Somersault Kick and/or Cartwheel Kick???

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This is a new one. I expected the Harold Howard comedy version from whatever early UFC it was. Unfortunately, that is liked posting Eric "butterbean" Esch
 
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I'm at work now, can't really do it, I'll try to when I get home. He did it in the fight against "Doomsday" and the Thiago Santos one I think, both in the last round. I think it looked like a sideways kaiten geri (although I'm from Goju-ryu so I might not be able to identify that kick as well)

Yeah, a bit of searching and I found it.

1min 6sec mark

Yes it would classify as a yoko domawashi kaiten geri (or side rolling kick, or whatever name you prefer in english. there is no set name standard for it). It did not hit flush, though. It was neither camouflaged nor worked into combo in any way, just thrown as a one-off from long distance.
 
Yeah, a bit of searching and I found it.

1min 6sec mark

Yes it would classify as a yoko domawashi kaiten geri (or side rolling kick, or whatever name you prefer in english. there is no set name standard for it). It did not hit flush, though. It was neither camouflaged nor worked into combo in any way, just thrown as a one-off from long distance.


Yeah he did look silly everytime he threw it, he sometimes just jumps doing it from halfway across the cage, no purpose at all. It looks cool I guess .-.
 
Yeah he did look silly everytime he threw it, he sometimes just jumps doing it from halfway across the cage, no purpose at all. It looks cool I guess .-.

I have not seen it, but i take your word for it.
That is as silly as throwing any kick in the air from half the cage away. Some people needs to do it to psyche themselves up, I guess. To me it just looks like wasted energy.
I was "raised" with the concept to never throw a technique without the serious intent to hit. The only exception was to draw attention away from the technique that was actually intended to hit. Showboating like that is imo not only stupid but also disrespectful.
 
I have not seen it, but i take your word for it.
That is as silly as throwing any kick in the air from half the cage away. Some people needs to do it to psyche themselves up, I guess. To me it just looks like wasted energy.
I was "raised" with the concept to never throw a technique without the serious intent to hit. The only exception was to draw attention away from the technique that was actually intended to hit. Showboating like that is imo not only stupid but also disrespectful.

Well, if you were raised in karate like me we're taught to never throw without intention, or without being sure you will hit. At least I was. Maybe he was going for the "surprise element" I don't know, I don't understand the guy. I like him, but he's losing it by fighting like he does.
 
A few good domawashi. Threadstarted, is this what you mean by sommersault kicks/cartwheel kicks, or are we completely derailing the thread?


(there are a few regular jumping spinning kicks in there by mistake, because the kicker loses balance when he hits, and falls on his ass as a result. But the bulk of it are versions of domawashi/rolling kicks)
 
This is a kyokushin/kickboxer guy teaching his students the 3 main versions of the domawashi. mae (forward), yoko (side) and ura (backward). Not exactly world level tutorial, but it shows the basic concepts of the different versions clearly enough, and good ways to learn them.


This is a better tutorial, but he skips the yoko (side) version in this one.
 
and if the above is the summersault kick in different version, is this what people refer to as cartwheel kick?


I do not really see how the threadstarter can confuse these two types of kicks, though. the double hand stand is a pretty noticeable part of the technique.
 
I don't think Ebersole's "cartwheel kick" that he used to spam is what TS is thinking of. Probably more along the lines of Saenchai's trademark beauty.
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I think he is getting it confused because he isn't thinking of the classical rolling thunder, but kinda that side rolling thunder you sometimes see. Peter Graham anyone?
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Totally different, but I guess I can kinda see them blending together if you completely forgot about both of them.
 
Kiria hails from a ashihara/kyokushin background, and does a fairly textbook yoko domawashi kaiten geri. I only wish he managed to actually hit with it more often. Placed right it is a fight ending technique. But when not hitting, it looks silly.

Quite a few Knockdown fighters use that kick when they're getting outworked or want to rest for a few seconds. They throw the kick, end up on the floor and then have a few seconds to get back up and reset, giving them time to breathe and getting a bit of space from their opponent.
I think that Kiria seems to use it for that reason sometimes, unfortunately.

It's a shame because that technique has produced some of the most spectacular KO's in Knockdown tournaments, but also been used in a very lame way to break the rhythm of the fight.
 
Quite a few Knockdown fighters use that kick when they're getting outworked or want to rest for a few seconds. They throw the kick, end up on the floor and then have a few seconds to get back up and reset, giving them time to breathe and getting a bit of space from their opponent.
I think that Kiria seems to use it for that reason sometimes, unfortunately.

It's a shame because that technique has produced some of the most spectacular KO's in Knockdown tournaments, but also been used in a very lame way to break the rhythm of the fight.

That's a good point. It depends too a large degree on the style of the person throwing those kind of techniques. I wouldn't describe Kiria as a technical fighter - his style is a bit reminiscent of the usual knockdown approach - he's in your face, throwing shots trying to debilitate you and then knock you out. It's normal then that he uses do mawashi kaiten geri like that - as a breather rather than a legitimate sneaky technique the way someone like Valeri or Tsukamoto for example would use it.

I think very few people in knockdown use it in a technical way - the way Valeri & Tsukamoto use it - they usually hide it into whatever they're doing to catch you off guard - most guys seem to blatantly throw it out there like Kiria and when it connects it makes a great highlight reel.

On a side note - Peter Graham's rolling thunder - I wouldn't describe that as a do mawashi kaiten geri, it's more like a mix between that & ushiro mawashi - he remains stable until he connects - he connects with the heel the way you would with ushiro mawashi geri.

Even in some of those highlights - like the Garry O'Neill kick - that's more an tobi ushiro mawashi geri than a do mawashi.
 
On a side note - Peter Graham's rolling thunder - I wouldn't describe that as a do mawashi kaiten geri, it's more like a mix between that & ushiro mawashi - he remains stable until he connects - he connects with the heel the way you would with ushiro mawashi geri.

Even in some of those highlights - like the Garry O'Neill kick - that's more an tobi ushiro mawashi geri than a do mawashi.

I can agree with you somewhat regarding Oneill, but not Graham
 
I dont know if it is the kicks that OP as about, but I am assuming you are talking about this kick.
Example from karate.
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Not that I have ever trained it or even seen it myself. (this is seidokaikan, kyokushin offshot that was the foundation of the k-1 organization).

But thats not a tradtitional karate kick. is it?
 
That definitely is an ura domawashi above but maybe have another to look at Peter Graham's rolling thunder again.

His foot is connected to the ground throughout - it's his lead foot that makes the connection to Hari's jaw - not the rear like in ura above.

That's why I think it's not domawashi or any variant of it but just ushiro mawashi geri off the lead leg - it's why his foot only leaves the ground as his heel connects and not before that - as you'd see in nearly all domawashi variations. Maybe I'm wrong I dunno...

Sorry, I cannot agree with you on this. As I see it it is clearly a domawashi. A variation but a domawashi nonetheless. Admittedly a bigger variation than I remembered as Graham apparently reverse the direction of falling from the regular ura domawashi kaiten geri (would that make it a "ura ura domawashi kaiten geri"?). But as I see it, any kick that involves a rolling, ukemi-like, motion that deliberately ends with the kicker laying on the ground after completion (if only to roll back up on his feet again immediately), is a domawashi kaiten geri.

This may be just nitpicking on terminology, though. But we are martial art nerds, so it is expected.
I do agree on most of Oneills kicks though. Although they could sometimes be classed as a ura domawashi if we are generous, usually they are "just" a tobi ushiro mawashi where he fails to land on his feet because the impact stops his momentum.
 
But thats not a tradtitional karate kick. is it?

Not to my knowledge, no. But how traditional do you think it is in muay thai? How long do you think the spinning heel kick has been part of karate? All arts have evolved over time. All arts are influenced (read: "steal stuff shamelessly") by each other all the time. Anyone claiming ancient lineage without change is selling you BS (or has bought it in bulk, themselves).

Although I am not sure this particular kick is the right direction for karate to evolve in (to be honest I find it showboaty, and ridiculous), why would seidokaikan not be allowed to include it.
 
This type of kick is apparently ideal for self-defense (12s - yeah, it's staged, but it still looks cool).

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