SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: WEEK 120: Eyes Wide Shut

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To you point about Alice and shinning, she also seemed to know that Dr. Harford was about to cheat on her with the prostitute since she called him as it was about to happen.

Yea I have to figure out some explanation for the fact that Alice dreams what Bill saw at the black mass, knows where his wallet is, and calls him before he makes a mistake and sleeps with Domino. Then he finds out Domino had HIV. At that exact moment Alice saves Bill and probably the marriage as well. The dream though, its more than just coincidence. At the end of the film in the toy store Bill tells Alice, "Sometimes a dream isn't just a dream." If she had "the shining" then that would explain it but obviously I have no idea what Kubrick's intent was. The shining is just another way to say she was in some way psychic or experienced premonitions. Alice gives us reason to believe that something unusual is afoot because I know and Kubrick knows that Alice can't just randomly dream what Bill experienced.
 
I can't help what Kubrick has done with his films. Some of the stuff I post is for fun but a lot of it is undeniable. The piano player being named Nightingale is no accident, same with the stars of Ishtar at the first party. Kubrick presents us, in a subtle way, with mysteries that many viewers don't ever pick up on, like how did Alice dream what Bill saw?

I've noticed in a few threads that you seem to know a lot of cool esoteric stuff. I like reading that kind if stuff so keep on keeping on!
 
In all my research for this film I never came across this information and I'm dumbfounded you actually own that.
There was a new Finnish edition released around early 2000's. I suppose someone had bought it and dumped the old one. The original title is Traumnovelle (Dream novel). Eyes Wide Shut sounds like someone who has his/her eyes closed but still observes something vividly and that sounds like dreaming to me.
 
I don't even know what it is you are trying to say here. It goes right over my head.

He gets the phone-call after Alice shares with him her sexual fantasy about the sailor, which completely shatters his self-image.

He is supposed to meet a patient's relative who had just died. However, the way he describes it to Alice, he uses the phrase "I have to go show my face." Think about that. That's usually not how you would go about describing such a turn of event. Normally, he would just have said "A patient has died. I need to go see them", right? So why the queer phrasing?

Importantly, it's this phrase that starts his dream-journey where he encounters sex, vices, and temptations in various vignettes. It's basically the entire midldle-act of the film. His journey ends with him at the orgy -- unmasking himself, showing his face in humiliation. Thus, "he has to go show his face"... at the orgy. He's basically hinting at how the journey will end at its very start. It's all part of the dream-like atmosphere this film conjures.


"Showing my face" is also a very prescient phrase in a movie like this. It's about how people wear "masks" in their sex-life. The masks at the pillow in the ending isn't just a threat towards Bill. It also symbolizes how he has worn a mask with Alice, not really connecting to her intimately. Just like how the patricians have sex at their orgy with masks, completely devoid of sexual intimacy. Having to "show his face," is about how he comes level with Alice, finally acknowledging what's lacking in their relationship.

So, on a more abstract level, his journey also teaches him to show his face for his wife. Making it a double-foreshadowing, I suppose.

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He gets the phone-call after Alice shares with him her sexual fantasy about the sailor, which completely shatters his self-image.

He is supposed to meet a patient's relative who had just died. However, the way he describes it to Alice, he uses the phrase "I have to go show my face." Think about that. That's usually not how you would go about describing such a turn of event. Normally, he would just have said "A patient has died. I need to go see them", right? So why the queer phrasing?

Importantly, it's this phrase that starts his dream-journey where he encounters sex, vices, and temptations in various vignettes. It's basically the entire midldle-act of the film. His journey ends with him at the orgy -- unmasking himself, showing his face in humiliation. Thus, "he has to go show his face"... at the orgy. He's basically hinting at how the journey will end at its very start. It's all part of the dream-like atmosphere this film conjures.


"Showing my face" is also a very prescient phrase in a movie like this. It's about how people wear "masks" in their sex-life. The masks at the pillow in the ending isn't just a threat towards Bill. It also symbolizes how he has worn a mask with Alice, not really connecting to her intimately. Just like how the patricians have sex at their orgy with masks, completely devoid of sexual intimacy. Having to "show his face," is about how he comes level with Alice, finally acknowledging what's lacking in their relationship.

So, on a more abstract level, his journey also teaches him to show his face for his wife. Making it a double-foreshadowing, I suppose.

IlluminatiWatcherDotCom-Eyes-Wide-Shut-Mask-29-WO.jpg

gdamn son, you thought I was going to get all that out of a meme? <45>

I understand that you want to focus on a main theme of the film which is fidelity but this film is so much more.

What happened to Nick Nightingale? Was he killed?
What happened to Mandy? Accident or made to look like an accident?
How did Alice dream what happened to Bill?

Why did Kubrick film the final scene placing Helena following two suspect men we saw earlier in the movie? He specifically placed them in the center of the frame. Its one of the most important scenes in the film and a detail hard to pick up on.

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Helen looks back at her mother as she follows them away.

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before he makes a mistake and sleeps with Domino.

In Sharkey's Machine the high class escort played by Rachel Ward was named Dominoe. Probably just a meaningless coincidence. Been meaning to watch that one again. Was a pretty cool movie as a kid.


Eyes Wide Shut sounds like someone who has his/her eyes closed but still observes something vividly and that sounds like dreaming to me.

To me it's more like where the eyes are open but not seeing what's truly going on. That would be Cruise heading into the film with his naivete. Or it could be that after being exposed to everything in the movie he sorta needs to ignore it all and go back to living his life.
 
To me it's more like where the eyes are open but not seeing what's truly going on. That would be Cruise heading into the film with his naivete. Or it could be that after being exposed to everything in the movie he sorta needs to ignore it all and go back to living his life.
Could mean one thing regarding Alice and the another regarding William.
 
What's the first thing that happens? Some frat boys call him a f*g. They insinuate that he's a friend of Dorothy! This once again symbolizes his feeling of emasculation. He's self-pitying now, not at all the suave tuxedo who ensnared two girls at once.

Nothing kills ones sense of masculinity like getting shoved by a frat boy who calls you a f*g.
 
This movie is raw to the point of being uncomfortable. Love the eerie piano and overall creepy vibe.

The scene where Alice tells Bill about her fantasy of cheating on him was extremely uncomfortable. I was like....

th


The creepy piano is really cool to me because instead of just having it be a creepy score for the film, it was integrated into the film because Nick Nightingale was a pianist who played at the parties.
 
To me it's more like where the eyes are open but not seeing what's truly going on. That would be Cruise heading into the film with his naivete. Or it could be that after being exposed to everything in the movie he sorta needs to ignore it all and go back to living his life.

I also think it's referencing symbolism in the world.

Everywhere we look there is symbolism of the elite occult. Evidence of secret societies.
Yet most are unaware (or choose to ignore it) even though it's right in their faces.

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Could be targeted specifically at Hollywood, especially considering everything that's been coming out lately. "Everyone knew" but no one said anything.

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I think it's a better movie without the mystery of the dead hooker from the orgy plotline. It really adds nothing to the basic tale and comes up short if it's supposed to symbolize something greater with Cruise's psyche.

I agree. It also pushes suspension of disbelief. The odds of it being the same woman are so low. There are a lot of people in New York!
 
Eyes Wide Shut is a film about the Illuminati, its about black magic, sex magic, and the elite circles that engage in these things. The cover of the film is Nicole Kidman with one eye symbolism, Illuminati. It is also framed in a mirror which is an occult item used to contact other realms, demon possession, portals etc.

I also think it shows her looking away, as in at someone outside her marriage, while Cruise is intently focused on her. This describes they state they were in when the movie started.
 
Premise: A New York City doctor, who is married to an art curator, pushes himself on a harrowing and dangerous night-long odyssey of sexual and moral discovery after his wife admits that she once almost cheated on him.

I disagree that she almost cheated on him. She described a reaction to a person. At no point did she act on it. One of the premises of the film is whether simply desiring someone is equivalent to acting on said desire, or in Cruise's case almost choosing to act before feeling desire (the prostitute hitting on him on the street versus him approaching someone he wanted.)
 
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