The Americana gets a bad wrap. (serious grapplers should read)

[Drew Foster]

Bear with me on this. I've been thinking about it all day.

Time and time again, we hear that the Americana is a begginer move that is sedom seen at the more advanced levels. It's rarely seen in major no-gi competions, and also it's rare in MMA. The last time I saw it used in both situations was by Werdum at ADCC 2007 from sidecontrol and Gonzaga at a UFC from the mount.

It's been well documented, even on this site through numerous polls, that the Kimura is an overall better submission, tha is more versatile, can be hit from more positions, and is pretty common at high level comps as well as in MMA.

I recently saw my first grappling teachers first competition and he subbed 5 people back-toback in the intermediate division with the Americana. Hoe was he able to do this against Purples and most people can't do it against Blues?

I think we can all raise our Americana percentages from the mount by doing the following. It's a tip from Ryron Gracie and it's raised my finishes by double from the mount. Skip to 1:00 to see what I mean. it's hard to describe. It involves hooking the leg on the side away from the lock to flatten them and prevent the reach across and buck and roll. It's awesome.

YouTube - Gracie Insider January 2007 Technique of Month - Americana skip to 1:00

For bette percentages from side control.... I'm not sure yet. And tips would be appreciated. What has helped me is to really drag the arm up their hip. If I can get my knee and shin over their close-side arm it helps too, preventing the reach across. If they are strong, I will even use my head to force the arm to the mat. Any other tips would be appreciated. The hardest part for me is getting the far arm away from their body. Once I do that, it's Kimura/Americana city all day long. I'll transition back and forth until I hit one. Getting there can be tough though.

I realize that there are higher percentage moves out there with less risk of counters, but I really believe as Saulo said in his new book, that the Americana if setupp properly CAN be usedat the highest levels of BJJ/Submission Wrestling. Just like it's more popular brother the Kimura. (Which as a fun sidenote is odd, being that the Kimura is the REVERSE Ude garami and the Americana is the regular ude garami.) I hate the name Americana too lol.

 

[lightw8]

I could care less what's considered a beginner move or not. If I can get a legit tap from doing it well then I'll take it....and I'm sure I'll have this same attitude five years from now. I realize that the Americana's known as a beginner move- but it's also my favorite sub from the top. I got short strong arms so it's right up my alley. My only issue is not getting the arm down, it's weight transfer especially if I have his other arm pinned down by my knee/shin (side control)...I either get the tap or I get bucked off. If it's good enough for Nepao in the cage, it's sure as hell good enough for most people I think. Just saw the video clip on the Americana tip. Amazing...just helped me solve a problem Ive been wondering about.

 

[dr.feelgood]

Beginner move my ass. My coach destroys me with Americana's regularly.

 

[JJ86]

Why are purple belts competing in the intermediate division?

 

[SMillard]

The whole "beginner submissions" thing is a joke in my opinion, if you establish dominant position you have no idea what someone will walk into including the Americana.

Good info on improving the sub from mount.

As far as from side control, don't know if this will help but I've found that if I go into north/south and the person tries to push off your hips or over hook your arms you can pin the arm you want high possibly against their head and go to the opposite side and have the arm available.

 

[DLy]

Why are purple belts competing in the intermediate division?

Some tourneys have purple in the intermediate div since it covers such a large time span.

I've never knocked the americana...I just lost to one in my last tourney. I have long arms and it's a constant threat for me. Thanks for the vid... and as far as finishing from side mount. I stay in tight...drop heavy...and make sure their elbow touches their rib cage while I "frame out." proper technique makes the americana work with very little movement.

 

[tbonejackson]

I have heard that Pedro Sauer will submit his black belts with an Americana every time he rolls with them just to make the point of how important and effective the basics are.

 

[Samurai Jack]

Beginner move my ass. My coach destroys me with Americana's regularly.

TS probably meant that beginner is the one that gets caught with it..

 

[birdbones]

That's how Ryron teaches it at the academy. We drill it often!

 

[mesa]

Ryron says at 2:25 that "you never want to be sitting up, you always want to be low in the mount." Saulo says the opposite, that if you have a high mount, you want your weight to be back on their hips.

Sorry for the off topic!!

 

[Hip Bump]

Ryron says at 2:25 that "you never want to be sitting up, you always want to be low in the mount." Saulo says the opposite, that if you have a high mount, you want your weight to be back on their hips.

Sorry for the off topic!!

Are u trying to start an epic E-war of Saulo Fans versus Ryron Fans?! I for some reason would support Saulo in this battle for Sherdog Supremacy.

 

[mesa]

Are u trying to start an epic E-war of Saulo Fans versus Ryron Fans?! I for some reason would support Saulo in this battle for Sherdog Supremacy.

Haha sorry, didn't mean to do that or get too off topic. I did think that's a pretty big different in fundamental philosophy though on which one is better technically.

Perhaps he said this because the Americana would be more effective from a low mount and the potentially to get bumped off while applying it from a high mount would be difficult for your base. However, he did say you "ALWAYS" want to be low on your opponent in mount.

 

[krellik]

Any sub that you can hit like that with such a small chance of loosing position is a good sub in my book. I mean you know they will buck will you go for it so you await the buck, make sure it dont bother your position and then you imediately sinch it in...

Position before submission eh..

 

[Spoonman7]

the americana is just as diverse as the kimura, it is one of my go-to moves and have caught high level guys with it on occassion, for me it is about the pressure from the position you are in that will determine the lock, i land it from mount quite often, against high belts as well. i do feel that certain moves will work better for certain body types and the americana works quite well for me and my type.

 

[ijustwannasurf]

Ryron says at 2:25 that "you never want to be sitting up, you always want to be low in the mount." Saulo says the opposite, that if you have a high mount, you want your weight to be back on their hips.

Sorry for the off topic!!

Hahaha isn't that exactly the same thing?
Low in the mount and heavy on their hips sounds pretty congruent to me

 

[Drew Foster]

Why are purple belts competing in the intermediate division?

I ment advanced no-gi

 

[Drew Foster]

Ryron says at 2:25 that "you never want to be sitting up, you always want to be low in the mount." Saulo says the opposite, that if you have a high mount, you want your weight to be back on their hips.

Sorry for the off topic!!

I think Ryron meant to be low in the moun for this partcular submission.

 

[Drew Foster]

Thanks fellas. Glad to see the Kimura isn't the only popular figure-four armlock in school. Even thugh I still say it's a little more versatile.

Me and DarceBrabo were having a conversation about how many Black Belts think the Kimura and Americana are actually more dangerous than heelhooks. Sure, they don't come on as fast and you feel pain first. Also knee injuries can be the worst, but a heelhook will tear tendonds and ligaments, whereas shoulder locks will tear those as well as break/dislocate bones. Not trying to start an argument here. I'm sure some people's opinions on that differ. I've seen a reverse heelhook break a shinbone in half before.

 

[Sloth]

That was an awesome detail that Ryron Gracie mentioned about hooking with the one leg and basing out with the other, I'm looking forward to giving that a shot!

I don't finish the americana often, especially from mount but I've been working on improving my skills with it for a while. I think like anything else, it can work against good guys if you are good at it.

 

[krellik]

You propably get more warning with the shoulderlocks than the heelhook...

Also if you bust someones shoulder it will suck but you still have another arm to work with. If your loading sandbags for a living or such it will be really bad but for many it will be manageable. Bust someones knee up and they cant even walk, that interferes with just about everything and sucks worse.