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Ryan Hall training with Eddie Bravo - Good or Bad?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by ZuZitsu**, Sep 10, 2010.

  1. ZuZitsu** Purple Belt

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    After watching the Hall v Franca match....hearing Eddie commentate, and sounding very impressed with Ryan, I guarantee he left him an open invite to go out to Cali to train with him anytime.

    I wonder if Ryan learning Eddie's system would be good or bad for his game?

    His flexibility would make his rubber guard game completely insane BUT I think a big part of Ryan Hall's genius is in his scrambles and the fact that he doesnt have a linear game. His use of inverted guard, tornado rolls etc is what makes him so nasty.

    So would slowly down his game and using the rubber guard benefit him? Or hurt him?

    Eddies twister system is a different story all together. The twister is something I think would flow very naturally into Ryans game. I realize of course that Ryan Hall already knows the twister but Im sure Eddie has a dozen different ways of getting to it that Ryan doesnt use.

    However, I think the Twister would flow much better into Ryan's game. Ryan obviously is someone who likes to take the back but if he doenst get both hooks in he typically gets shrugged off and ends up looking for a triangle. I think keeping one hook and using his slick scrambling ability to transition to the twister would be good thing for him.

    Anyway boys what do u think? Would Ryan Hall flourish in Eddie's system or would it not be a good fit?

    BTW I don't necessarily think that Eddie is better than Ryan....but you dont have to be better than someone to be able to teach them something.

    Please keep the Eddie hate to a minimum or none at all! By now you should recognize that he has done nothing but good things for BJJ. So lets just keep this thread about whether or not Eddie could possibly help Ryans game or not.
     
  2. MisterRay Orange Belt

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    I'd like to think that Ryan Hall is knowledgeable enough to know what techniques he will benefit from or hurt his game. While the rubber guard is a big part of Bravo's system it isn't limited to that one aspect. I haven't really looked into any of Bravo's books or videos but someone who has been doing jiu-jitsu as long as he has can definitely show Hall a thing or two.
     
  3. Steelviper Green Belt

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    You must not have seen Ryan's triangle DVD set. He has some issues with rubber guard, and breaks down some of the reasons why he doesn't like it. In short, he doesn't like the way it kills your own hip mobility.
     
  4. fourfif** Banned Banned

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    this.
     
  5. HardEight Blue Belt

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    Let's try not to speculate on what Eddie did just by listening to his commentary.
    Ryan's game has always been pretty much catered to himself.
    I am sure if he ever wanted to try rubber guard, he would. And at one time a while back there was a picture of Ryan using something from the RG system, but he has also made comments on how he doesn't care for the system all that much.
    Ryan bashing the RG system has been discussed over and over so look it up and decide for yourself.
    I think he even called mission control "crap" on one of his DVD's?
     
  6. ZuZitsu** Purple Belt

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    No I didnt see them....educate me! What did he say??
     
  7. newerest Purple Belt

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    the uber flexible ryan hall is usually cited when people try to talk shit about the rubber guard. he says that keeping someone's weight directly on you isn't what a good guard is about. he also doesn't like the pulling your leg infront of their face when going for an omaplata. I agree when I say that you can't just pull your leg infront of them, assuming you don't have the hand trapped and a foot on the hip for the correct angle.

    Many people "try rubber guard", and they can't do it for shit. Not saying ryan can't, he just doesn't need to. If ryan hall did mma I think he would put a lot more effort into rubber guard.

    in pure submission grappling, it is definitely not the end all be all guard. not at all. you can stifle someone with the home alone defense and if they can't get the hand on the mat then, rubber guard isn't useful. in mma you can't stall like this, hence why one reason the rubber guard is really an mma guard.

    with that being said, yes, anyone can benefit from having a good twister side control. I'm sure ryan will pick up a few transistions to the back and the twister to even better develop his already stellar offense
     
  8. ZuZitsu** Purple Belt

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    All good points! I really didnt know that Ryan was Anti-Rubber Guard! Usually when people start bashing Eddie I tune them out. I see a lot of genius in Eddie's systems so I get annoyed when the haters come out.
     
  9. newerest Purple Belt

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    the thing that is so badass about eddie's system is when you use the basics to break someone down, you have options from rubber guard. without basics in hipping out, breaking posture, wrist control even, you can't get to rubber guard.

    all rubber guard is, is a high guard. like an open high guard haha.

    When you get a shoulder locked in rubber guard...spider web is always so close by.

    I don't get why barely anyone uses spider web. Roger uses spider web.
     
  10. fourfif** Banned Banned

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    yup that was a solid post, thank newerest.

    I'm with you that shit pisses me off. I train at 10th p and don't even use the rg, they don't shove rg down your throat like people say. I also agree it's more of an mma guard.
     
  11. Number1Wrestler** Green Belt

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    Ryan Hall bashed the rubber guard at every opportunity in his Triangle DVD set...its a real slap in the face to Eddie Bravo, but everyone is entitled to his/her own opinions. I love that DVD set btw.
     
  12. Mat Nemesis** Green Belt

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    I would say it would be bad because there is only a certain amount of time you can train, and he would be better suited to training with the top competitors out there instead of learning Bravo's system.

    I would guess he would get more out of rolling with guys like marcelo than learning 10th pjj stuff.
     
  13. curb1850 Green Belt

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    Yeah he seemed to dog it, I'd have to look it up on the DVDs to see exactly what he said but it wasn't very positive.
     
  14. newerest Purple Belt

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    I really don't think that's a slap in the face at all

    he just doesn't agree that staying square with someone if you can hip out is the best form of attack in submission grappling...I use rubber guard and I definitely agree

    I only use the lockdown when I can't use the turk to get on my side with the underhook. People bitch that the lockdown is only used when you're flat on your back. NO SHIT, that's what the person on top wants! if you get stuck there, use the lockdown!

    I only use the rubber guard when someone is stalling in my guard by locking my hips down. If he's chilling with his posture broken, directly on top of me, then the only option I can fucking see is rubber guard! People bitch like it's a bad guard to use because of these reasons...it's crazy man.

    Every technique has its place. You can't got for an ankle lock when you have someone mounted...just like you can just try to pull rubber guard without the foot on the hip
     
  15. akdms Blue Belt

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    As I understand it Ryan tried getting RB to work for a year or so. While he didn't train with EB, I'd think that would be sufficient time get a decent feeling for it, especially for a guy like Ryan.

    But yeah, I agree that I don't think it would help him much to go out to Cali and dedicate himself to RB instead of training with top competitors and refining his current style.

    I also don't think that Ryan has nearly the same level of flexibility that Eddie does.
     
  16. newerest Purple Belt

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    ryan hall can put himself in a triangle with one arm in. he's more flexible than eddie
     
  17. Kenny from MD Less angry than before.

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    Original post is just flawed in the evaluation of Ryan. his abillity to scramble and turn upside down has little to do with his success in the bigger sense. It's more so his ability to understand body mechanics, and that he works very hard in developing specific movements in response to that. You won't understand if you don't train with him. Eddie would be a waste of time for him because there are much better training partners in the area (that he already works with). As for rubbber guard, the lockdown, etc he has explained to us and showed us multiple times and in great detail why those positions are all fundamentally flawed.
     
  18. joe90210 Blue Belt

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    Ryan Hall is not gonna waste his time with a gimmick like the rubber guard
     
  19. Qtip inspector Blue Belt

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    Yeah. Ryan clowned eddies system a few times at a seminar I went to
     
  20. newerest Purple Belt

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    lol @ people on sherdog claiming a guard doesn't work


    this just in - butterfly guard is fundamentally wrong because my brazilian instructor calls it butterguard. he passes it that easily
     

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