Economy Small Colleges Losing Viability

[Diogenes of Sinope]

Don't know if this is bad but community College is a great deal if it's a good one.

You don't have to go to college to get a great job. I didn't but went to a hell of a lot of college level courses in the job I was in.

That said the right college degree is a huge step up. We push the boy to go to college to get an engineer degree. He lived at home and started in a community college graduated make sure his credits would transfer to a university. Still lived at home (and worked part time) got his engineering degree the we pushed him to get a masters. He did get that and now has a great job that pays very well.

He also got his PE and had very little student debt.

Be smart about what you study and how you do it.

Community college is better than a 4 year imo.

coming from someone who went to both

 

[Dan O]

Is it possible to short private schools that might be going under? Asking for a friend

 

[SandisLL]

+ imho there are diffrrent things where you might IMHO taste yourself like freecodecamp, even some stuff online from reputable unis and for free...
Taste yourself for free and get reality; is this interesting for you or no.

I hate Agile and a lot of modern mainstream buzzwords etc...+ if we need programmer, I didn't had cared does he have degree or no.
I even hate to do techincal "s".
I usually had asked some situation questions like in friendly manner and then provided one problem and maybe 2-3 solution versions...
Then I expected that candidate will ask additional questions to precise task (!) and provide solution he is thinking that will be the best in this case and will be able to explain why.
Then some other stuff.
Because if you are DB dev it will matter here; with small website and small DB it will be not so important what kind of so he will use.
While if DB will be large...then pharse " math is bullshit and all stuff taught in unis and colleges is shit "....will be...Vuala pleasure....

+ for normal programmer it will suck if he will not be able to deal with at least unit tests + to install soft on servers, configure this and so on further....
Not alone to deal with documentation etc.

Usually in large company and team is easier to get narrow tasks and initially it might be easier to start career.

Small companies while might be more lenient when will filter by CV....
In some might happen that they will not have QA guys and maybe even seperate Sys Admin / Dev Op.
Like 2-3-4-5-6-7 ppl in company, that's all.

Some companies are working like...large factories...
With narrow field of tech stack and tasks to be done for one emplyee.
This too does have pros and cons ofc.
Pros: it this narrow sub field and(!) tech stack you had used will be in high demand after 3 -4 years ...and later.
Cons: if no, then welcome to small hell in job market.

 

[Dan O]

+ imho there are diffrrent things where you might IMHO taste yourself like freecodecamp, even some stuff online from reputable unis and for free...
Taste yourself for free and get reality; is this interesting for you or no.

I hate Agile and a lot of modern mainstream buzzwords etc...+ if we need programmer, I didn't had cared does he have degree or no.
I even hate to do techincal "s".
I usually had asked some situation questions like in friendly manner and then provided one problem and maybe 2-3 solution versions...
Then I expected that candidate will ask additional questions to precise task (!) and provide solution he is thinking that will be the best in this case and will be able to explain why.
Then some other stuff.
Because if you are DB dev it will matter here; with small website and small DB it will be not so important what kind of so he will use.
While if DB will be large...then pharse " math is bullshit and all stuff taught in unis and colleges is shit "....will be...Vuala pleasure....

+ for normal programmer it will suck if he will not be able to deal with at least unit tests + to install soft on servers, configure this and so on further....
Not alone to deal with documentation etc.

Usually in large company and team is easier to get narrow tasks and initially it might be easier to start career.

Small companies while might be more lenient when will filter by CV....
In some might happen that they will not have QA guys and maybe even seperate Sys Admin / Dev Op.
Like 2-3-4-5-6-7 ppl in company, that's all.

Some companies are working like...large factories...
With narrow field of tech stack and tasks to be done for one emplyee.
This too does have pros and cons ofc.
Pros: it this narrow sub field and(!) tech stack you had used will be in high demand after 3 -4 years ...and later.
Cons: if no, then welcome to small hell in job market.

Where are from, geographically?

 

[Morning Star]

Well, while I agree that paper is...not always necessity....


If you mean programming I will openly tell you that bootcamp can't replace college. In no case.

I don't mean here necessity for piece of paper.
Not at all.

Bootcamp might be very good IF you already had been passionate and were able to program + for sure had programmed something. Not mando for business...
Normal PET projects as bare mininum...

The stuff is also reality: a lot of ppl had learned programming in HS, college as some modules while it wasn't major or minor ....
For example I will not start to compare someone who was able to get credit hours from Uni in programming where guy should had to know at least something from one f assembly languages and C....
Despite he maybe does have diploma as non IT field engineer...
Then went to bootcamp...
With someone who never had programmed and in one day had idea: I will learn how to prorgam and earn money.


Yes, you don't need any paper to be good programmer.
However some stuff taught in colleges still will be must have...
This doesn't means that you need paper as mando.
Just some stuff you should know etc...

+ a lot of things now are awailable for free...

Some majors require more time in your field of study I will admit. I took Computer Science before changing to Accounting and Finance (Double Major) and could see that needing more coursework. However I would have still taken pointless electives. Film, 2 Roman Mythology classes, Sex Ed, Communications, science. However Accounting and Finance only had 6 or 7 specific classes and a bunch of business and GE filler. None trained us on any accounting software we would need to use in our careers (not even quickbooks), had a 1 unit MS Office class, 1 unit. I have used excel 5 days a week 15 years. If there was a trade school for my majors I probably would have finished in half the time.

Colleges are way too bloated, they don't focus enough on your specific field. And maybe that was fine when they didn't put you tens or hundreds of thousands in debt but now they do. I'm not saying there is a viable alternate yet for every field, I think colleges being "credentialed" holds back alternative sources of education. I do think things will change in the future as our society is moving more toward virtual learning and business. I for one will never work in an office again and I have the credentials to be able to do that.

 

[Scheme]

Well, while I agree that paper is...not always necessity....


If you mean programming I will openly tell you that bootcamp can't replace college. In no case.

I don't mean here necessity for piece of paper.
Not at all.

Bootcamp might be very good IF you already had been passionate and were able to program + for sure had programmed something. Not mando for business...
Normal PET projects as bare mininum...

The stuff is also reality: a lot of ppl had learned programming in HS, college as some modules while it wasn't major or minor ....
For example I will not start to compare someone who was able to get credit hours from Uni in programming where guy should had to know at least something from one f assembly languages and C....
Despite he maybe does have diploma as non IT field engineer...
Then went to bootcamp...
With someone who never had programmed and in one day had idea: I will learn how to prorgam and earn money.


Yes, you don't need any paper to be good programmer.
However some stuff taught in colleges still will be must have...
This doesn't means that you need paper as mando.
Just some stuff you should know etc...

+ a lot of things now are awailable for free...

There is nothing in the computer science curriculum taught in colleges that can't be found online. And there is infinitely more stuff online that isn't taught in colleges.

I do agree that bootcamps have become sort of predatory in a sense, there's no longer a guaranteed job waiting for you. The whole tech industry is pretty much saturated on junior positions, it's the senior developers that are truly lacking.

 

[SandisLL]

There is nothing in the computer science curriculum taught in colleges that can't be found online.

If you mean undergrad level then I in general will agree.
College/ uni is good if you have usable ppl - students in your group etc to use them in order to build social network, get new connections and together solve problems etc.
+ damn depends from tutors and lecturers, professors you will have.
Some are useless IMHO.
Some are cool and sometimes might help you to understand things and solve some problems if you are struggling...
For example if they are good in so called Q/A hours ..
When you are allowed to ask questions and they will answer...
Some % of them are beautiful.

 

[SandisLL]

+ ofc my comments maybe aren't suitable for americans because....we in EU have a lot countries where you might get degree in Comp Sci for free...( usually in fulltime programs ).
Therefore IMHO it is huge difference how we value degree /vs expenses...

 

[ineverpost]

If you want to attend college you should be forced to do a "cost benefit analysis" where the loan applicant has to demonstrate to the bank how they will be able to make money off of the investment. This isn't required because the US government is in cahoots with the banks and makes loans unforgivable. This is a cartel, plain and simple.

 

[SandisLL]

Here students loans IF they are 100% commercial loans usually are...warranted by their parents. ( not always ofc ).
If they doesn't have income/ property to warrant ability to pay debts .
Banks doesn't cares about " cost benefit analysis " done by 18-19 y.o with 0 exp in adult life...

After 2008/2009 beauty banks are more cautious when they are lending money.

 

[Morning Star]

How many of you that are crying college is a scam, actually went and graduated college?

Why would you go to college if you think it's a scam? Also I did and it was a giant waste of time and money, I could've done everything necessary for my degree in a year.

He said twice in his response that he has his degree, it was pretty clear.

I went to college and double majored. I took 150+ units (required for a California CPA). I would say I had no more than 12-14 classes that actually mattered. The vast majority of my classes were a waste of time and did nothing to prepare me for my career. And yeah it is a scam if you're racking up over 100K+ in debt for either a useless major or to support useless majors, useless classes, and useless faculty/bureaucracy. Just because one thinks the educational system is antiquated and needs to be improved and more focused doesn't mean they're some uneducated rube.

Why aren't these colleges at fault for anything? We have generations of students in crippling student loan debt and yet it's supposed to be the taxpayer that pays the ever increasing bill? Fuck that. They need to trim the fat and stop with the out of control spending that they pass on to these young adults. Or there's going to be alternatives, there's nothing wrong with competition, well except with the people that blindly support the college cartel.

 

[SandisLL]

Useless or not useless looks that easier is to see in these EU countries where part of students places are subsidised by taxpayers.
Like for example enrollment xxx.
10 free places for phylosophy, 120 for Comp Sci in the same uni etc...

Taxpayers long ago had been scared to cover useless bullshit and during last 12-16 years gubbermints at least a bit are looking on real supply/demand.

I hope they will improve further and will stop to pay stipends to students in fields like " business psychology " for Master's level students.

 

[Two Crows]

A lot of the closing schools are actually Community Colleges, and one of the private universities is 170 years old (Mills College, https://www.mills.edu/), now merged into North Eastern.

 

[Whippy McGee]

How many of you that are crying college is a scam, actually went and graduated college?

Me.

Undergrad - American River College (AA Degree)
Undergrad - UCSD - Third/Marshall (BA Degree)
Grad - UCLA Anderson (MBA Degree)
Grad - George Washington (PM BA Degree)

I worked through all of it at least 28 hours a week, sometimes 40.

College is a scam. Kids are vastly overcharged to receive propaganda, unless you are in a hard science and even then they push their Marxist scumbaggery in the undergraduate studies. Leftists take over and transform every institution they can... higher education is no exception.

 

[Mr Holmes]

How many of you that are crying college is a scam, actually went and graduated college?

I would say about half of the degrees are a scam.

 

[esotamoc]

I think that degrees that do not directly lead to employment besides teaching should be limited and places should be very selective to students that are both talented and very passionate in that field. kids that study art, literature etc that do not have wealthy parents and only a lukewarm interest are doing their future a disservice.

 

[the ambush]

Good. College is too expensive and wastes too much time on useless classes that don't fulfill the primary duty of what college is for (preparing you to work in your field of study).

I never went to a traditional college, however, I disagree with it being a waste of time. I felt like with what I did in life, although off the beaten path, was a complete waste of time.

 

[Yehudim]

Declining college enrollment can easily be explained by changing demographics.

Having worked with young people, I don’t see some great shift to the trades. As worthless as my anecdote is, I think demographics are a more plausible explanation.

 

[the ambush]

How many of you that are crying college is a scam, actually went and graduated college?

I never went to a traditional, brick & mortar college. I have only went to trade schools and completed online classes.

 

[Bobby 3 Sticks]

• For profits shouldn't exist
• Private colleges use the large tuition number and "price cut" via scholarships to make it seem as if the student is receiving a deal
• Demographics are shifting and hard; lower population, lower percentage attending traditional 4 year institutions (rising cost of college plus income when finally done seen as not worth it)
• This is only the beginning. The UWisconsin system a few years back as a result of former governor Walker wrecking their funding, went through a major shift consolidating campuses, more will come

Tldr there doesn't appear to be an end in sight, this is only going to continue as costs rise, birth rates remain low, and e-learning shows continued growth.