Shevchenko's takedowns

Ronda relies on head and arm throws mostly. Valentina went for trips and sweeps (and a failed single leg iirc). So Holly coulnd't use the same kind of defense she had trained for that fight.
IMO, Ronda doesn't rely on head and arm throws, it's just that most of her opponents can't stop it. I've seen her at least a couple times quickly move to a trip after a failed head and arm throw. I think trips in Judo are basically a way to take down opponents that over-commit on defending certain throws.
 
She had a couple great takedowns. It was all in the timing and striking threat. Holly was so preoccupied with Shevchenko's striking, and Shevchenko timed those few takedowns perfectly. I would have liked to have seen more.
 
I don't think you are giving the size difference anywhere near enough attention.

You are right, Holly IS an immense 135 pound WBW fighter. She probably had to cut 15-20 pounds to make the 135 pound limit.

Val beat strawweight champion JJ! Please understand that there is no flyweight division in the UFC's female division. Val had to pack on weight and still couldn't come close to the 135 pound limit! They SIMPLY are not in the same WC, if the UFC supported true WC's in WMMA!

Val hasn't fought at 125 since 2008. She fought at 133 and sometimes 138 lbs from 2009 onwards. She walks around over 140 lbs and diets down to the high 130's. If I recall correctly, she said she weighed 142 lbs against Kaufman (short notice) and 137 lbs against Nunes (full camp). She trained at TTD before this fight and weighed 143 at the time.

But yes, she is a small BW and could obviously cut to 125.
 
No wonder why he hasn't taught Ronda any MT. :rolleyes:

Or basic footwork. Or how to keep your hands up. Or how to keep your chin down. Or how to move your head off the centerline. Or pretty much anything else people learn in their first couple of months boxing.
 
its a kick catch sweep...... I didnt know that they allowed kicks in judo

How could you ever use Judo in MMA when they use so much things they don't allow in Judo?
 
How could you ever use Judo in MMA when they use so much things they don't allow in Judo?
but that isnt allowed in judo, but that exact technique is allowed and taught all around the world in Muay Thai........ so the fact you need to ask stupid questions to justify what you said shows you are wrong.... its not a judo technique, it was a MT technique. Just stop
 
but that isnt allowed in judo, but that exact technique is allowed and taught all around the world in Muay Thai........ so the fact you need to ask stupid questions to justify what you said shows you are wrong.... its not a judo technique, it was a MT technique. Just stop

Just stop isn't a great argument. It's a really basic sweep. I already went into the specifics in previous posts. It's MMA (mixed martial arts), you can't take down in boxing, you can't punch in BJJ, you can't strike of any in in wrestling, yet you can adopt all disciplines into MMA..Anyway, you were just criticizing a minor detail while TS was obviously just interested in the TDs/sweeps performed by Valentina. Meaning you were nitpicking at insignificant details, while for all practical purposes it could be a Judo sweep adopted to MMA. Go ahead and argue me on it. I'll keep it up till the end of this forum.
 
Just stop isn't a great argument. It's a really basic sweep. I already went into the specifics in previous posts. It's MMA (mixed martial arts), you can't take down in boxing, you can't punch in BJJ, you can't strike of any in in wrestling, yet you can adopt all disciplines into MMA..Anyway, you were just criticizing a minor detail while TS was obviously just interested in the TDs/sweeps performed by Valentina. Meaning you were nitpicking at insignificant details, while for all practical purposes it could be a Judo sweep adopted to MMA. Go ahead and argue me on it. I'll keep it up till the end of this forum.
no I was just pointing out that the last takedown was a MT kick catch and sweep....... thats all. you can mention about it "being MMA" all you want, you are still wrong.

so argue your point all you want, it doesnt change the fact you are just being a tool
 
no I was just pointing out that the last takedown was a MT kick catch and sweep....... thats all. you can mention about it "being MMA" all you want, you are still wrong.

so argue your point all you want, it doesnt change the fact you are just being a tool

Nah, you said there's nothing Judo about it. Showing your lack of understanding of Judo which isn't a big thing, TBH. But any Judo practice in MMA is adapted to the bare bodies it has to deal with and the strikes and alternative positions it normally doesn't deal with, just like any other discipline in MMA gets adapted to the scenarios that would normally not be allowed in their respective rules. For example someone could practice knees in MT and then uses them in MMA for the first time on the ground, meaning he adapts his discipline to the different rule set of MMA. That doesn't mean he didn't use his MT skills in MMA. He did. Or on the other aspect of the comparison, if a boxer enters MMA and catches a kick and counters with a hook, does he not use his boxing skills, but MT skills, when throwing that hook, or does he just catch the kick and then use his boxing skills to throw the hook? Point I'm trying to make, that the simple movement is more important than the name/discipline you attribute them to.

Now, again, I am not denying that thar sweep is a MT technique. It is. But the simple sweep (not the catch) is as basic Judo as it is MT. Catching the kick could be interpreted as much as an adaptation to MMA as any Judo move Rousey ever made, as none of her Judo moves she used were strictly correct in Judo due to the lack of gi's in MMA. But you just wanted to harp on an insignificant detail to criticize (tool move to somewhat use your terminology) while the purpose of TS' question was obviously to inquire for gifs of the throws/sweeps Valentina used and with little importance to which discipline they strictly would fit best in.
 
Last technique is MT from the source. But yes Vale is a BB in judo. You will see hybrid techniques flow between the two arts as you do in multiple arts in her game.
 
Wandy-trips-Bisping.gif


The last one made me think of this one. Wand has his roots in MT and a BB in Judo but these kind of exchanges seem like MT instincts to me.
 
Wandy-trips-Bisping.gif


The last one made me think of this one. Wand has his roots in MT and a BB in Judo but these kind of exchanges seem like MT instincts to me.

Its just a basic single leg pick into a small inner reap. In judo it was often used as a counter against hiza guruma or Sasae tsurikomi ashi or you simply pick up the leg.

Its one of the most obvious defence against kicks and in judo its common also to reap with the other leg - ouchi instead of kouchi as in your gif
 
Nah, you said there's nothing Judo about it. Showing your lack of understanding of Judo which isn't a big thing, TBH. But any Judo practice in MMA is adapted to the bare bodies it has to deal with and the strikes and alternative positions it normally doesn't deal with, just like any other discipline in MMA gets adapted to the scenarios that would normally not be allowed in their respective rules. For example someone could practice knees in MT and then uses them in MMA for the first time on the ground, meaning he adapts his discipline to the different rule set of MMA. That doesn't mean he didn't use his MT skills in MMA. He did. Or on the other aspect of the comparison, if a boxer enters MMA and catches a kick and counters with a hook, does he not use his boxing skills, but MT skills, when throwing that hook, or does he just catch the kick and then use his boxing skills to throw the hook? Point I'm trying to make, that the simple movement is more important than the name/discipline you attribute them to.

Now, again, I am not denying that thar sweep is a MT technique. It is. But the simple sweep (not the catch) is as basic Judo as it is MT. Catching the kick could be interpreted as much as an adaptation to MMA as any Judo move Rousey ever made, as none of her Judo moves she used were strictly correct in Judo due to the lack of gi's in MMA. But you just wanted to harp on an insignificant detail to criticize (tool move to somewhat use your terminology) while the purpose of TS' question was obviously to inquire for gifs of the throws/sweeps Valentina used and with little importance to which discipline they strictly would fit best in.
you can justify your nonsense all you want, but that was pure MT in that gif. end of story
 
Makes me wonder why Rousey looked so weak in the clinch against Holm.

To be fair, Valentina looked weak on the takedown attempts she didn't get. Holly muscled her against the cage several times.
 
Makes me wonder why Rousey looked so weak in the clinch against Holm.

After watching both fights again, I think it's because Ronda was fighting Holm strength for strength in her failed take downs whereas Shevchenko was able to use Holm's momentum against her to get her down. When Ronda got a hold of Holm, they were mostly standing still and Rousey was trying to straight up muscle her to the ground with a throw. On Shevchenko's successful attempts, she bounced Holly off the fence and/or got her spun around and then used the direction change to put Holm off balance and trip her to the ground. On her failed attempts it was the same as with Holly vs. Ronda, she couldn't get any movement going and had to go strength for strength against Holm, and Holly is strong enough to stuff those attempts.
 
you can justify your nonsense all you want, but that was pure MT in that gif. end of story

Because every technique only exists in one sport? There is only a hook in boxing and not in kickboxing. Boxing already claimed it, right? Whatever, buddeh.
 
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