Subs/moves you're afraid to use?

[Bathwater]

I let go of belly down armbars a lot. I like catching armbars in transitions and end up there a decent amount, but I'm pretty hesitant to finish sometimes. Oddly enough, I have no problems with heel hooks. Been injured with one once, but it didn't taint my perception of them.

 

[Young Turkey]

One of my first nagas, I saw an elbow explode and a forearm break in two separate matches from americanas. Scared me away from them, probably for the best

I know I personally have no tolerance to key locks. Sometimes I'll catch a newer guy in one and I'll start to crank and when they're not tapping I get confused but I'm too scared to keep torquing

 

[KnightTemplar]

It is all dependent on who I am rolling with. The white belts have this thing where they would rather get injured and sit out for 6 months to a year than tap. So, I wouldn't say that I hold back subs, but I do play catch and release on them. Things like inverted heel hooks and toe holds I'll hold for a couple seconds and let them out.

I've never understood that mentality. I've literally just started BJJ, and I know I am free lunch for just about everybody in the Academy. It's a rare Roll when I don't get Tapped at least once. And I don't have a problem with that. I leave my ego at the door. There is no way I'd risk getting injured because I was too proud to Tap.

I look forward to the day, far in the future, when I actually have to worry about hurting other people!:icon_chee

 

[yetanother]

I'm afraid to jump closed guard in training for fear of injuring someones knees.

 

[Steve08]

Heel hook, at least right now. Don't have enough control to go for that during hard sparring, stuff can go wrong when people are moving fast while their knee is being cranked...

Otherwise... nothing! I want to try and catch submissions from every position. I usually try to armbar from the back when the RNC isn't happening, and often just get reversed, but oh well, still learning, haha.

I was afraid to pull guard for a while for fear of injuring my manliness, but I hate being bad at the guard so I've been starting with it whenever possible recently.

 

[DoMn8]

I've never understood that mentality. I've literally just started BJJ, and I know I am free lunch for just about everybody in the Academy. It's a rare Roll when I don't get Tapped at least once. And I don't have a problem with that. I leave my ego at the door. There is no way I'd risk getting injured because I was too proud to Tap.

I look forward to the day, far in the future, when I actually have to worry about hurting other people!:icon_chee

I think some of this comes with experience, although you seem to have the right attitude from the start. For me it took some experience to recognise when i was actually in danger, and to know the limits of my body. This meant a few tweaked limbs.

For this reason I think there is a reponsilbity for the more experienced to make up for the lack of awareness of the less experienced and sometimes give way to their ego/spazziness, and recognise they might not know that flailing the wrong way in sub might injure them.

 

[Steve08]

I know I personally have no tolerance to key locks. Sometimes I'll catch a newer guy in one and I'll start to crank and when they're not tapping I get confused but I'm too scared to keep torquing

In an instance like that, I think it is ok to go Semi Palhares.

But you NEVER go Full Palhares.

I will never heel hook anyone, and avoid most leg locks since they always leave your own exposed as well.

To claim this requires a lack of understanding of leg locks.

 

[KnightTemplar]

I think some of this comes with experience, although you seem to have the right attitude from the start. For me it took some experience to recognise when i was actually in danger, and to know the limits of my body. This meant a few tweaked limbs.

For this reason I think there is a reponsilbity for the more experienced to make up for the lack of awareness of the less experienced and sometimes give way to their ego/spazziness, and recognise they might not know that flailing the wrong way in sub might injure them.

It's probably because I've had enough joint sprains and strained muscles from activities outside of BJJ that I have a very healthy respect for any technique that targets my elbows, knees etc. Obviously if someone is going for a Lock I will try to break free of it. But once I feel it's at the point of no return, I will Tap. Especially Leg Locks. I don't know if it's true, but I've read that because there are relatively few nerve endings around that area, by the time you feel significant pain you are already injured. So I always err on the side of caution.

Strangles and Chokes are slightly different. I will try to fight a Strangle, since I have slightly longer to do so than with a Choke. If someone catches me in an RNC, I tap almost immediately. No point in getting Choked Out for the sake of "pride".

 

[Badger67]

One of my first nagas, I saw an elbow explode and a forearm break in two separate matches from americanas. Scared me away from them, probably for the best

My first sub grappling tournament i broke a guys elbow from top half guard deep americana. The scream was unlike anything i've heard since Shamrock's heel hook on whats his name.

 

[Badger67]

It's probably because I've had enough joint sprains and strained muscles from activities outside of BJJ that I have a very healthy respect for any technique that targets my elbows, knees etc. Obviously if someone is going for a Lock I will try to break free of it. But once I feel it's at the point of no return, I will Tap. Especially Leg Locks. I don't know if it's true, but I've read that because there are relatively few nerve endings around that area, by the time you feel significant pain you are already injured. So I always err on the side of caution.

Strangles and Chokes are slightly different. I will try to fight a Strangle, since I have slightly longer to do so than with a Choke. If someone catches me in an RNC, I tap almost immediately. No point in getting Choked Out for the sake of "pride".

I would argue it's more so the musculature surrounding the joint is very strong so by the time the force required to separate it occurs its too late; there is no halfway point of end feel. This occurs when submissions target ligaments and tendons vs bones or joints specifically; in an armbar the olecranon process extends further into the elecranon fossa, creating a bony end feel and then snap. In a heel hook as an example, you are stretching ligaments which your body does not have the capability of automatically understanding it's end ROM in the same way, so you think you have more room until...

 

[Shizzx]

i use to do GOgoplata but ended up putting two people to sleep and them falling on top of me dislocating my knee.. i stopped that crap..

 

[dmwalking]

I know I personally have no tolerance to key locks. Sometimes I'll catch a newer guy in one and I'll start to crank and when they're not tapping I get confused but I'm too scared to keep torquing

I'm just guessing, but I think it might be your technique. A good americana barely needs any movement to get the tap. Even if you don't "rev" the wrist, a tight americana barely needs more than two inches of movement to get the tap.

I have the feeling that a lot of schools teach the 1993 americana.

 

[Badger67]

I'm quite good with my americana's.
Americana: bring elbow to hip before torquing the elbow to the sky. 2-3 inches and he will be tapping unless he has the most loose rotator cuff.

 

[dmwalking]

I would argue it's more so the musculature surrounding the joint is very strong so by the time the force required to separate it occurs its too late; there is no halfway point of end feel. This occurs when submissions target ligaments and tendons vs bones or joints specifically; in an armbar the olecranon process extends further into the elecranon fossa, creating a bony end feel and then snap. In a heel hook as an example, you are stretching ligaments which your body does not have the capability of automatically understanding it's end ROM in the same way, so you think you have more room until...

Sounds about right. There's a short window where it goes from tapping pain to injury. When attacking legs, control is absolutely the highest priority if you care about partner safety. Doesn't matter if you're doing heel hooks or straight foot locks.

 

[dmwalking]

I'm quite good with my americana's.
Americana: bring elbow to hip before torquing the elbow to the sky. 2-3 inches and he will be tapping unless he has the most loose rotator cuff.

Yeah that's a good angle. I like to "rev" the wrist first, but that's not always possible. But the way I finish is to keep their wrist close to their shoulder and instead of pulling the elbow up to the sky, I try to arc their elbow over their ribcage toward their diaphragm. I mean, it never gets there because the control is so tight, but the motion is murderous.

 

[Badger67]

^ i agree, that's why i didn't add that part; it never gets there unless you tear it off lol.
I have a hard time revving the wrist on bigger guys so i opt to bring the elbow to the hip then paint the mat etc. Keeping the wrist nearest shoulder/upper arm is good for control because it prevents them from extending and twisting the forearm to loosen the grip.

 

[Shemhazai]

I really like the baratoplata, but sometimes I'm a little scared to apply it fully on people who don't recognize the position. Especially from top, it's fucking brutal.

 

[KnightTemplar]

I would argue it's more so the musculature surrounding the joint is very strong so by the time the force required to separate it occurs its too late; there is no halfway point of end feel. This occurs when submissions target ligaments and tendons vs bones or joints specifically; in an armbar the olecranon process extends further into the elecranon fossa, creating a bony end feel and then snap. In a heel hook as an example, you are stretching ligaments which your body does not have the capability of automatically understanding it's end ROM in the same way, so you think you have more room until...

Could be, man. Whatever the reason, I take zero risk with Leg Locks/Heel Hooks.

 

[Badger67]

I've had good success training them with a catch and release for 2-3s holds. If you don't get out in that time, it's considered ripped off and a victory for the other. Nobody at our club has been hurt from this, though it is restricted to "well trained" blue's, and purple's and up, pro mma fighters.

 

[VonHalen]

Any leg locks.