Southern Italians genetically distinct from Northern Italians. Diversity goes back 19K years

[Bangkok ready d1]

I've always wondered why North Italians went to South America (Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay) while South Italians went to North America (US & Canada)? I wonder if they would have faced considerably less discrimination of the immigrants were from the North rather than Siclians.

US Italians LMAO they pass more as mestizos or arabs than European. NYitalians are some of the worst most obnoxious and Fugly people on earth.

Dude its not that different really, im brazilian and i have both northern and southern italian bloodline... They look about the same the only difference is that there are gingers on my northern italian part of the family but those are some individuals only, most of them look just italian so brown hair and brown or blue eyes but still they all look southern european.

 

[Badger67]

I got a friend who's in a similar situation, but Syrian. Grows his beard out he looks Ortho. Jewish. If he keeps his goatee and short hair, he gets passed for Italian. He also grew up and lives in Woodbridge/Vaughan so he's got the talk and lingo that makes him seem Jersey Shore-ish

My italian cousins call me wonderwap somedays lol at family gatherings i fit in. I also eat like nonna's fave grandkid

 

[2gps125]

Anyone who has traveled to Italy, or even Spain, Portugal, Greece already know this. The more north you go the whiter the people. The hottest Italians are in Santa Catarina, Rio Grande do Sul, Argentina and Uruguay. The proper term Southern Italians is Terroni.

 

[Jack Reacheround]

not completely correct. The Vikings invaded and colonized southern Italy and implanted their DNA all over the place which is why there are still some blue eyed blondes down there instead of all dark hair, brown eyes.

Yeah, it’s weird. My mom is like half Sicilian or something close to that. She has light brown hair and blue eyes. My dad is a quarter Italian, his maternal grandparents were from Tuscany (northern Italy). He has dark brown hair, almost black, and brown eyes. And he has more of an olive tone to his skin. My mom looks like she has zero Sicilian in her. I think part of that is that beer dad’s side of the family has a lot of Scandinavian. Those genes apparently just take over the phenotype.

 

[KnightTemplar]

Literally the first thing I thought when I read the Thread title.

 

[JSN]

While I don't doubt a sub-saharan man could have made it to Sicily and reproduced it doesn't show up significantly in genetic testing. I think people often try to place modern attitudes towards sex in the ancient world which is just silly; sleeping around with other groups or raising a baby that was the product of rape weren't common things and the women were likely to be murdered in both cases.

If the Arab's brought them as slaves it's likely the males were castrated. It may be largly forgotten at this point but the Arab world entering the iberian peninsula in 711ad is one of the darkest chapters in European history, may be wold history, and started the Spanish on a very terrible path.

I suspect a 3rd generation Carthaginian or Greek immigrant to Sicily was indistinguishable from the "native" population and if a Sicilian has those genetic markers it's the result of long term integration and intermarriage of very similar phenotypical groups.

keep in mind that it was doric greeks who ruled Sicily throughout much of antiquity (and composed the greatest part of the population), and they on average were lighter skinned/haired/eyed.

There is definitely no single source for people with a given eye or hair color.

 

[Yodhin]

Well, given the North Africans and Arabs made their way into Southern Italy for a couple of centuries and married the local gals, this isn't surprising.

 

[Plissken]

actually the Romans/Italians were dark haired, olive skinned and brown eyes. They were never blond or blue eyed to begin with.

Any blonde, blued eyed DNA came from the Germmanic barbarians who invaded from the North or the Viking Norman’s who took over the South.

http://www.naplesldm.com/norman.php
http://www.bestofsicily.com/mag/art171.htm

Not exactly. The north of Italy had Celtic and proto Celtic roots thousands of years before the Roman empire or barbarians were a thing. The roots of the Celtic civilization were around Switzerland and Austria, right around Northern Italy.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

If you look at statues of Octavian he looks like a dumbo eared Englishman

 

[0_o]

This thread is like a Who's-Who of kid politicking posters to avoid

 

[Aegon Spengler]

This thread is like a Who's-Who of kid politicking posters to avoid

What is kid-politicking? Like hereditary political beliefs?

 

[0_o]

What is kid-politicking? Like hereditary political beliefs?

you're really trying to sit here and prove with geneological studies that southern italians are more north african than northern italians

mate I come from europe and the only people who are interested in that subject at bars are terrible people

 

[Aegon Spengler]

you're really trying to sit here and prove with geneological studies that southern italians are more north african than northern italians

mate I come from europe and the only people who are interested in that subject at bars are terrible people

lol I’m not trying to prove anything I just wanted to add that statue of Octavian to the discussion. I figure if we’re going to talk about what ancient people looked like, we might as well take a look at the strongest actual representations we have.


I agree there’s some weirdness in this thread. My interest is in history; not in divining some kind of white nationalist narrative by claiming stories about centuries-dead men are somehow also stories about my local buddies

Spoiler

But it’s an interesting subject to me, and you too, otherwise why post in this thread?

If you’re English you might be interested by this: fascist Norwegians drew up plans to request/reconquer their former Viking holdings during WW2. All based on this kind of talk. It’s weird how these sorts of conversations can genuinely produce violent clashes between people. The fact that they keep coming up makes me wonder about the viability of our species.

 

[ToroSalvaje]

The biggest difference between north and south is the economy: Napoli, Sicilia and Sardinia are really poor, south spain is a rich place compared with south Italy, and I'm not kidding or exaggerating, Napoli looks like a 90s spanish city

I did my erasmus in Venice, the average Italian in the north is the estereotypal souther-european: white/olive skin, brown or light brown hair and dark eyes
Of course, you can find people that look "nordic" but they are minority

 

[0_o]

lol I’m not trying to prove anything I just wanted to add that statue of Octavian to the discussion. I figure if we’re going to talk about what ancient people looked like, we might as well take a look at the strongest actual representations we have.


I agree there’s some weirdness in this thread. My interest is in history; not in divining some kind of white nationalist narrative by claiming stories about centuries-dead men are somehow also stories about my local buddies

Spoiler

But it’s an interesting subject to me, and you too, otherwise why post in this thread?

If you’re English you might be interested by this: fascist Norwegians drew up plans to request/reconquer their former Viking holdings during WW2. All based on this kind of talk. It’s weird how these sorts of conversations can genuinely produce violent clashes between people. The fact that they keep coming up makes me wonder about the viability of our species.

I'm not saying you I'm saying this subject is gross and gets a lot of guys killed outside pubs

 

[TribalDrumz]

Anyone who has traveled to Italy, or even Spain, Portugal, Greece already know this. The more north you go the whiter the people. The hottest Italians are in Santa Catarina, Rio Grande do Sul, Argentina and Uruguay. The proper term Southern Italians is Terroni.

And yet this Dark Haired Italian Stallion gets more pussy than all them stfu
.

 

[GSP_37]

I feel like when time machines are invented, History Channel should send back an HD camera crew to document this stuff then come back and put it on cable TV.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

I'm not saying you I'm saying this subject is gross and gets a lot of guys killed outside pubs

It’s a shame. I mean the history isn’t worth getting stabbed over. But knowing how people used to look, their trends, what they saw as beauty...even the smells people used to really enjoy, its all so great.

I wish folks who were interested in history got their information from better places.

I feel like when time machines are invented, History Channel should send back an HD camera crew to document this stuff then come back and put it on cable TV.

Time travel tourism! Maybe that’s what aliens are eh?

 

[0_o]

It’s a shame. I mean the history isn’t worth getting stabbed over. But knowing how people used to look, their trends, what they saw as beauty...even the smells people used to really enjoy, its all so great.

I wish folks who were interested in history got their information from better places.





Time travel tourism! Maybe that’s what aliens are eh?

pizza is a modified african flatbread they lied to us

 

[Aegon Spengler]

pizza is a modified african flatbread they lied to us

lmao