind of labor. I could actually feel my kidneys straining and could hardly walk at the end of some days. To think that that's how they lived a hundred years ago and they did it all the time. A workout consisting of the old 3X8 and three bodyparts a day is pussy like in comparison. Our nutrition may be better for building bigger men with all the shit we pump into them but it's not good for us, the shit's killing us.
 
mozfonky said:
that is the theory, I don't know though, i just don't know. My people, the Indians had to hunt, run down game before the horse, they had plenty to do. My aunt tells me they were up at 4 in the morning getting ready for the day. We may excercise for fun but I tell you, recently I did some labor jobs, old school all the way, they were the hardest things i've done in my life. 8-12 hours of swinging a pickaxe, shoveling, wheeling gravel. In 90 degree weather. I've trained and done hard grueling workouts, but I don't think it compares to that kind of labor. I could actually feel my kidneys straining and could hardly walk at the end of some days. To think that that's how they lived a hundred years ago and they did it all the time. A workout consisting of the old 3X8 and three bodyparts a day is pussy like in comparison. Our nutrition may be better for building bigger men with all the shit we pump into them but it's not good for us, the shit's killing us.
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some people dont have a choice but to to do that stuff, when its all you know it doesnt seem to be that bad. shikata ga nai.
 
mozfonky said:
that is the theory, I don't know though, i just don't know. My people, the Indians had to hunt, run down game before the horse, they had plenty to do. My aunt tells me they were up at 4 in the morning getting ready for the day. We may excercise for fun but I tell you, recently I did some labor jobs, old school all the way, they were the hardest things i've done in my life. 8-12 hours of swinging a pickaxe, shoveling, wheeling gravel. In 90 degree weather. I've trained and done hard grueling workouts, but I don't think it compares to that kind of labor. I could actually feel my kidneys straining and could hardly walk at the end of some days. To think that that's how they lived a hundred years ago and they did it all the time. A workout consisting of the old 3X8 and three bodyparts a day is pussy like in comparison. Our nutrition may be better for building bigger men with all the shit we pump into them but it's not good for us, the shit's killing us.
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You think Ray Robinson was doing this sort of thing?
 
Seano said:
You think Ray Robinson was doing this sort of thing?
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Henry Armstrong and Dempsey did. Ray was so good so young he never had to have a job that I'm aware of.
 
mozfonky said:
if the human race were evolving wouldn't we be getting smarter but physically weaker? Not stating, just asking a rhetorical question. We've been forcefed so much stuff all of our lives we just don't use our own heads. Why would the race be getting stronger and faster when we don't even need strength and speed like we did 30,000 years ago. Another interesting "scientific" finding came out a couple years ago showing prehistoric man running after some kind of animal and using their measurements they were able to tell how fast he ran and they stated it would be faster than the fastest man alive today. Not telling you to change your mind, just question things a bit.
As far as your criteria for greatness, well i've always thought there were two seperate and maybe overlapping criteria. One is the impact on the sport and it's advancement and improvement, the other is strictly how these fighters would do without all of that, head to head with whoever else. For example, context wise, no fighter even comes close to Dempsey who brought so much to the style and improvement of boxing as well as how he was in comparison to his contempories. However, i don't think Dempsey could beat Tyson, Holmes, Louis, Ali even though he made it possible for them to be as good as they were. I've said above how primitive and godawful fighters of the pre 30's and even some of the thrities fighters look. Benny Leonard, Jack Johnson not only do not look good enough to beat the other greats, they don't even look good enough to beat a promising amateur.
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Indeed, our natural instincts are changing and are more reliant on technology to do shit for us.
take most teenagers smart phones away and drop them in the woods, most wouldnt know what to do.

That being said, I cant wait until the PS4 comes out
 
mozfonky said:
ya, i know all of that what i don't get is why? Human beings for the most part don't have to hunt down food, run from tigers and lions and so forth so why would we be evolving physically when most human beings and definitely most americans are getting less and less physical. I've read that co2 levels in the air have increased over the past hundred years so that may explain why human beings have grown bigger, supposedly it stimulates a growth hormone. At any rate, boxing isn't all about size, Joe louis beat giants, so did dempsey, Tyson was only listed at 5-11.5 and that is in the modern era, he also had a reach of only 72, bigger is not better, Ali was the perfect sized heavyweight, any bigger than that and you're losing a lot more than you're gaining. The klitschkos are really too big, Lewis was a little too big too.
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Uhh because we eat more
 
at the same time something like a smart phone gives anyone the means to educate themselves,something that wasnt possible for everyone in older times
 
HHJ said:
at the same time something like a smart phone gives anyone the means to educate themselves,something that wasnt possible for everyone in older times
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Unfortunately it's more used for people to talk as opposed to listen and any idiot can have a soap box to stand on.
 
Seano said:
There's no reason to fight more than 4 more times.
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Tell that to Bhop

Maybe Wlad should quit now too

What do either of them have to prove or gain?

It's a show of heart, Floyd just doesn't have it
 
Funkasaurus said:
Tell that to Bhop

Maybe Wlad should quit now too

What do either of them have to prove or gain?

It's a show of heart, Floyd just doesn't have it
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I think most of us wish Bhop would retire.

I don't see why retiring on top is such a problem. There's really no one else around his weight to justify him staying around longer. And don't start throwing out names of super middle weights.
 
Seano said:
I think most of us wish Bhop would retire.

I don't see why retiring on top is such a problem. There's really no one else around his weight to justify him staying around longer. And don't start throwing out names of super middle weights.
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People want Bhop to retire for HIS sake

but the man likes boxing and he wants to improve his legacy, every win does that.

The original point was that Floyd lacks heart - Retiring on top is an example of this
And his lack of heart is one of the factors that makes him inferior to some of the past greats

And if Floyd genuinely wanted to prove how great he was then he would fight (super) middleweights
 
^^^so dumb

I guy who should be fighting at LW fighting the best SMWs in the world is ridiculous. People expect thing from Floyd that have never been expected of any other fighter ever.
 
floyd will not retire on top, it's a rare fighter who does, actually, if the talent pool was deeper he'd already be over with. Check the other great fighters and where they were at his age, Sugar Ray Leonard was getting squashed at 34 by Terry Norris, Hagler was clearly not the same by his fight with leonard and he was 32. but with what's around, floyd will be able to cash in, yes, I said cash in for a long time. He doesn't know what to do with money (like most fighters) and will need to keep fighting. Most fighters end up broke. Roy Jones even owes the tax man at this point, it seems like they don't learn from history.
 
Funkasaurus said:
People want Bhop to retire for HIS sake

but the man likes boxing and he wants to improve his legacy, every win does that.

The original point was that Floyd lacks heart - Retiring on top is an example of this
And his lack of heart is one of the factors that makes him inferior to some of the past greats

And if Floyd genuinely wanted to prove how great he was then he would fight (super) middleweights
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Sugar Ray Robinson was a bum with no heart. He ducked Burley and refused to box at heavyweight!

(Although actually, the Burley thing is true...)
 
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