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SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: Week 215 - Good Time

Discussion in 'Mayberry Lounge' started by europe1, Jun 24, 2020.

  1. moreorless87 Straba

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    I'd agree its a strong feature of these kinds of films and perhaps that's exactly why they looked to focus on it? the argument between Connie and Ray at the end gets very specific with the former talking about dependence on family or welfare as a negative and that the latter "serves no purpose to society", heck he even takes a negative view of his drinking, all seems very Jordan Petersonish to me, a Sherdog bro flamewar onscreen. We see a character who whilst he values self suffiencent is ultimately constantly depending on manipulating others by any means possible.
     
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  2. Yotsuya Purple Belt

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    I take your word for it. For me Safdie movies aren’t intellectual but all about aestehtics of quirky mental and emotional landscapes.
     
  3. HenryFlower (sheesh!)

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    this post gets

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  4. moreorless87 Straba

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    This is actually the first thing of their I'v seen so I can't talk about there careers but I wouldn't say this was really an intellectual film but the character does I think have that aspect to him driving his actions and the drama. I mean he's not a protagonist were sposed to unequivocally root for is he? it feels like the story of such a character gradually unravelling.
     
  5. europe1 It´s a nice peninsula to Asia

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    Lamo. I know right? It's even more unbelievable considering Connie is supposed to be this cunning crook.

    "Who takes their mentally retarded brother on a bank heist" reminds me of Eyes Wide Shut where I complained about "what kind of loser takes a New York taxi to an upscale cult-orgy?"

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    I'm gonna assume that "south pole jackets" translates into European as Adidas tracksuit;)

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    Really? For me, this movie pretty much amounted to "funny twists". The money gets paint-bombed. The wrong guy gets rescued. The security-guard gets arrested. It essentially worked best as a dark comedy.

    Yeah. One of those statements that everything would have worked out better if Connie would just have let Nick stay institutionalised.

    Which... I must say... seems to run contrary to the theme of the film. There seems to be a tendency of the legal system being portrayed as inept and malfunctioning. Consider:

    * When Nick first gets put in jail -- there is a brawl in his cell which the security-guards seems to be able to do nothing about.
    * Nick -- a mentally handicapped man -- gets placed in general penitentiary which ends with him becoming assaulted.
    *Ray having spent 2 years in jail and rather than reform him, it has only aggravated his criminal prolifications.
    *Them watching the Cops footage and getting upset how poorly the arrest was handled
    *Crystal being arrested by the cops despite having done nothing at all.

    I mean, an ending where Nick (tragically) ends up in jail just like his brother seems much more fitting to the narrative considering what we've seen come before. The legal system going "nah this guy is mentally handicapped get him proper help" doesn't seem like the attentive, right-thinking decision they'd do.

    Robert Pattinson is kind of having the same career-trajectory as Leonardo DiCaprio. He got big by being a teenage heartthrob (Twilight vs Titanic) which embarrassed the fuck out of him so now he's staring in all these challenging, weighty flicks so to get back his actors-creed (like: Lighthouse, Z, The King, this flick).

    I was kinda middling on him. It worked but I wasn't all that moved. Mostly I hate Pattinson and his try-hard attitude for being far-and-away the worst part of The King (which was otherwise really good).

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    They mentioned wanting to buy a farm in Virginia and live in their lonesome.

    Which... doesn't seem like a life that Connie would enjoy but... okay.

    He's now the Captain of his own mind.:cool:

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    The counsellor said that he's "where's he's supposed to be" so he's back in acting-school jail. :cool:

    Yeah, I have to agree it's a real concrete jungle.

    For New York though, the sleazier the better. That's why 80's New York is the best. Lately, it has become so clean-looking. Ugh.

    Subtitle Europeans > Dub/Eng Europeans:cool:

    Honestly, I have no idea how you English/Dubb people ever manage such scenes. Or scenes where someone is mumbling or whispering. Like... how in gods name do you discern what they're saying? Do you have hyper-ears or something?

    I'm the complete opposite. Uncut Gems was far better. Just a more cohesive character-study which a better sense of escalation. This movie was more funny twist after funny twist.

    While I agree that "builds its acid trip rabbit hole atmosphere" is the films greatest virtue (this really seems like the Directors speciality having seen Uncut Gems) I do think that Connie's independence-booyah speech fell kind of flat in terms of thematic-impact.

    It really should have felt like some profound statement considering his manipulative-ways. But instead of feeling culminating of everything we've seen so far (like for example in Easy Rider where they say "we blew it") it just feels like something spat out there.

    Considering how the film was improvised, I do wonder if it was something Patterson just came up with on the spot or if it was pre-planned.

    I would just like to state that I categorically loathe the "shallow focus closeups" esthetic.

    It's like the new seasons of TUF where they just cram the camera so close to a person that it bumps into their nose. :D
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2020
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  6. HARRISON_3 Gold Belt

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    During the jail fight scene, I kept thinking that Nick was gonna pull out some retard strength and beat the hell outta those two dudes.
     
  7. HTTR21 Changing roosters into hens.

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    It’s not cool to stereotype retards bro.
     
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  8. HARRISON_3 Gold Belt

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    Like

    Edit: I meant the jail scene where he changes the channel on the TV
     
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  9. Bullitt68 Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    In all seriousness, what movie did you watch? Because there's no way that you're talking about the same movie that I watched. Literally none of this has anything to do with Good Time. In line with @Yotsuya, I would argue that this movie is almost apolitical. It's entirely fueled by emotionality, there's almost nothing of intellectual substance here on the theme or message level. But the funniest part is that if you really dig and you try really hard to extract something political, the only thing that you're going to find is anathema to anything even resembling a right wing or libertarian position/ethos, specifically in the scenes first with Connie and Crystal watching Cops and Connie showing his three-years-too-soon righteous indignation at cops taking crazy people off the streets - the only thing lamer than a lowlife career criminal rooting against the cops is acting like doing so gives him the moral high ground - and then with the "mean" cops who "don't have time for this shit" showing up at the amusement park and taking Crystal away. The only thing missing to situate this movie on the left side of the aisle is a giant BLM protest for Connie to run through, scored of course to loud faux intense synth "music."

    As for the Jordan Peterson comment, I'm just going to ignore that because nobody who's read a single line of his writing or watched a single video of his in full would think that any of the morons in this movie exemplify anything that he's ever talked about.

    Finally, to your comments about Connie's "high degree of intelligence": You mean the guy who broke the wrong person out of the hospital? That highly intelligent individual?

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    Now that you've put an actually good movie on the table for discussion, I'm going to have to step in and defend it. Leaving aside the reasonable and entirely plausible "character motivation" explanation - a cab is quicker, easier, and cheaper than a limo or a car service, especially given Cruise's characters limited information and given that he couldn't have possibly expected that he'd be walking into that - there's also the more intriguing "thematic" explanation. To the degree that Eyes Wide Shut operates like a Kafkaesque nightmare, the fact that everything, down to his mode of transportation, would betray Cruise follows perfectly the trajectory of a nightmare. Exposed in front of everybody, almost being made to stand naked before your tormentors, it's literally the stuff that nightmares are made of.

    Haha, one of my favorite "culture shock" moments when I was with my Lithuanian ex was learning this Adidas thing. In my homeland of Chicago, that's just jock attire, but in her world, it's low class Eurotrash attire.



    She legit had a hard time dealing with me wearing Adidas. In response, I of course taunted her endlessly with my three stripe style :cool:

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    It could've worked as a dark comedy. This could've been a good Coen Brothers style, Raising Arizona/Burn After Reading-esque nonsense trek. Hell, Chad Feldheimer would've been a great partner-in-crime for Connie.

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    Unfortunately, the intelligence, the inspiration, and the skill weren't there to pull something like this off. If you got enjoyment out of it by laughing at the idiocy, great, but don't give the filmmakers credit for crafting some brilliant dark comedy. You're the one doing the heavy lifting here, europe. Keep the credit for yourself ;)
     
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  10. HTTR21 Changing roosters into hens.

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    Yeah the only thing deep about Connie is how deep the Narcissist in him runs.


    OT: I would love to discuss Enemy staring Jake Gyllenhaal with you all. That movie needs to get put into a vote because there’s a lot to talk about.
     
  11. moreorless87 Straba

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    Yep I wouldn't disagree with that, unlike Long Good Friday when you see Shand increasingly reveals his flaws and see how ineffectve his tawdry methods are it doesn't ever feel like this film really builds up to a denouement of character. Connie's nature and actions stay pretty similar throughout the film and the shift is moreso events spirals out of control.

    I would definitely agree with you that "shallow focus closeups" have become overused in modern arthouse(ish) with directors thinking that they alone will make a seen visually interesting, someone like Jonathan Glazer might use them a lot but rarely are they the only aspect of interest to a shot. To be fair though I would say with this film things start out relatively uninteresting exactly because the main dramatic shift across it is actually the visuals

    I spose you could tie those two together as well and say that closeups are most effective when there getting across a subtly of character which doesn't really happen here.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2020
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  12. Yotsuya Purple Belt

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    I think Safdie brothers are trying to come up with some completely new flavour of cinema combining humour, gringe, despair and suspense.
     
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  13. moreorless87 Straba

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    What came to mind for me was Michaël R. Roskam's work(not seen The Drop but Bullhead and Racer and the Jailbird) trying to merge crime thriller with visually expansive arthouse drama.
     
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  14. KOQ24 Gold Belt

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    Never noticed any comedic moments in Bullhead or The Drop.

    Like i wrote before the Safdie bros. work reminds me most of Lumet's work.The criminals in Dog Day Afternoon are just as stupid as in Good Time.
     
  15. moreorless87 Straba

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    Not sure I'd say there was much overt comedy here either but its true his films are much more straight laced, it does I spose highlight the differences in scale as well Roskam goes in for pretty grand drama were as this(and from the sound of it uncut gems) largely avoid that.
     
  16. Yotsuya Purple Belt

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    Good Time is more macabre than humorous. Uncut Gems has a bit more straighforwardly daft approach.
     
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  17. Yotsuya Purple Belt

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    Just watched The Drop. Really good. I hadn't realised it's Roskam's movie.
     
  18. moreorless87 Straba

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    No I didn't pickup on it at the time either or I might have made more effort to watch it, I'm guessing it didn't make enough to break him into Hollywood though hence going back to Belgium for Le Fidèle/Racer and the Jaillbird(the worst renaming in film history?), I get the sense that didn't do too well either on the back of the trailer painting it as a conventional thriller.
     
  19. JoanHodges White Belt

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    IMHO the Good Time is a little overestimated.
     
  20. HARRISON_3 Gold Belt

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