SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: WEEK 119: The Pope Of Greenwich Village

[BisexualMMA]

Is this your way of telling us you're not an Angel Heart fan?

It's decent. It's certainly not great. I'd probably rather rewatch Johnny Handsome.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

I'd say this is one of those films where the characters are more interesting than likable. Which, IMO, Carlie and Pauline really are.

I don't know how interesting they were. Annoying sounds closer. Movie might have worked better as a comedy. Otherwise I'm just watching two fuckups fuck shit up and cause nothing but trouble for themselves. Then at the end they wander into the sunset giggling like schoolgirls.

 

[MusterX]

* Second best scene of the movie. Geraldine Page acted her heart out there.

I loved when she said my brother is a parish priest, we could get on the evening news and do a number on this whole city, SO YOU WANNA FIGHT!

That was the best scene in the movie for me, the linchpin that tied it together. It brought to the surface the protagonists underlying characteristics and motivations. Charlie wants to remain tribal, even if it damns him. It's habitus, that feeling of belonging -- being stuck even -- to some group in society, and for Charlie it's very intrinsic.

That were some weird irregularities with that relationship. Charlie tells Baron Harkonnen than he and Paulie are only cousins, then he says, only 3rd cousins, as if to say they aren't even that close but in reality they walk arm and arm like they are married. Its strange to see. I can't find the scene but at one point Charlie and Paulie are crossing the street and Paulie is literally on Charlie's arm like they are a married couple.

The best summary about his character is that he's the kind of guys that swallow all the pills in the box at once. Eric Roberts went full "Last Exit to Brooklyn" on that performance.

Last Exit to Brooklyn was surprisingly good. Are you saying Roberts went Alexis Arquette level performance? I still can't get over the fact that Alexis Arquette was Georgette in Last Exit to Brooklyn...

And also the bathroom shooter from Pulp Fiction.

Frankly, I thought the worst part was the ending. Paulie has just fucked up... again. Bed Bug Eddie is going to shit concrete for hours -- but revenge is undoubtedly coming.

You cannot even comprehend the spit take I did when Bed Bug Eddie jumped up and dived head first through a door. What in the fuck....he dived head first through a glass door while loosening his tie lol.

I really thought Charlie was going to punch Paulie when he said 'what do you need a suit for, you don't got no job' for a second time.

LMAO, Paulie said it with a straight face too. Charlie's like, I fuckin dare you to say that again and Paulie just says it again right to his face.

I liked when Kick boxer chick cracked Charlie w/ gloves on leading to sexy time

Charlie asked her, was that an accident and she just pretty much says nope, not an accident.

The part when they got rolled on while opening the safe, and the cop immediately dies. I liked that.

Poor fucker derailed like a freight train taking a dirt road and went straight down an elevator shaft. I didn't know that Charlie took the tape he had which was the tape he tried to threaten Bed Bug Eddie with at the end of the film, and then of course Paulie screwed that up too.

I laughed at Barney's Irish music escape through the floor.

I can never unsee Baron Harkonnen.

"How did you let this happen to you?"
"Well, I let me whole life happen to me."

One of the best lines of the film, we all let life happen to us.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

I can't find the scene but at one point Charlie and Paulie are crossing the street and Paulie is literally on Charlie's arm like they are a married couple.

I definitely got a gay vibe this time around.

Last Exit to Brooklyn was surprisingly good.

 

[Coolthulu]

Seriously...

This must have been the inspiration for the 'call on me' video

 

[Coolthulu]

You're laughing at their absurd attire?

Bud.

Nothing about Eric Roberts' attire is absurd.

Here's the thing about Eric Roberts.......

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Bud.

Nothing about Eric Roberts' attire is absurd.

Here's the thing about Eric Roberts.......

I'm wondering if you're a little forgiving in your assessments.

 

[Scott Parker 27]

NOTE to NON-MEMBERS: Interested in joining the SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB? Shoot me a PM for more info!

Here's a quick list of all movies watched by the SMC. Or if you prefer, here's a more detailed examination.

Our Director

(that's the mustach that directed Cool Hand Luke, people)​

Stuart Rosenberg was born on August 11, 1927 in Brooklyn, New York City, New York, USA. He was a director and producer, known for Cool Hands Luke (1967), Question 7 (1961) and The Defenders (1961). He was married to Margot Pohoryles. He died on March 15, 2007 in Beverly Hills, Los Angeles, California, USA.​

Our Stars
Eric Roberts

Mickey Rourke

​

Film Overview

Premise: Two cousins unknowingly rob the mob and face the dangerous consequences.

Budget: $8 million
Box Office: $6.8 million

Trivia
(courtesy of IMDB)
​

* Michael Cimino was asked to direct this film but didn't think it was a good film for him. As a favor to the producers, who were on a deadline, he went to New York and did all the preproduction. When they were set to begin shooting, the producers again tried to get Cimino to direct but he told them he thought, considering the budget, they needed someone who could work faster than he was used to working and so they hired Rosenberg.

* According to author' Christopher Heard', the movie was originally planned to feature the first on-screen pairing of Robert De Niro and Al Pacino, with the duo set to play Charlie and Paulie respectively. In the end, Charlie and Paulie were cast with Mickey Rourke and Eric Roberts respectively.

* The movie did actually utilize the "Greenwich Village" of the film's The Pope Of Greenwich Village (1984) title, situated in Lower Manhattan, New York City, as a filming location.

* A number of film directors have been attached or associated with the production of this picture. These have included Ulu Grosbard, Michael Cimino, Ron Maxwell, and finally, Stuart Rosenberg was the film's director.

Members: @europe1 @MusterX @Scott Parker 27 @the muntjac @Cubo de Sangre @sickc0d3r @FrontNakedChoke @AndersonsFoot @Tufts @Coolthulu @Yotsuya @jei @LHWBelt @Deus Ex Machina @ArtemV @Bullitt68

Loved this movie, it's a real look back at the old school NYC. I know a lot of other posters have compared this film to mean streets, and I can easily see that, but I thought Mickey Rourke was amazing in this, Eric Roberts, meh, he kind of took me out of the movie. Wasn't sure if he was going for mailman or Forrest Gump retard. Maybe I'm biased because I have seen him in a lot of other films such as hatchetman where he plays a real nut.

 

[Coolthulu]

I'm wondering if you're a little forgiving in your assessments.

 

[Coolthulu]

* So here we have Rourke sitting alone against the wall of a ruined apartment in New York after being abandoned by his loved one. Didn't we see this exact same moment in Light Sleeper, which was also a Coolthulu nomination? Does he have some sort of strange fascination going on?

I'm so glad you picked up on that......

 

[Coolthulu]

How Eric Roberts Went Big, Crashed Hard, and Became the Hardest-Working Man in Hollywood

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2018/01/eric-roberts-the-hardest-working-man-in-hollywood

His insanity is intoxicating



In 1983, Eric was appearing in Hartford in The Glass Menagerie when he got the script for The Pope of Greenwich Village, based on the darkly comic best-seller by Vince Patrick. It came with a note from the producers offering him the lead role of either Paulie or Charlie, Italian cousins who get on the wrong side of the Mob after pulling off a heist. Eric studied the script and chose Paulie, the younger, edgier cousin, only to hear that they’d hoped he’d play Charlie, because they didn’t think he looked tough enough to play the hothead would-be mobster Paulie. But he didn’t want to look tough—he wanted to play him as “a mama’s boy who wants to be a tough guy, because I know those guys.” So he lost 30 pounds and had his hair permed, and he played Paulie as a hyped-up, reckless dumb-ass who gets his thumb sliced off by Bedbug Eddie’s henchmen.

Eric felt that the producers—and Mickey Rourke, his co-star—were not happy. That’s not how they saw the character.

Eric recalls, “O.K., we get five days of rehearsal before we’re starting to shoot. It’s the last week of August. I’m ready to go. I know every word of my dialogue. I’m in character. I spent a lot of time in Little Italy.” (After The Pope of Greenwich Village,Eric says, he never had to pay for a cup of espresso in Little Italy again.) “I know what I’m doing—I know all the lingo.”

Three days in, the director asked Eric to resign.

“So I went up to Mickey’s room”—they were staying at the Mayflower Hotel in Manhattan. “What’s up? The director asked me to resign. What?! So we called the producers and they fired that director.” They eventually hired Stuart Rosenberg (Cool Hand Luke, The Amityville Horror) to take over, and he understood what Eric was after. And Eric’s Paulie is unforgettable—a driving piston of big dreams and bad ideas, alongside Rourke’s cool, savvy, heroic Charlie. They are great together, but in scene after scene you just can’t take your eyes off Eric. He nails it again, playing another schizo-affective personality, a dangerous, charismatic dude, which meant producers stopped thinking of him as a leading man. He was just too good as Paulie.

He’d crossed over.

He sure did.

 

[Coolthulu]

Ten years earlier, that would've been cool, but by 1984, no fucking way. And besides, De Niro already did this movie ten years earlier. It was called Mean Streets. I'll come back to this when I have time to contribute properly to this thread, but The Pope of Greenwich Village is basically Mean Streets with Mickey Rourke playing the Harvey Keitel character and Eric Roberts playing the De Niro character.

It's basically Mean Streets' wildly uneven and weirdly comical spiritual cousin. Roberts and Rourke play off of each other fantastically.

Both get out-acted by Daryl Hannah's ass though.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

How Eric Roberts Went Big, Crashed Hard, and Became the Hardest-Working Man in Hollywood

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2018/01/eric-roberts-the-hardest-working-man-in-hollywood

His insanity is intoxicating



In 1983, Eric was appearing in Hartford in The Glass Menagerie when he got the script for The Pope of Greenwich Village, based on the darkly comic best-seller by Vince Patrick. It came with a note from the producers offering him the lead role of either Paulie or Charlie, Italian cousins who get on the wrong side of the Mob after pulling off a heist. Eric studied the script and chose Paulie, the younger, edgier cousin, only to hear that they’d hoped he’d play Charlie, because they didn’t think he looked tough enough to play the hothead would-be mobster Paulie. But he didn’t want to look tough—he wanted to play him as “a mama’s boy who wants to be a tough guy, because I know those guys.” So he lost 30 pounds and had his hair permed, and he played Paulie as a hyped-up, reckless dumb-ass who gets his thumb sliced off by Bedbug Eddie’s henchmen.

Eric felt that the producers—and Mickey Rourke, his co-star—were not happy. That’s not how they saw the character.

Eric recalls, “O.K., we get five days of rehearsal before we’re starting to shoot. It’s the last week of August. I’m ready to go. I know every word of my dialogue. I’m in character. I spent a lot of time in Little Italy.” (After The Pope of Greenwich Village,Eric says, he never had to pay for a cup of espresso in Little Italy again.) “I know what I’m doing—I know all the lingo.”

Three days in, the director asked Eric to resign.

“So I went up to Mickey’s room”—they were staying at the Mayflower Hotel in Manhattan. “What’s up? The director asked me to resign. What?! So we called the producers and they fired that director.” They eventually hired Stuart Rosenberg (Cool Hand Luke, The Amityville Horror) to take over, and he understood what Eric was after. And Eric’s Paulie is unforgettable—a driving piston of big dreams and bad ideas, alongside Rourke’s cool, savvy, heroic Charlie. They are great together, but in scene after scene you just can’t take your eyes off Eric. He nails it again, playing another schizo-affective personality, a dangerous, charismatic dude, which meant producers stopped thinking of him as a leading man. He was just too good as Paulie.

He’d crossed over.

He sure did.

I admit that for 30+ years I've found plenty of occasion to say "...some kind of fuckin' asshoe?" with Eric Roberts' voice in my head.

 

[the muntjac]

I don't really have much to add that hasn't already been said, so I'll just reply to you fine folks.

Ten years earlier, that would've been cool, but by 1984, no fucking way. And besides, De Niro already did this movie ten years earlier. It was called Mean Streets. I'll come back to this when I have time to contribute properly to this thread, but The Pope of Greenwich Village is basically Mean Streets with Mickey Rourke playing the Harvey Keitel character and Eric Roberts playing the De Niro character.

I came to say this, but you were faster than a bullitt. Oh, and you posted it three days ago. It's hard to think about Mean Streets without hearing that Rubber Biscuit song playing in my head.

I have to steal to Simpsons reference before that scoundrel muntjac gets to it first

* Ah yes, aerobics. Instant 80's eroticism in a movie. I miss when they would just randomly insert that. Like in Wargames, when Broody calls his girlfriend, and she's all sweaty and panting from a stretching-routine

I read this, and I thought, "Hey, now's a good chance to drop a Killer Workout reference. I wonder if he's ever seen that one."

And then I read on...

GOAT aerobics film is Killer Workout (1987) though. Slasher movie set in an aerobics studio. And yes... one-third of it is just montages.

You, friend, amaze me. You really seen it all, haven't you?

Frankly, I thought the worst part was the ending. Paulie has just fucked up... again. Bed Bug Eddie is going to shit concrete for hours -- but revenge is undoubtedly coming. But Charlie acts completely cool about it. He has no outbursts or outrages, despite probably having been handed a death-sentence that not even his tape can save him from. Where's the climax here? It feels like we're being driven towards an inevitable endpoint, a cataclysm of all their decisions. What about the consequences? But no, just smile about it. Is it all just some galactic joke? Does it all really just fix itself, like Charlie mumbled? I wanted grimness and consequences, damit!!!

I'm with you that the ending was the worst part about this movie. Everything else was fine - the acting, the dialogue, the beating on pink fridges, but yeah, that ending felt like a cop-out. Like you said, you wanted some grimness and consequences, I was also expecting some finality. Instead, the movie continues its theme of Rourke playing it cool and has it all figured out, but along comes Roberts to fuck it all up, yet they'll stick together through it all. I got your theme, movie, but I wanted to see some payoff with it. I wanted to see things come to a head.

I had a dinner date with the wife and some friends tonight but I did watch the movie. I'll post my thoughts on it tomorrow. AHHHH THEY TOOK MY THUMB! scene is the best thing I've ever seen.

I wasn't sure if I was supposed to laugh when he belts that line out before passing out, but I did. It comes out so bluntly.

Opening song is rad. Love it.

You haven't heard it until you've heard Martin Prince sing it.

The part when they got rolled on while opening the safe, and the cop immediately dies. I liked that.

This was another part where I laughed when I probably wasn't supposed to. Who doesn't like a good dummy fall?

Here's a favorite of mine from a John Stamos/Gene Simmons (yes, you read that right) movie called Never Too Young To Die. (Waits to see if Europe1 has seen this.)

The ending was almost slapstick and didn't really resolve much.

I'm tempted re-edit the scene with cartoon sound effects as a gag if it wouldn't take up too much time.

----------

I feel it's appropriate to leave everybody with this.

 

[Coolthulu]

I admit that for 30+ years I've found plenty of occasion to say "...some kind of fuckin' asshoe?" with Eric Robert's voice in my head.

Really? I thought I was the only one.......

 

[europe1]

I don't know how interesting they were. Annoying sounds closer.

Paulie: human animal

Charlie: Torn between his habitus, tribal-loyalties and his desires to create a new, rich life.

And both are status-obsessed as hell.

Sounds interesting to me.

then he says, only 3rd cousins

Ah, Lebanese cousins.

but in reality they walk arm and arm like they are married

I suppose this bromance was a lot more ardent than any of us first expected.

Are you saying Roberts went Alexis Arquette level performance? I still can't get over the fact that Alexis Arquette was Georgette in Last Exit to Brooklyn...

I was more thinking more about how he embraced the ugly side of his performance.

You cannot even comprehend the spit take I did when Bed Bug Eddie jumped up and dived head first through a door. What in the fuck....he dived head first through a glass door while loosening his tie lol.

Yeah he really dashed head-first through that door. Really good stunt.

You, friend, amaze me. You really seen it all, haven't you?

Of course I have seen every film ever ma--

movie called Never Too Young To Die. (Waits to see if Europe1 has seen this.)

Crud...

 

[sickc0d3r]

All I can say is, Nick Cage eat your heart out. Eric Roberts is the original king of overacting. Every line he belts out like he spent the night before hopped up on meth, practicing in front of a mirror until he landed on the exact inflection of every syllable, and the perfect face contorting emotion, and then passed out on his perm, wearing nothing but a Member's Only jacket and Darryl Hannah's sweaty leotard.

Juxtapose that with this guy...


Who, despite that shirt, brought his usual, smooth and natural delivery to every scene. Prime Rourke was no joke. Hell, alien Rourke is still great.

It felt like an actor's movie, and at times I sort of dug it. It's like they tried to out perform each other. Nobody really disappeared into a character, and I think the big personalities made up for a so-so story. Other times it was ridiculous...

Overall, though, good flick.

Oh, and yeah, Daryl Hannah!

 

[PEB]

Deadpool pretty funny beginning.

 

[sickc0d3r]

* Ah yes, aerobics. Instant 80's eroticism in a movie. I miss when they would just randomly insert that. Like in Wargames, when Broody calls his girlfriend, and she's all sweaty and panting from a stretching-routine

The 80's was the pinnacle of humanity for so many reasons, but random aerobics is in the top ten.

 

[sickc0d3r]

You cannot even comprehend the spit take I did when Bed Bug Eddie jumped up and dived head first through a door. What in the fuck....he dived head first through a glass door while loosening his tie lol.

That was nuts. And then Paulie and Charlie just casually walked down the street, bickering like an old married couple. Such a weird ending.