Social SAT To add ‘Adversity Score’ to Capture Social and Economic Background

[nac386]

maybe I jumped the gun here...

I'm still pissed at what Harvard did and lumped this in with their actions.

That’s the positive aspect of this approach. This particular method removes race completely. It’s a way to talent-spot students from areas where severe challenges prevented them from producing the same exact test scores as students without the same barriers.

I’ve seen people in this thread make the argument that we should entirely ignore the context of achievement. Nobody does that though. The NFL drafts on perceived talent even if it’s undeveloped, not just production. Companies hire based on interviews, not just on resume. Recruiting

Since the beginning of time, wealthy kids have held all the advantages. Colleges want rich kids because their parents donate money, and help earn them esteem. It is bizarre to me that as soon as anything is introduced that may reduces the huge advantage that rich kids have always had, some people get up in arms, even some other low income people.

But I have a theory, and I really think there is truth to it.

Some people from low socioeconomic classes were never hard workers, and because of that they missed any opportunities they had because it just requires way too much work. Too much studying, too much writing, too much networking, and not enough chill time with your friends. They were content in mediocre jobs because they were easy, and did not require dedication. But instead of acknowledging that, they create a fantasy in their minds that they simply were not destined to be financially successful because they did not get the same advantages as rich kids. They are content and satisfied with that, it makes them feel comfortable. It's not their fault, it's just the way of the world.

But if somebody who came from less than them finds a way to do more, oh hell no. It shatters their worldview. Suddenly they are not victims of fate beyond their control, they are underachievers who just didn’t work as hard as the people that are passing them. They need those people below them to feel comfortable.

 

[nac386]

You can't be fucking serious. The NBA rewards the best players. It is a total meritocracy.

How do college basketball programs decide who to recruit? It's not only based on production, it's based on potential. Some of the most highly sought after players are not being recruited for their statistics alone, they are being recruited for their raw ability that has yet to be fully realized for a variety of reasons. Even the NBA/NFL/MLB draft players with their potential in mind, not just their production. It's very clear around NFL draft time when you see quarterbacks with mediocre stats being drafted before quarterbacks with great statistics.

Why? Because statistics do not tell the whole story. Maybe that player overcame poor coaching, mediocre teammates, and a low budget program to produce those statistics and it impressed the scouts more. That player may be much better than a player who produced higher stats.

Just like test scores do not tell the whole story. If a student overcomes great challenges to score a 1350 on SATS. Do you really think a kid with all the possible advantages (best schools, best teachers, best tutors, etc) who scores a 1380 is the better student to recruit? That would be a pretty difficult decision to support.

This stuff is pretty obvious, to be honest. I'm surprised that we have to explain it in this thread. This is nothing new in any industry.

 

[ocean size]

This is crazy. What ever happened to getting in on your own merits. I guarantee the colleges are gonna say we at least this many kids with X "adversity" score.


https://www.wsj.com/articles/sat-to...re-social-and-economic-background-11557999000

The College Board plans to assign an adversity score to every student who takes the SAT to try to capture their social and economic background, jumping into the debate raging over race and class in college admissions.

This new number, called an adversity score by college admissions officers, is calculated using 15 factors including the crime rate and poverty levels from the student’s high school and neighborhood. Students won’t be told the scores, but colleges will see the numbers when reviewing their applications.

Fifty colleges used the score last year as part of a beta test. The College Board plans to expand it to 150 institutions this fall, and then use it broadly the following year.

How colleges consider a student’s race and class in making admissions decisions is hotly contested. Many colleges, including Harvard University, say a diverse student body is part of the educational mission of a school. A lawsuit accusing Harvard of discriminating against Asian-American applicants by holding them to a higher standard is awaiting a judge’s ruling. Lawsuits charging unfair admission practices have also been filed against the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and the University of California

The College Board, the New York based nonprofit that oversees the SAT, said it has worried about income inequality influencing test results for years. White students scored an average of 177 points higher than black students and 133 points higher than Hispanic students in 2018 results. Asian students scored 100 points higher than white students. The children of wealthy and college-educated parents outperformed their classmates.

“There are a number of amazing students who may have scored less [on the SAT] but have accomplished more,” said David Coleman, chief executive of the College Board. “We can’t sit on our hands and ignore the disparities of wealth reflected in the SAT.”

The SAT, which includes math and verbal sections and is still taken with No. 2 pencils, is facing challenges. Federal prosecutors revealed this spring that students cheated on both the SAT and ACT for years as part of a far-reaching college admissions cheating scheme. In Asia and the Middle East, both the ACTand SAT exams have experienced security breaches.

Yale University is one of the schools that has tried using applicants’ adversity scores. Yale has pushed to increase socioeconomic diversity and, over several years, has nearly doubled the number of low-income and first-generation-to-attend-college students to about 20% of newly admitted students, said Jeremiah Quinlan, the dean of undergraduate admissions at Yale.

“This [adversity score] is literally affecting every application we look at,” he said. “It has been a part of the success story to help diversify our freshman class"

Interesting. If criteria are seriously what zip code you live in and how shitty your high school is I think that could be really useful for unis to pick out likely achievers. Kids that go to private schools where you can be a lazy dummy but still get prepped specifically to get into a top tier school with free SAT prep courses and shit are not going to do as well as kids with the same score from a terrible school. Well, the parents tuition checks will do better at least.

 

[panamaican]

You can't be fucking serious. The NBA rewards the best players. It is a total meritocracy.

No, it doesn't and it isn't. If the best player goes to a no name D-2 school he's probably not getting drafted. Whereas a pretty good player at Kentucky has a better shot because of visibility. The NBA looks at where you played college ball when making drafting decisions. Going to the right school helps your draft odds over kids who don't. They draft off of potential all of the time. Kids with big potential but who never won in college often get drafted over kids with longer track records of performance.

Getting drafted into the NBA is absolutely not a meritocracy. People frequently conflate the meritocracy of the on court product with the non-meritocracy of the off the court elements.

 

[lifelessheap]

No, it doesn't and it isn't. If the best player goes to a no name D-2 school he's probably not getting drafted. Whereas a pretty good player at Kentucky has a better shot because of visibility. The NBA looks at where you played college ball when making drafting decisions. Going to the right school helps your draft odds over kids who don't. They draft off of potential all of the time. Kids with big potential but who never won in college often get drafted over kids with longer track records of performance.

Getting drafted into the NBA is absolutely not a meritocracy. People frequently conflate the meritocracy of the on court product with the non-meritocracy of the off the court elements.

If you can play they will find you. Don't be fucking retarded. Do you think NBA teams are going to not sign a guy who is of NBA talent? They can go to Europe or the D-league and play if they think they are skipped over and showcase their skills and talent there and the NBA teams are scouting and watching.

The best players play in the NBA. Meritocracy.

 

[panamaican]

If you can play they will find you. Don't be fucking retarded. Do you think NBA teams are going to not sign a guy who is of NBA talent? They can go to Europe or the D-league and play if they think they are skipped over and showcase their skills and talent there and the NBA teams are scouting and watching.

The best players play in the NBA. Meritocracy.

They don't sign guys of NBA talent all of the time. NBA guys frequently tell stories of guys good enough to play in the league but who aren't for whatever reason. European guys in the NBA tell stories about NBA level talent that never gets discovered because they didn't have the right connections to get seen by an NBA scout.

If you really think that NBA scouts are scouting D-2 and D-3 schools for the best talent then I don't know what to tell you. You clearly don't follow the NBA at a deep level.

As I said - getting drafted into the NBA is not a meritocracy. Getting into the NBA is also not a meritocracy. The amount of connections and visibility needed to even get eyeballed is far larger than you seem to appreciate. Winning in the NBA is a meritocracy.

 

[nac386]

There's really no reason for me to work at all. I do because I'm not a bum but if I wanted to, I could get by leeching off the system.

I'd qualify for all sorts of programs up here in Maine. I wouldn't live luxuriously, but I'd get by fine.

The goal isn't to survive, the goal is to live a life you're proud of. How could you feel like a proud father if you chose not to work? You daughter is learning from you every day, that's why you work instead of collecting benefits.