Talented Fighters are Lazy

Yeah, I didn't read that wall, but it's not so simple that he just is lazy. We don't know why Eric has issues with gas (and apparently, neither does he), and it can stem from a multitude of reasons; bad weight cut, adrenaline dump, lack of the right kind of training, bad genes for cardio, etc. He might have trained properly and thought he was ready, but a fight is not training. Some people naturally swim when the lights go on, others sink.
 
devilrojo145 said:
Well, Talent, do you work hard?? :D
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Hard enough. I mean, losing builds character and plenty of people lack character. I'll gladly help someone else grow as a person.
 
devilrojo145 said:
You must have never wrestled... or trained in general....

Chael BUSTS HIS ASS and wins workman like decisions.

Go become the caliber wrestler/fighter that Chael is and tell me how little hard work it takes....

BJ is notoriously lazy though, but that comes with natural gifts and the power of affluence....
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Poor assumption on my life based on butthurtness.

Grinding stuff out doesn't improve your skill set, if it does then Chael would be very technical but he isn't.
 
koquerelle said:
Tell that to A. Silva, GSP, Cain, etc...

Ridiculous statement.
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Your first grade education is showing. It amazes me that a few paragraphs are too much to read, how slow does Sherdog read that they just read the title and comment?
 
Barbadosdaluta said:
Your first grade education is showing. It amazes me that a few paragraphs are too much to read, how slow does Sherdog read that they just read the title and comment?
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You don't outright that Erick Silva is more physically talented than guys like GSP and Cain, but it's implied. It's ridiculous. Do an interview with Cain and ask him if he feels that physically, he isn't at the top of his field. Ask the same question to GSP. I'm sure they'll find you very smart. Will you resort to name calling if they don't agree with you?

Look at your description of Diaz. It's completely crazy. "he got the short end of the stick." The guy's cardio is just completely insane and that's not just hard work. I was training like a madman in college and there were guys on my team that had better cardio than me and no matter how hard I trained, they would always have better cardio. Isn't that a physical gift?
 
koquerelle said:
You don't outright that Erick Silva is more physically talented than guys like GSP and Cain, but it's implied. It's ridiculous. Do an interview with Cain and ask him if he feels that physically, he isn't at the top of his field. Ask the same question to GSP. I'm sure they'll find you very smart. Will you resort to name calling if they don't agree with you?

Look at your description of Diaz. It's completely crazy. "he got the short end of the stick." The guy's cardio is just completely insane and that's not just hard work. I was training like a madman in college and there were guys on my team that had better cardio than me and no matter how hard I trained, they would always have better cardio. Isn't that a physical gift?
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Your first grade education is also showing, I included Cain and GSP in talented AND hardworking. You also didn't read the full thread, or you did and just lack reading comprehension.
 
Kneeuinthenutz said:
Nick Diaz is anything but lazy. He works harder than virtually everyone in MMA.
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he works hard when it's in his comfort zone

You ask him to do a 10 mile run, he'll do it without question. Box 5 rounds? He'll be happy to. Roll with high level BJJ practicioners? not a problem.

But work on his TDD and wrestling? Work on his strength? Leave his camp which clearly isn't doing enough for him? He simply won't do it, he doesn't like to. Work his striking defence? No, he's happy to just rely on his chin

Hell, Diaz isn't even hard working in respects to getting a title shot. He was given a title shot after beating Penn (which, admittedly, he deserved), then was too lazy to even bother showing up to the promotions and lost his shot. Then got an interim fight with Condit, did what he needed too, lost, fine whatever. Then, after a long stretch of inactivity, he is gifted a title shot. He did nothing to work for it, he talked some smack and got it. Then after losing that, he (surprise surprise) attempts to get himself another title shot. Demanding no less than another title shot, despite having not won a fight in two and a half years. He was totally unwilling to get in the cage with another top ten fighter (because he knows the UFC would bend over backwards to give him a title shot) just because he didn't feel like it. That's not a work ethic.
 
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while we're at it, we have to dispel this notion that most MMA fighters aren't talented

yes, there are some fighters like JBJ, BJ, etc... who are just naturally more talented than others, but the reality is that, if you are a professional athlete, you have to have some form of talent or athleticism
 
ironfist05 said:
while we're at it, we have to dispel this notion that most MMA fighters aren't talented

yes, there are some fighters like JBJ, BJ, etc... who are just naturally more talented than others, but the reality is that, if you are a professional athlete, you have to have some form of talent or athleticism
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Of course, I whole heartedly agree with this statement, I meant it in a relative way, as in talent between MMA fighters, as you're 100% correct that anyone who is a pro especially in the UFC is a talented fighter.
 
TmacRmac said:
Poor assumption on my life based on butthurtness.

Grinding stuff out doesn't improve your skill set, if it does then Chael would be very technical but he isn't.
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Poor assumptions on Chael Sonnen based on an anti-wrestling butthurtness.

Chael is very technical in several aspects of the game ESPECIALLY the wrestling.
To say he is not is disrespectful to the likes of those who, impressively, managed to beat him.

Beyond that, grinding takes and builds heart and character, two things that don't translate to lazy technique.
 
all them alpha male guys are physically gifted (besides being short) and hardworking.
 
TheRassler said:
you're right, gsp is too lazy to finish guys.

he didn't used to be this lazy at all.
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Or maybe he just didn't have the talent to finish guys.

Pete Rose hit a lot of singles in baseball, but very few home runs. If he'd tried to be a home run hitter he wouldn't even have lasted a year in MLB.

Or look at Floyd Mayweather. How well do you think he'd do if he was going for the KO in his fights?

GSP is very good at some things (his takedowns and top control), not so good at other things (his submissions and his punching power). I think its much more likely that he was incapable of finishing than that he didn't want to finish.
 
There are plenty of examples a extremely talented guys that work very hard. GSP, Cain, Jon Jones.
It is just a misconception that gets thrown around in every sport. There are always a few guys that are talented that don't seem to work very hard. There are also many guys that are not exceptionally talented and they also do not work as hard as they should.

Also Erick Silva is not the strongest fighter in the division.
 
Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.
 
talent + work = jones
talent + no work = bj
no talent + work = diaz


(im not saying diaz isnt talented or that bj never worked hard, if you dont understand what im trying to say with this post i wont bother trying to explain it any further to you)
 
A good statement by TS, which leads to a good discussion.

I also believe that mental strength is just as important as training the physical parts of your body.
As your examples of Erick Silva and BJ Penn, 2 confident fighters who look like world beaters when they have their way.
BJ looked fantastic in his title reign at 155, Erick Silva still dropped Matt Brown and took his back at the start and has looked tremendous in his first UFC fights.

But when these things or fast finishes happen, imo it's easier to become less stronger mentally. For example, look what Matt Brown went through during his life. He died at one point in his life, good luck trrying to break him.
When the going gets tough you need to find a way to win.
Mark Hunt and Bigfoot aren't really known for their cardio but both were pushing through right till the end.
Or Hyun Gyun Lim who went supersaiyan after getting outclassed for 5 rounds, he didn't break at all while he could give up due to the low kicks that he took.

I don't remember Erick Silva or BJ Penn winning fights that went back and forth.

So I think it's more mental strength than physical attributes.
 
Keep it clean and make sure this doesn't devolve into fighter bashing guys....
 
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