Should Genghis Khan be posthumously charged with hate crimes against Islam?

[TemujinKhan]

No I shouldn't...

Temujin was far from a saint but also remember that most of the information and perceptions of the Mongols today comes from those who were once conquered by them or a biased anti-asian western perspective. They believed in unrestricted warfare and indeed many of their tactics were brutal, they would use any measure to achieve victory in the battlefield. But in times of peace, religious freedom was allowed for all under Mongol rule, their armies were the first to be based on a meritocracy instead of familial lineage.

Rape, robbery and murder were outlawed during peace times, even during times of war the Mongols usually refrained from the killing of children, under Mongol law a person had to be taller than a wheelbarrow or they were not to be harmed by an adult. Both their armies and populations were multicultural and multiracial, since the mongols had no concept of race. They tried to adopt and learn from Chinese and Islamic culture and adopted elements of other cultures into their own, the Mongols were many things but they were not a xenophobic culture like much of the world at that time.

Temujins original goal was to unite the all the Steppe nomads to face off against their rivals the Chinese, After defeating the Chinese Temujin originally did not want to expand westward and sent an envoy to the nearest Islamic nation of Quarezem to talk trade and politics. The king of Quarezem thought it was a joke that these barbarians would dare try to ally themselves with them and sent the envoys severed heads back to Temujin. This enraged Temujin and thus began the Mongols westward expansion.

Also greatly exaggerated is the amount of women that were raped by Temujin himself, I'm sure he did participate in that but when you are the king of the world and one of the richest men on the planet it's probably not too difficult to get laid.

Also remember that we are talking about the 1200-1300's here, brutality was the norm, there wasn't a nation on earth at the time that did not participate in extreme violence.

I'ts also kinda funny how a guy like Alexander the Great is revered as this great man and Temujin is regarded as a savage when really there is little difference in their actions, of course Temujin didn't rape little boys on a daily basis like Alexander did. Yet Alexander is regarded as a hero and Temujin is regarded as a supremely villainous character.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Theyre not sure if it was Temujin or one of his generals who was most responsible for doin all da rapin, but it was definitely one or the other.

Although it would be hard to pinpoint since most of the Mongol soldiers and leaders were probably all closely related and all had a hand in the rapefests.

 

[Zankou]

I can't see how anybody could really try to pull moral rank back then. The Muslim armies, the Mongol hordes, and the Crusaders were all pretty much epic A++++++ grade assholes.

In fact, until recently, all of mankind was pretty much horrific.

 

[Bald1]

Sure, along with every step nomad chief, and every warlord everywhere should be judged by the standards of our time. After all it's only been around 800 years.

 

[JosephDredd]

Not only that, but all East Asians should be subject to "yellow guilt" and reparations.

Genghis was a ginger. The physical ethnic make-up of the region was much different than today.

 

[TemujinKhan]

Genghis was a ginger. The physical ethnic make-up of the region was much different than today.

Are you seriously trying to say that Temujin and the Mongols were white/caucasian? This theory has been disproved thoroughly as well as the notion that the Huns were caucasian, yes many mongols and even people today in Northern China and Mongolia have reddish/auburn colored hair and even blonde, some of it is due to recessive genes from mixing with caucasians, but in fact black hair does naturally turn to a reddish color with prolonged exposure to the sun, I know this as an Asian since my own hair does the same thing. Temujin and the Mongols were about as Asian as a Korean and Japanese at the time, with maybe 5% more caucasian admixture due to closer proximity with Eastern Europeans.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Genghis was a ginger. The physical ethnic make-up of the region was much different than today.

IIRC, I read that after the Mongols conquered Kwharezem, Turkish scouts enticed them into turning towards Russia by telling them about people with blonde hair and light colored eyes.

If thats true I doubt Chingis was a ginger.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

The Mongols used to prick their horses while riding, sucking the blood for some nutrients to be able to ride extra hard.

gangsta level, 284902349082058349058934053495

 

[Lord of Lies]

So you're saying Genghis was a white dude with red hair.

Are you seriously trying to say that Temujin and the Mongols were white/caucasian? This theory has been disproved thoroughly as well as the notion that the Huns were caucasian, yes many mongols and even people today in Northern China and Mongolia have reddish/auburn colored hair and even blonde, some of it is due to recessive genes from mixing with caucasians, but in fact black hair does naturally turn to a reddish color with prolonged exposure to the sun, I know this as an Asian since my own hair does the same thing. Temujin and the Mongols were about as Asian as a Korean and Japanese at the time, with maybe 5% more caucasian admixture due to closer proximity with Eastern Europeans.

 

[TemujinKhan]

IIRC, I read that after the Mongols conquered Kwharezem, Turkish scouts enticed them into turning towards Russia by telling them about people with blonde hair and light colored eyes.

If thats true I doubt Chingis was a ginger.

Not too mention that most of the reports from conquered nations in middle east and europe describe the mongol/hun appearances as distinctly foreign and the descriptions match with asian appearance. There's also the portrait of Temujin by Chinese painters in which it is pretty clear that he is an asian man. The notion that the mongols were white used to be quite prevalent even 20 years ago, I remember non-asian people used to tell me that all the time the mongols and huns were white. This is mostly due to western indoctrination, not wanting to give credit to a non-white person for being the greatest conquerer in history. Not too mention that they chose white actors for most western documentaries and films about the Mongols and Huns, that is where the idea came from. People are so easily indoctrinated by television.

The Mongols and Huns were in fact multicultural and mutiracial societies after their expansions but that was mostly due to the fact they were generally not a racist and xenophobic culture. But Temujin and the Mongol/Hun ruling class and almost all of the original steppe nomads were asiatic peoples.

 

[TemujinKhan]

So you're saying Genghis was a white dude with red hair.

Where did I say that?

If you seriously believe Temujin was white you're an idiot.

 

[Lord of Lies]

I saw the Genghis Khan documentary with John Wayne, he was definitely white.

 

[Rod1]

Not too mention that most of the reports from conquered nations in middle east and europe describe the mongol/hun appearances as distinctly foreign and the descriptions match with asian appearance. There's also the portrait of Temujin by Chinese painters in which it is pretty clear that he is an asian man. The notion that the mongols were white used to be quite prevalent even 20 years ago, I remember non-asian people used to tell me that all the time the mongols and huns were white. This is mostly due to western indoctrination, not wanting to give credit to a non-white person for being the greatest conquerer in history. Not too mention that they chose white actors for most western documentaries and films about the Mongols and Huns, that is where the idea came from. People are so easily indoctrinated by television.

The Mongols and Huns were in fact multicultural and mutiracial societies after their expansions but that was mostly due to the fact they were generally not a racist and xenophobic culture. But Temujin and the Mongol/Hun ruling class and almost all of the original steppe nomads were asiatic peoples.

It has more to do with the fact that human differences are clinal, therefore there is not a clear line that separated asians and caucasians.

 

[TemujinKhan]

I saw the Genghis Khan documentary with John Wayne, he was definitely white.

Ok. you're trolling. You should watch the new Genghis Khan movie "Mongol", 1000x better film.

 

[IDL]

Speak softly. Temujin is watching.

 

[Rex Kwon Do]

Not too mention that most of the reports from conquered nations in middle east and europe describe the mongol/hun appearances as distinctly foreign and the descriptions match with asian appearance. There's also the portrait of Temujin by Chinese painters in which it is pretty clear that he is an asian man. The notion that the mongols were white used to be quite prevalent even 20 years ago, I remember non-asian people used to tell me that all the time the mongols and huns were white. This is mostly due to western indoctrination, not wanting to give credit to a non-white person for being the greatest conquerer in history. Not too mention that they chose white actors for most western documentaries and films about the Mongols and Huns, that is where the idea came from. People are so easily indoctrinated by television.

The Mongols and Huns were in fact multicultural and mutiracial societies after their expansions but that was mostly due to the fact they were generally not a racist and xenophobic culture. But Temujin and the Mongol/Hun ruling class and almost all of the original steppe nomads were asiatic peoples.

While I don't disagree that Genghis probably "looked (East) Asian," the bolded part isn't really compelling evidence since he appears different depending on who was painting him. The Chinese painted him as Chinese and the Turks painted him as more Caucasian. If you thought he was a badass, you tended to make him look more like you, much like how Europeans loved the image of White Jesus with beautiful dirty blonde hair and blue eyes instead of the swarthy dude he probably was.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

So Genghis Khan was white..
Samurai were white Aryan Ainu...
and Vikings were really black...

who would have guessed?

 

[Pem123]

Not too mention that most of the reports from conquered nations in middle east and europe describe the mongol/hun appearances as distinctly foreign and the descriptions match with asian appearance. There's also the portrait of Temujin by Chinese painters in which it is pretty clear that he is an asian man. The notion that the mongols were white used to be quite prevalent even 20 years ago, I remember non-asian people used to tell me that all the time the mongols and huns were white. This is mostly due to western indoctrination, not wanting to give credit to a non-white person for being the greatest conquerer in history. Not too mention that they chose white actors for most western documentaries and films about the Mongols and Huns, that is where the idea came from. People are so easily indoctrinated by television.

The Mongols and Huns were in fact multicultural and mutiracial societies after their expansions but that was mostly due to the fact they were generally not a racist and xenophobic culture. But Temujin and the Mongol/Hun ruling class and almost all of the original steppe nomads were asiatic peoples.

Though they are still a conquerors who committed act of slaughter, and i never seen any different treatment between Alexander and genghis, many people infact admire him especially mongolian

 

[TemujinKhan]

Though they are still a conquerors who committed act of slaughter, and i never seen any different treatment between Alexander and genghis, many people infact admire him especially mongolian

If you don't see a difference in perception between Alexander and Temujin then you're not paying enough attention. Alexander is romanticized in the west, there are countless films, literature and television programs showing a sympathetic multi-layered portrayal of a man driven by desire, love and conquest, they show many sides to him as a complex character. Temujin and the mongols are portrayed as vicious murderous savages who were only succesful due to their sheer savagery, there are many villainous characters such as Fu Manchu and Wrath of Khan that are partially based on Temujin and the Mongols.

In the west Temujin is often compared with Hitler, even though they couldn't be any more different since Temujin was not xenophobic or racist, he was interested in other cultures and religions and allowed religious freedom for those under his rule.

There are some who admire him even in the west since they consider him a badass, obviously in Mongolia he will be revered. But if you ask an average person on the street their thoughts on Alexander and Temujin, you will get 2 totally different responses, one will conjure up glorious romanticized images of Ancient Greece, a great man and conquerer. The other will conjure up images of nothing but death, savagery and evil. That's how indoctrination works, you have no idea the power of media to shape thoughts and perceptions.

 

[TemujinKhan]

While I don't disagree that Genghis probably "looked (East) Asian," the bolded part isn't really compelling evidence since he appears different depending on who was painting him. The Chinese painted him as Chinese and the Turks painted him as more Caucasian. If you thought he was a badass, you tended to make him look more like you, much like how Europeans loved the image of White Jesus with beautiful dirty blonde hair and blue eyes instead of the swarthy dude he probably was.

You have a point there. Although I'm not sure why you say Temujin only "probably looked" asian. Theres no probably about it, I'm 99.99% sure he was east asian in regard to appearance and biology. If someone were to give you even betting odds on him being asian or not for a million dollars, no question I'm going to win that bet.