So let me get this straight, Jones is suspected of PED use now?

[RafailNadull]

The low T/E numbers present an interesting theory but it's correlation not proof. So it's just good fodder for the internets for now.

You have absolutely no idea what correlation actually is, do you? A positive test is also "just correlation" and not proof.

 

[Ju Hitz U]

As soon as as he failed that out of competition drug test, you just knew the dam was gonna bust wide open with people turning over every rock looking in every crack to find something else, something more, something to destroy him.

Strange species we humans the only animals that take pleasure in someone else's suffering.

Well if there is something fishy going on then it's worth looking in to. IF the cocaine thing is a cover up for PED usage, then it's not people taking pleasure in watching HIM suffer as much as it's worth finding out so other light heavyweight fighters don't have to suffer knowing a cheater is getting a pass only because of his popularity.

The UFC has been getting on my nerves lately. I understand it's a business, and as a business it's sole purpose is to make money, but they are dragging the sport of MMA through the mud at this point...making it look REALLY bad AS a sport.

 

[Lovetap]

Every time I've seen that potential explanation be put forward, someone always said that cocaine doesn't really have that effect. So for the moment, I do not accept that possible explanation.

Everything surrounding this whole debacle is questionable.

I don't know. A simple Google search seems to show that cocaine can cause lower testosterone levels. Also in one of the articles I read about Jones I recall them discussing LH levels (I don't really know what the hell this is but I'm saying I recall it being discussed) well:

ngorgement of the penis with blood is necessary for erection to occur and it is believed that cocaine may affect erection by lessening pelvic blood flow during arousal. Cocaine affects sexual desire by inhibiting the release of LH (a hormone that stimulates the testicles to produce testosterone). With lowered levels of testosterone, both sexual desire and sperm production may decrease.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993-04-21/news/9304220220_1_cocaine-sexual-desire-sperm

So it seems quite possible that he may really just have a HUGE cocaine problem or that he got caught binging on cocaine from the night before. But I'd love to see a real expert address the issue of this.

It does seem to me that basically if they aren't going to do anything about cocaine a fighter could potential combine cocaine+a masking agent to hide steroid/TRT use. After all the cocaine would explain the lower testosterone levels, right?

 

[GSPSAKU]

His T/E levels were ABNORMALLY LOW, all 0.35:1 or lower. Justin Gatlin, who was banned from the Olympics, tested in a 0.5:1. The most common reason T/E levels are that low is because users take exogenous epitestosterone to mask their higher testosterone levels. Everything smells fishy about Jones...

 

[ZuffaExecutive]

Heres the thing,they screwed up his testing.Thats not even disputable.

They tested for things they shouldn't have.who is to say they did the correct testing on his testorone etc?that his samples weren't tainted by be left in in proper conditions.

What time were the tests taken?had he just been working out? all these things change your levels.

Could he be cycling on and off substances? yes of course,and if all these fighters who aren't champions are on drugs,why aren't they champions?

More then likely the champs are on more stuff then anyone else.

 

[thobra]

Coke is a better ped than any musclebuilding drug. It is very popular In amateur kickboxing.

 

[The Green Lantern]

Strange species we humans the only animals that take pleasure in someone else's suffering.

I actually read an article recently that suggests there are others in the animal kingdom who are capable of feeling schadenfreude, but I cant seem to find it with teh googlez right now lol

I may have imagined it...

 

[sickboy609]

Wow the Bones haters are going to have a field day with this now

 

[FallonFoxGOAT]

I actually read an article recently that suggests there are others in the animal kingdom who are capable of feeling schadenfreude, but I cant seem to find it with teh googlez right now lol

I may have imagined it...

Sounds like cats.

 

[Non]

Short answer? Yes.

 

[Mob69]

Copy this and send it to the email addresses at the bottom. A couple of email texts are doing the rounds on the forum. I have tweaked the original slightly (props to the creator):


Dear Sir/Madam,

As a fan of Mixed Martial Arts, I am concerned by reports that Jon Jones' drug tests related to his bout at UFC 182 last weekend showed abnormal testosterone to epitestosterone ratios.

Jones' T/E ratio was .19/1. The average ratio is 1/1. Jones' T/E ratio is extremely unlikely to exist in nature but does appear when a subject has introduced exogenous hormones into his/her system,. In such a circumstance, WADA protocols mandate additional Carbon Isotope Testing (CIR) testing to detect the presence of synthetic hormones.

Most concerning, Jon Jones' epitestosterone levels (27 ng/mL) were more than five times greater than his testosterone levels (4.9 ng/mL). There is no known natural explanation for this gigantic divergence in Jones' T/E ratio.

Based on all of the above, I would respectfully urge that additional CIR testing be utilized to shine light on an otherwise unclear situation.

Perhaps more worryingly, MMA media is currently reporting that in the weeks prior to the bout, an official visited Jones at his training camp in New Mexico to perform a drug test. According to the report, Jones hid under the ring/cage in the gym to avoid being seen and tested by the official. This is an extremely serious allegation. Just last summer, the NSAC imposed a lifetime ban on Wanderlei Silva for fleeing a drug test.

I hope that the above information is useful to the Nevada State Athletic Commission. Many thanks for your service.


Email to [email protected] or Commissioner Aguila at [email protected]

 

[Bryan teh Retar]

I don't know. A simple Google search seems to show that cocaine can cause lower testosterone levels. Also in one of the articles I read about Jones I recall them discussing LH levels (I don't really know what the hell this is but I'm saying I recall it being discussed) well:



http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993-04-21/news/9304220220_1_cocaine-sexual-desire-sperm

So it seems quite possible that he may really just have a HUGE cocaine problem or that he got caught binging on cocaine from the night before. But I'd love to see a real expert address the issue of this.

It does seem to me that basically if they aren't going to do anything about cocaine a fighter could potential combine cocaine+a masking agent to hide steroid/TRT use. After all the cocaine would explain the lower testosterone levels, right?

There are two huge problems with the coke theory;

1. he would need to do insane amounts of cocaine for his test-level to be that low, like enormous amounts. Ive read research where they inject cocaine into rats for a month, and the rats actually didn't have less testosterone production (even though their testes were getting screwed up).

2. It doesn't explain why his Epi-T has been rising enormously. This is the biggest red flag of the whole test. there are literally no other reasons than medical illness for Epi-T to go up. Again the problem with this is, that T and E reflect each others levels, but in this case only the E went up enormously.

For anyone with a bit of knowledge on this subject it's very, very clear that his hormonal levels are way off.

 

[Lovetap]

There are two huge problems with the coke theory;

1. he would need to do insane amounts of cocaine for his test-level to be that low, like enormous amounts. Ive read research where they inject cocaine into rats for a month, and the rats actually didn't have less testosterone production (even though their testes were getting screwed up).

2. It doesn't explain why his Epi-T has been rising enormously. This is the biggest red flag of the whole test. there are literally no other reasons than medical illness for Epi-T to go up. Again the problem with this is, that T and E reflect each others levels, but in this case only the E went up enormously.

For anyone with a bit of knowledge on this subject it's very, very clear that his hormonal levels are way off.

Thank you for the information. You seem like you know a bit more about it than I do.

Now the question is why aren't they (the NSAC, UFC, media,etc) doing something about this?

 

[west42]

Correct. The "T" in T/E ratio wasn't low, the "E" was high. He had HIGH level of "E". Coke doesn't increase either of these. It was not the coke, period.

There are two huge problems with the coke theory;

1. he would need to do insane amounts of cocaine for his test-level to be that low, like enormous amounts. Ive read research where they inject cocaine into rats for a month, and the rats actually didn't have less testosterone production (even though their testes were getting screwed up).

2. It doesn't explain why his Epi-T has been rising enormously. This is the biggest red flag of the whole test. there are literally no other reasons than medical illness for Epi-T to go up. Again the problem with this is, that T and E reflect each others levels, but in this case only the E went up enormously.

For anyone with a bit of knowledge on this subject it's very, very clear that his hormonal levels are way off.

 

[Lovestorm]

His T/E levels would also suggest a connection to ISIS, as well as him being Jack The Ripper.

 

[Bryan teh Retar]

Thank you for the information. You seem like you know a bit more about it than I do.

Now the question is why aren't they (the NSAC, UFC, media,etc) doing something about this?

It's actually fascinating. The reason why they aren't doing anything it because their test is inadequate. Basically what it boils down to;

They look at the t/e ratio, and if it's T/E > 4, then you fail the test and they do additional carbon-isotope test. The problem is that the CI-test is very expensive, so they choose to do it only if T/E > 4. So basically if you've been adding a lot of E, you'll always pass the test.

So the reason Jones passed is actually a technicality!

 

[Shocktagon]

As soon as as he failed that out of competition drug test, you just knew the dam was gonna bust wide open with people turning over every rock looking in every crack to find something else, something more, something to destroy him.

Strange species we humans the only animals that take pleasure in someone else's suffering.

I say this as a huge fan, people aren't having to look too damn hard to find shady stuff with him on this front.

 

[hendobomb]

I actually read an article recently that suggests there are others in the animal kingdom who are capable of feeling schadenfreude, but I cant seem to find it with teh googlez right now lol

I may have imagined it...

dolphins are one example my friend... i believe there are other species as well, possibly monkeys and cats

 

[machidafan99]

Depends on the test.

You have absolutely no idea what correlation actually is, do you? A positive test is also "just correlation" and not proof.

 

[Jimmy jump]

As soon as as he failed that out of competition drug test, you just knew the dam was gonna bust wide open with people turning over every rock looking in every crack to find something else, something more, something to destroy him.

Strange species we humans the only animals that take pleasure in someone else's suffering.

Or the fact that JBJ's unprecedented run to LHW GOATness may be tainted is enough to get the MMA community curious?