Teep/ front knee kick debate.

[Steroids**]

 

[Davemeddlehed]

A kneebar give you time to tap. It isn't the same.

Kneebars also end fights. Front kicks to the knee has yet to do that.

 

[Davemeddlehed]

You can't tap to get out of a kick. It happens too fast. I don't think that argument holds water.

Front kicks to the knee haven't ended a single major promotional fight that I've ever seen/heard of. The argument that they are ultra dangerous doesn't hold water.

 

[BisexualMMA]

Front kicks to the knee haven't ended a single major promotional fight that I've ever seen/heard of. The argument that they are ultra dangerous doesn't hold water.

I didn't say that they have been demonstrated with results to be ultra-dangerous.

I said that kneebars and kicks to the knee aren't comparable because one lacks the opportunity to tap.

I know that we haven't seen major fights ended with knee kicks, but at the same time, common sense tells us what the outcome might be.

 

[screaminleeman]

Not imperfect, rather, wrong. Just thought if you're going to open a discussion on the topic you'd want to get it right.

Can you tell me more about the spinning oblique kick?

Dude, the tread title (FRONT KNEE KICK DEBATE) I did not even edit as a result of your hair splitting. I don't give a crap what term you apply, as you are splitting hairs, and you know it.

From your encyclopedia of combat sport terminology, what the FUCK is spinning kicks that Andy Hug used on his opponents? Don't like Teep, or spinning Oblique?

Why don't you edumacate us then.

It is a GOD DAMN front knee kick ticky-tac!

 

[Peteyandjia]

The guy going flying has made an egregious footwork error. The same one that cost Anderson his consciousness in his first Weidman fight. Flat-footed and parallel.

I notice a lot of the guys who are really good at the teep often time their opponents for those moments.

 

[dim_]

Just to clarify, the 'Teep' or 'Front Kick' is this, and it's fine:

You guys are talking about the 'Oblique Kick' as Joe Rogan calls it, which has a turned angle on it, and is a different kick.

yeh, thats notwhat im referring to ... im talking about the front kick to the knee

 

[TallGHunter]

Dude, the tread title (FRONT KNEE KICK DEBATE) I did not even edit as a result of your hair splitting. I don't give a crap what term you apply, as you are splitting hairs, and you know it.

From your encyclopedia of combat sport terminology, what the FUCK is spinning kicks that Andy Hug used on his opponents? Don't like Teep, or spinning Oblique?

Why don't you edumacate us then.

It is a GOD DAMN front knee kick ticky-tac!

Educate you? Don't you find yourself rather resistive toany attempt to inform (you)? And where did "us" come from; security in numbers? Anyway, it's not splitting hairs, just two different techniques. A teep kick is more of a push kick designed to give you room/move your opponent off.

 

[Peteyandjia]

yeh, thats notwhat im referring to ... im talking about the front kick to the knee

It could be considered semantics, or nit-picking, so not a big deal, I'm just saying that the teep or 'front kick' is the one I'm dropping gifs of... and it's different in its mechanics than the oblique kick (the knee kick).

The oblique kick has a turned angle on it, and a bit of a stomp to it. A front kick is thrown straight up the middle.

Even Winklejon & crew don't call it a 'front kick', they call it a 'push kick to the knee'.

Personally I just go with 'oblique kick', since that has been pretty universally popularized, and everybody knows what it is at this point.

 

[screaminleeman]

Educate you? Don't you find yourself rather resistive toany attempt to inform (you)? And where did "us" come from; security in numbers? Anyway, it's not splitting hairs, just two different techniques. A teep kick is more of a push kick designed to give you room/move your opponent off.

Again any technique that is applied to the front of the knee and designed to push the joint backward 180 degrees against the natural bend of the knee IS the topic that my thread is discussing. That is what a "/" after "teep kick" in the original thread title qualified this exact point.

Any and all techniques that can produce this misdirection of the knee joint is what we are discussing. I was also under the impression that a Teep kick was also not directed at the knee itself, but to the front of the thigh just above the knee.

Again it is the direction of the force to the front of the knee joint potentially resulting in the hyper extension of the knee that we are discussing. I am not disagreeing that there are techniques outside of the teep that produce this type of hyper extension, and all qualify for this discussion.

It soulds like you are dismissing the Teep from this discussion due to it requiring the fighter being struck to have their own forward body motion contribute to this potential type of hyper extension to do the damage as opposed to the entire potential damage coming from the strike in and of itself.

I am not sure that the spinning knee attack(s) that Andy Hug performed even have a "term" associated with them, but to say they don't exist because I can't "name" them is a poor argument IMO at best.

 

[TallGHunter]

Again any technique that is applied to the front of the knee and designed to push the joint backward 180 degrees against the natural bend of the knee IS the topic that my thread is discussing. That is what a "/" after "teep kick" in the original thread title qualified this exact point.

Any and all techniques that can produce this misdirection of the knee joint is what we are discussing. I was also under the impression that a Teep kick was also not directed at the knee itself, but to the front of the thigh just above the knee.

Again it is the direction of the force to the front of the knee joint potentially resulting in the hyper extension of the knee that we are discussing. I am not disagreeing that there are techniques outside of the teep that produce this type of hyper extension, and all qualify for this discussion.

It soulds like you are dismissing the Teep from this discussion due to it requiring the fighter being struck to have their own forward body motion contribute to this potential type of hyper extension to do the damage as opposed to the entire potential damage coming from the strike in and of itself.

I am not sure that the spinning knee attack(s) that Andy Hug performed even have a "term" associated with them, but to say they don't exist because I can't "name" them is a poor argument IMO at best.

I've hurt your feelings haven't I? Would you feel better if I told you I don't really care if you know one kick from another? And teeps are usually directed at the midsection, larger target, and produces more of the desired effect.

 

[screaminleeman]

I've hurt your feelings haven't I? Would you feel better if I told you I don't really care if you know one kick from another? And teeps are usually directed at the midsection, larger target, and produces more of the desired effect.

Thanks, much better now. All is good.

 

[clumseygenius]

FUCKING LAUGHABLE.

One knockout. ONE. If you experience a k.o, clean or even a flash it is a given that the lasting effects (mostly unseen or under reported) are gargantuan in comparison to a fucking knee hyper extension. You're watching the wrong sport you bunch of pussies. Go and play Pokemen Go.

Easy son.

 

[clumseygenius]

Please do not watch any old Andy Hug fights. I will admit to cringing in one K-1 Mike Bernardo (R.I.P.) fight where this technique blew his knee out (KO!). Ouch.

I can EASILY name half a dozen checked leg kicks that made me cringe 100x worse than this from leg injuries.

Watching the Pancrase fight where a fighter with shin guards on has his leg kick is checked by Bas Rutten causing his opponents leg to wrap around like it was Mt. Fantastic of the Fantastic Four!

Spider against Weidman? Corey Hill?

Those almost made me puke. Still I do not think that "checking" a kick (that has done 1,000's of time the damage that Teeps have done) should be banned. I don't disagree that it is gruesome on the extreme rare occasion that it is executed perfectly. It simply is not in the realm of causing damage to legs in striking combat sports the way checks have done!

Fucking nasty; seen that Bas one yeah. Also the Spider, Hill and most other MMA ones. Can't watch the replay's though. Same as knee fuck ups in most other sports. I jump when seeing them myself still.

 

[screaminleeman]

Fucking nasty; seen that Bas one yeah. Also the Spider, Hill and most other MMA ones. Can't watch the replay's though. Same as knee fuck ups in most other sports. I jump when seeing them myself still.

That is a huge part of the problem. They are largely ineffective due to not being cleanly landed, but on the extreme rare occasion that they do, they are incredibly graphic and difficult to stomach. It is kind of the same when I see accidental groin strikes. It makes me cringe every time.

Well, I admit to being able to endure the Joe Son ones for "other reasons" of course.

 

[Blayt7hh]

Matt Mitrione filled an appeal with the Massachusetts State Athletic Commission over his fight against Travis where the referee warned MATT over attacking Travis fingers with his eye sockets.

http://www.mass-mma.com/2016/04/18/bad-rap-mass-state-athletic-commission-under-fire-series-1/

They hired Greg Coleman (an MMA promoter that dropped his active role so he could legally officiate an MMA fight) with so little MMA officiating experience that he HONESTLY warned Matt about attacking Travis's fingers with his eye socket.

The F-hole brass of the MASAC (ALL OF WHICH DESPERATELY NEED TO BE FOUND swimming in concrete flippers) heard the appeal and 100% unanimously agreed to defend their F-hole ball-boy turned referee!

Did you honestly miss this? Eveil guy cheating using that damn eye socket to attack poor Travis' finger tips!

Oh yeah I actually forgot about that. Still my point stands no one likes Browne anyways

 

[sapporo ichiban]

As I said, obviously there is an intent to hurt the opponent, thats the point, but I think theres a line between intent to hurt and intent to cause potentially lasting damage.


I see it a bit like a two footed tackle in soccer.

A single footed tackle is an attempt to get the ball, a two footed tackle is also an attempt to get the ball, but there is also a likelehood of serious long term injury. I think its where it becomes "malicious" i have an issue.

I see your point. At the same time cut kicking the side of the knee joint is just as bad. I don't see them outlawing either technique any time soon. Fighters are just going to have to not stand stright legged in from of opponents, which they don't which is why you don't see rampant injuries as a result.

Splitting hairs about malicious is a tough one. Everything they do is with intent to cause injury, thats kind of the point to make your opponent quit or stop them out right. This technique is not really meant to destroy the knee but rather break up timing and footwork, stopping an advance etc. I don't know that there is a valid record of injury enough so that this technique will be looked at as bannable unless the appearance of the technique to some regulators is enough.

I kickboxed for 5 years, I recieved many leg kicks in different forms, these among them. You are not supposed to directly target the knee although it happens, I think we should look at whether there is effort being put into going after the knee joint or whether its near but not directly on the knee. I am not familiar with mma rules but there must be some info on this somewhere. If there is maybe it reflects this just as kickboxing does. If the contact is just above or below its legal in kickboxing. I wonder just what they are instructing their fighters at Jackson? I don't think Jones gives a shit about anyone but himself, I don't get the same feeling from Holly.

 

[gevoudane]

I know it might look dangerous, but through the whole history of combat sports you will not find to many examples to show that it really is dangerous. The thing is it looks dangerous and bad, but look at what happened to Cyborg when he fought MVP. A knee crushed his skull, but no one is crying over flying knees and there have been more injuries from the knee than there have been kicks to the knee.

 

[sapporo ichiban]

FUCKING LAUGHABLE.

One knockout. ONE. If you experience a k.o, clean or even a flash it is a given that the lasting effects (mostly unseen or under reported) are gargantuan in comparison to a fucking knee hyper extension. You're watching the wrong sport you bunch of pussies. Go and play Pokemen Go.

You may have just won the debate by k.o.

 

[Caicara]

If you can kneebar someone you should be able to kick their knee in my opinion.

Nice logic. You can't punch someone's throat