Squat sticking point

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by apizur**, Oct 12, 2013.

  1. apizur**

    apizur** Aggressive Finesse.

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    I've noticed I rock a bit forward onto my toes when I'm doing parallels. I will say, as I've kept my weight back more so lately, and tried to "squeeze" the weight back up, I hit this major sticking point about 30% of the way back up. When I pass it, it feels like the weight is back on my quads and its smooth sailing from there. If I let my weight spill a tiny bit forward onto my toes, the squat is much easier. I know easier is not always better.

    I will be glad to provide a form vid at weight if need be, but wondered if anyone had this exact trouble outright.
     
  2. Oblivian

    Oblivian Aging Platinum Member

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    I'm having trouble following your post. I understand up until you talk about letting the weight spill forward. Are you saying that you don't hit that sticking point if you let your weight transfer to your toes?
     
  3. apizur**

    apizur** Aggressive Finesse.

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    Yes. It's a very slight transfer.
     
  4. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    This is just a guess without seeing video, but it sounds like what's happening is that weights coming forward, and you're GMing the weight up. I'd also guess that your knees come in when this happens.

    I've had a similar issue, and I'll probably always end up GMing a bit with near max weights. But what's made a difference for me is really focusing on driving the knees out, (although I find the "Spread the floor" cue works better than thinking about my knees), pause squats (practicing the same cue), and a little bit of band abductor work. With the majority of squat work done where the challenge isn't completing the rep, but completing the rep without too much technical breakdown.

    You'd want to make sure that you're keeping your upper back tight too.

    The above is just a guess based on what you're describing. Maybe I'm understanding correctly, and what I said will help. Or maybe it's useless and can be disregarded entirely.
     
  5. Eric Brown

    Eric Brown Crusty old bastard

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    A simple trick to avoid shifting forward onto your toes is to keep your toes curled up against the tops of your shoes. Sounds stupid, but this post is 100% serious.
     
  6. apizur**

    apizur** Aggressive Finesse.

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    I'm gonna try to reverse toe curl and spread the floor. If it persists, I'll follow up with a video.
     
  7. 3 dimensional

    3 dimensional Banned Banned

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    take a video ... oddly enough, i recently developed this issue. might be due to bar placement being too high for your squat mechanics... i.e.) bar is tracking over your toes. this is my issue...

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Rexual Chocolate

    Rexual Chocolate It's Rexual, baby Platinum Member

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    I've been putting weight on my toes and have been getting knee pain. I figured out it was because I wasn't on my heels, but I still had trouble with it. I used your trick today and my squats felt awesome. You're the man.
     
  9. NurseKnuckles

    NurseKnuckles My Mom's stronger than you belt

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    This.

    Nice and simple. I used this cue and it has helped immensely.
     
  10. Oblivian

    Oblivian Aging Platinum Member

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    You could be losing upper back tightness and it's causing you to collapse forward. If it's not that, your hips are probably rising too fast. There are several cues to fix it - the toes up as mentioned, leading out of the hole with your upper body, pretending you are trying to throw the weight backwards, quit thinking of squats as an up and down movement and more of a push the weight backwards movement, look at the squat as a battle of not collapsing forward, etc.
     
  11. redaxe

    redaxe Silver Belt

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    Yeah, the photo on the right looks like someone trying to high bar squat with low bar cues.
     
  12. Eric Brown

    Eric Brown Crusty old bastard

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    Glad it helped. No idea who I learned it from, but happy to pass it on.
     
  13. NurseKnuckles

    NurseKnuckles My Mom's stronger than you belt

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    When I first used it I had to adjust the bar placement too. It sort of fell into position as I tightened my upper back. But its an easy cue for new lifters.
     
  14. Fedorgasm

    Fedorgasm Silver Belt

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    This picture confuses me. The left pic looks better, but his knees are way past his toes which I was always told is a big no-no. I squat more like the guy on the right because I'm always concerned about the knee-toe issue. Is that bad?
     
  15. toonie

    toonie Tuesday

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    Both squats are fine.
     
  16. redaxe

    redaxe Silver Belt

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    Left is a proper high bar squat. Knees past the toes is fine despite what your personal trainer tells you. You just don't want your weight forward on your toes.

    Right pic is an improperly performed squat, it's high bar position with low bar cues. The bar is too far forward over the foot. When you sit back into a squat that way you want to be carrying the bar a couple inches lower on your back--on your rear delts not on your traps. That way the bar stays over the middle of your foot.
     
  17. toonie

    toonie Tuesday

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    I thought the picture on the right looked okay. The bar is definitely not in a high bar position like it is in the left picture. I agree that he could have the bar a bit lower.
     
  18. apizur**

    apizur** Aggressive Finesse.

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    Alright, I didn't take a vid because I was trying to help a newbie hit some snatches. Spreading the floor helped me generate a little more power, and keeping my toes up helped marginally. I wasn't so far on my toes I needed them, but I was still a little shifty to the balls of my feet.

    I know this is tough without a pic/vid... so I will try to sneak over to the gym mid-week and grab one, I normally only lift on Saturdays.

    P.S. My sticking point is the first 10 to 30%... am I just supposed to struggle when I'm in the hole?
     
  19. Oblivian

    Oblivian Aging Platinum Member

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    Most people struggle out of the hole, but you shouldn't be struggling hard at submaximal weights. Your hips are probably rising too fast which bends you over into a good morning position and gets the bar out in front of you. You probably push your hips forward to get back under the bar and transfer to your toes. It feels like it's good because you are getting through the sticking point by getting back under the bar that is in front of you, but trust me, it's inefficient. Most people that have that issue make the squat look like a 3-4 section lift. The descent, the initial hip rise out of the hole, the bent over position getting the weight out in front, and then the weird good morning with weight on your toes to recover.

    I didn't proof that, so hopefully it's coherent.
     
  20. apizur**

    apizur** Aggressive Finesse.

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    It is my 6 rep max... which is what I'm going for over 3 sets. Truth be told I'm only hitting about 5 atm.

    So it's kinda like I'm GMing it until I can get my legs into a more powerful ROM?

    I'll vid it. Probably Wednesday.
     

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