sparring with world class takwondo guy?

[igoraba]

Guy Mezger landed some lightning fast kicks to the face of Liddel but Liddel knocked out Guy with one punch.


similar weight class + similar training = boxing's better

 

[lucid]

Originally posted by lucid


hey BBN the olympic trail are on, how about you walk in and KO the whole fucking team.

if not...then shut up.

eh hem.. you deeking this? or what?

i'm sure your not above an olympic medal and representing your country are you?

you could shut us all up with a spot on the team.

and no MT and TKD high kicks are different. but i'll let the others argue that.

and i wont even get into KO's by head kicks...

 

[Os3y3ris]

"i know how to chamber roundkick and i don't get the same power as i do w/ a MT one. the power of the MT roundkick comes from the hip muscles of inner thigh and waist. when u do a chamber roundkick, these powerful muscles can't contribute as much b/c of the angle u set urself up to, and that's why i don't think they are as powerful. remember i'm talking about a BODY and leg kick. the high kicks are almost similar enough that they can easily be adjusted."

I agree that the basic chambered roundhouse of TKD is not as strong as a thai roundkick, but opening the hip, raising a chamber, pivoting and then chopping downwards or across with the leg turned over does a good deal of damage.

 

[BlackBeltNow]

Originally posted by lucid
eh hem.. you deeking this? or what?

i'm sure your not above an olympic medal and representing your country are you?

you could shut us all up with a spot on the team.

and no MT and TKD high kicks are different. but i'll let the others argue that.

and i wont even get into KO's by head kicks...

i dont' consider myself a kickboxer--i never sparred except for MMA meaning if i see a strike coming i counter w/ grappling. i don't consider my friend a kickboxer as well (he's an MMAer) but i know he can KO who you dont' think a semi-kickboxer can. I'm veerrry sure. REason is people better than him toy w/ TMAers all the time. kickboxers know more than you think. some are able to block everything you throw at them; TKD strategies are not the same as MT. TKD is aimed at hitting key targets and to do this they aim for quantity not quality, while MT is aimed at quality not quanitiy. this also makes MTers better at blocking, and almost immune to any primary attack.

in kickboxing, u need to prepare primary, secondary, and tetiary attack before you even throw ur first strike for the moment. each step of the chain expects the person to react a certain way and hope he does so the chain works. TKD guys, mentally, prepare to throw a fury of moves in bursts. they do expect counters, but unlike kickboxers they dont' expect them to hurt so they usually just prepare to bypass the counters (expecting but ignoring them).

 

[True2KungFu]

As for the chambering bbn, i agree about the lowkicks, nobody chambers lowkicks. However i think a chambered roundkick to the body is very effective and very quick as well, kickboxers (not mt) chamber the body roundkicks and they still kick fawking hard. You said yourself you arent a striker, so why are you here disagreeing with people who know more about the aspect than you?
Ive fought in boxing and kickboxing and i chamber my kicks and im still able to whip my hips into them. As long as you stand at a 45 degree stance chambering wont lose any power.

As for your sidekick example, in order to throw that Push-sidekick that kickboxers do you REALLY need to chamber your leg. I have my knee up to my shoulder when i throw that kick.

 

[True2KungFu]

And back to the subject, regardless, if the guy is a national competitor hes gonna know how to kick, and kick fucking hard regardless of how he does it. I sparred a national ranked tkd guy who competeted at about 154 and he kicks FUCKING HARD, i had bigtime bruises on my ribs. I train with a guy who also teaches TKD and he chambers his kicks and they are still very hard, and very fast.

 

[lucid]

So basicly your saying it's not that easy right?

so you can't just walk in and brush off their kicks like superman brushing off bullets and KO the whole fucking team them right?

thats what i thought.

 

[BlackBeltNow]

Originally posted by True2KungFu
As for the chambering bbn, i agree about the lowkicks, nobody chambers lowkicks. However i think a chambered roundkick to the body is very effective and very quick as well, kickboxers (not mt) chamber the body roundkicks and they still kick fawking hard. You said yourself you arent a striker, so why are you here disagreeing with people who know more about the aspect than you?
Ive fought in boxing and kickboxing and i chamber my kicks and im still able to whip my hips into them. As long as you stand at a 45 degree stance chambering wont lose any power.

As for your sidekick example, in order to throw that Push-sidekick that kickboxers do you REALLY need to chamber your leg. I have my knee up to my shoulder when i throw that kick.

no. i kow how to kick bags not people. so i'm knowledgable when talking bout strike vs strike, but i'm NOt knowledgeable when talking about strategy vs strategy. i won't call myself a striker unless i do real sparring and am confident about myself.

the chamber push sidekick i agree. but i don't think that would make the strike-sidekick hurt more.

 

[BlackBeltNow]

Originally posted by lucid
So basicly your saying it's not that easy right?

so you can't just walk in and brush off their kicks like superman brushing off bullets and KO the whole fucking team them right?

thats what i thought.

not NOW i can't. i never even sparred, just kick bags and condition my muscle memory. i know if i get private training maybe in 2 months or 1 if i emphasize on it i can definitely do it unless i have to go against osme 6'4 200lber. i will emphasize on kickboxing (sparring) eventually but i'm putting kickboxing last b/c i'm short and i think i should focus on more appropriate MAs like grappling.

 

[Os3y3ris]

"in kickboxing, u need to prepare primary, secondary, and tetiary attack before you even throw ur first strike for the moment. each step of the chain expects the person to react a certain way and hope he does so the chain works. TKD guys, mentally, prepare to throw a fury of moves in bursts. they do expect counters, but unlike kickboxers they dont' expect them to hurt so they usually just prepare to bypass the counters (expecting but ignoring them)."

I give up.

 

[Gregster]

Originally posted by BlackBeltNow
TKd sidekick: the effective sidekicks in real kickobxing are push kicks. in TKD its a snap kick. a snap sidekick can be countered by closing the distance, and i don't believe they hurt either; if you see it coming you should be able to rush at him w/ no problem.

BBN, every time you opine on TKD fighting you do nothing but flaunt your colossal lack of knowledge on the subject.

Linear kicks in TKD (sidekick, back kick...) thrust into the target, they are not "snapped." Power can't be generated by "snapping" them but with penetration into the target-- that should go without saying. A non-linear kick (front snap, crescent, or roundhouse kick...) is thrown with the intent of connecting sharply at a focused point with maximum technique and speed, and has more of a "snapping" aspect to it.

If you're watching people do poomse (Kata to you karatekas) then yes, they're snapped out to produce a nice theatric-sounding "pop". But that's not fighting, that's all for show.

One of the most effective tools in free-sparring I learned was the paddo-chaggi, a sidekick from the front leg which is only about half-chambered, raised by leaning properly with the hips, and shoved into an advancing opponent. I also used front pushing kicks the same way.

 

[True2KungFu]

Short is no excuse, im a stocky 5'6 standup fighter.

 

[Gregster]

Originally posted by BlackBeltNow
not NOW i can't. i never even sparred, just kick bags and condition my muscle memory. i know if i get private training maybe in 2 months or 1 if i emphasize on it i can definitely do it unless i have to go against osme 6'4 200lber. i will emphasize on kickboxing (sparring) eventually but i'm putting kickboxing last b/c i'm short and i think i should focus on more appropriate MAs like grappling.

*Now* you're saying that with nothing but lots of bagwork and a couple months of training you could go toe-to-toe with a world-class TKD fighter and win?

Verdict: You are absolutely insane.

And the other guy being a 6'4" 200lber should have zippy to do with it if you're that damned good. I'm a 6'3" 200lber who was no punk in the ring, and I've sparred Koreans half my size (including one girl, the South Korean women's champ at the time) and got schooled. Bear in mind, it's an art developed by Koreans, who by and large are prople not known for their generally large physical carriage.

 

[BlackBeltNow]

i'm 5'4...

btw sorry i forgot i keep using the wrong definition snap. by snap i mean anything w/ "strike-ness". so when i said snap sidekick vs push sidekick, i meant basically "strike vs push" not "snap vs chamber vs thrust' ro whatever.

 

[Os3y3ris]

"*Now* you're saying that with nothing but lots of bagwork and a couple months of training you could go toe-to-toe with a world-class TKD fighter and win?

Verdict: You are absolutely insane.

And the other guy being a 6'4" 200lber should have zippy to do with it if you're that damned good. I'm a 6'3" 200lber who was no punk in the ring, and I've sparred Koreans half my size (including one girl, the South Korean women's champ at the time) and got schooled. Bear in mind, it's an art developed by Koreans, who by and large are prople not known for their generally large physical carriage."

LOL. He shoudl head straight to Kukkiwon. After he's cleaned up there, the ITF should just require another month or two of training.

 

[BlackBeltNow]

Originally posted by Gregster
*Now* you're saying that with nothing but lots of bagwork and a couple months of training you could go toe-to-toe with a world-class TKD fighter and win?

Verdict: You are absolutely insane.

And the other guy being a 6'4" 200lber should have zippy to do with it if you're that damned good. I'm a 6'3" 200lber who was no punk in the ring, and I've sparred Koreans half my size (including one girl, the South Korean women's champ at the time) and got schooled. Bear in mind, it's an art developed by Koreans, who by and large are prople not known for their generally large physical carriage.

whats ur martial art? aren't u a TKDer?

 

[Os3y3ris]

He is or was. Its in his profile. He's also right.

 

[Gregster]

Originally posted by BlackBeltNow
whats ur martial art? aren't u a TKDer?

Primarily, yes. I've gotten some training in some other styles, but TKD has been my first/foremost art.

 

[lucid]

Originally posted by BlackBeltNow
not NOW i can't. i never even sparred, just kick bags and condition my muscle memory. i know if i get private training maybe in 2 months or 1 if i emphasize on it i can definitely do it unless i have to go against osme 6'4 200lber. i will emphasize on kickboxing (sparring) eventually but i'm putting kickboxing last b/c i'm short and i think i should focus on more appropriate MAs like grappling.

i'm short too... 5'5"

and i could tell by your posts that you've never sparred or stepped in a ring before in stand up. You can tell by the lack of insights.

i hate flaming people, especially like this. face it, your digitally getting a gang beating by guys who know more then you and have more experience.

but the point is, that althought i don't take something i don't talk shit about it jsut because i don't believe it works. do i like karate? nope. do i think it works? not as well as others. but do i walk up to people to take it and call them them names and tell them i could paste them in seconds? of course not. after all that training they have to have some measure fo skill. i respect that.

it's like what bas said in an interview when he was asked who he respects "i respect anybody who steps in the ring."

not matter what they took they worked very hard to get where they are. you hit bags, while others did drills, sparred and had the courage to step in a ring.

From the out side it's easy to critic others...

but when your in there, gassed and tired and having a guy hunt for your head, or trying to keep that shoulder up so you don't have a round slipped when you least expect it. To sweat and bleed, to work through brusied ribs for your 3 rd fight in one day, to train with broken noses, brused shins and banged up forearms. it's another world.

every body who's here debating with you has paid their dues, they've travelled to dojo's and gyms when their dead tired to train. to get beat and pounded and come back a day laters and do again. to swallow pride in order to get better.

They have the right to question others, but they don't!

think about it.

gregster gave you the verdict that your insane.

my verdict is: your a wannabe who talkes smack against people who you ahve no business talk smack too, because your not even in their league

respect is earned.

 

[Gregster]

Originally posted by lucid
gregster gave you the verdict that your insane.

my verdict is: your a wannabe who talkes smack against people who you ahve no business talk smack too, because your not even in their league

respect is earned.

I overturn my own verdict and defer to yours.

Everything else was well-put.