Rotating your fist on impact

[December]

i thought that came naturally well it did for me ive always rotated my fist

 

[jlagman]

Bas Rutten has an article in fight magazine and he says not to rotate the punch and that it does nothing for the power of your punch.

Bas Rutten's opinion> anyone else

I remember back in the day when Bas Rutten said the jab was useless in MMA.

 

[DangerDan]

I remember back in the day when Bas Rutten said the jab was useless in MMA.

you should fight him over that.

 

[ViceGrip]

you should fight him over that.

Aye, put your theories to the test.

 

[ForeverFiending]

Just keep in mind you are always striking with the first two knuckles. Yes you must rotate EVERY time in straight punches, even in shadow boxing, mitts, ALL of it. Without the rotation and the two knuckles it is not a punch. You are not punching with your hand, or even your arm. You are using a good deal of your body, sides of your core, legs, shoulders. You're shoulders/upper back should be sore after a good training session. A lot of this is mental. You need to understand that you are driving tremendous force from God knows where and deliviering it out of those two knuckles... kind of like a super hero or something Punch like you mean it. Punches in MT are more for setting up. In boxing punches are to destroy someone.

 

[Gregster]

I personally was never indoctrinated into the school of thought that says rotating your punches gives them power. Rather, I was taught to do so in order to cause my fist-- upon full extension of the punching arm-- to connect with the target with my first two knuckles like I should, as opposed to Knuckle #3 and #4 in the boxers'-fracture-inducing way that untrained punches tend to land. At least that's how my punches tended to connect when I was a novice, and I've observed this plenty in other novice punchers.

I do find that it helps impart a bit of "snap" that conveys some extra power, but I found this to be a nice side-benefit and not the primary reason.

 

[Paedde]

If you open your eggs with a little punch like I do, try both versions and see what happens.

 

[ssssmashing]

If the fist is in the middle of a clock, my thumb is pointing at 4:30ish.

Like this:

I would not recommend this technique for kickboxing, MMA or the street - you'll get every rib on your left side broken.

 

[John L Sullivan]

I would not recommend this technique for kickboxing, MMA or the street - you'll get every rib on your left side broken.

A jab with my palm parallel to the ground leaves me open to a right-hook counter because my shoulder isn't going to be protecting my jaw.

Smash, we may just have to agree to disagree. We're not serving any purpose; neither of us thinks the other one has any idea what they're fucking talking about.

 

[ssssmashing]

A jab with my palm parallel to the ground leaves me open to a right-hook counter because my shoulder isn't going to be protecting my jaw.

Smash, we may just have to agree to disagree. We're not serving any purpose; neither of us thinks the other one has any idea what they're fucking talking about.

No, I would not characterize the exchange that way. I misunderstood what you were saying initially. I thought you were talking about rotating the punch a full 180 degrees which did not make any sense to me. When you clarified it, what you said made much more sense and is fairly pure, old school boxing and I am very cool with that. I did not wish to suggest that you didn't know what you were talking about. My only point was that when a thai kick to the ribs becomes a possibility this position leaves you vulnerable to a lead leg counter. I am not arguing that your technique will not generate power, just making an apples and oranges assessment of the posture, that's all. I apologize if I poorly communicated my point in such a way as to come across as condescending.

 

[John L Sullivan]

No, I would not characterize the exchange that way. I misunderstood what you were saying initially. I thought you were talking about rotating the punch a full 180 degrees which did not make any sense to me. When you clarified it, what you said made much more sense and is fairly pure, old school boxing and I am very cool with that. I did not wish to suggest that you didn't know what you were talking about. My only point was that when a thai kick to the ribs becomes a possibility this position leaves you vulnerable to a lead leg counter. I am not arguing that your technique will not generate power, just making an apples and oranges assessment of the posture, that's all. I apologize if I poorly communicated my point in such a way as to come across as condescending.

Understood as such. Thanks for clarifying. Sorry if I was getting pissy.

 

[Rinksterk**]

I would not recommend this technique for kickboxing, MMA or the street - you'll get every rib on your left side broken.

A jab?

 

[ssssmashing]

A jab?

No (and no I am not willing to fight Bas Rutten about it either). I was specifically referring to the way he is rotating it. to the 3:30 position and the postion of the elbow. And if you did not see above I am really referring to it from an MMA/kickboxing/MT perspective. Pure boxing you'd be OK because the range is sufficient to prevent the counter right.

 

[ssssmashing]

Understood as such. Thanks for clarifying. Sorry if I was getting pissy.

I understand completely. There are a lot of paper tigers on these boards dispensing advice. Details matter and I appreciate you clarifying your position.

 

[Stand-Up!]

Rotating your punches let you fully put your hips into the punch. You will also want to hit with your first two knuckles. This is the most important part of a punch. Follow these 3 rules and you'll have a new found knockout power. Punching any other way could break your hand.

 

[Johnny Rico]

I believe it's the same principle as in karate punches (shotokan at least).
By rotating your wrist the moment you hit the strike becomes more powerfull and and it's easier to pull your arm back faster.

I'll offer confirmation here as a Shotokan black belt. The "snap" as it's called at the end of the punch in conjunction with the rotation of the fist makes for a quick and powerful motion with maximum energy transfer generated by full extension.

 

[FingerInTheEye]

I'm not trying to argue any position here, but I hope someone can explain this to me:

I read Jack Dempsey's book on boxing, and he specifically says that his strongest punch is a slightly vertical one with his weight placed behind it. I'm just wondering if anyone else has read his book, and can comment on this that is ACTUALLY a boxer. Dempsey comments that if you turn your fist horizontal, then you're making another much, more of a looping punch than a "true" straight right. He also advocates using the last 3 knuckles to ESPECIALLY for bare-knuckle boxing.

 

[ssssmashing]

I'm not trying to argue any position here, but I hope someone can explain this to me:

I read Jack Dempsey's book on boxing, and he specifically says that his strongest punch is a slightly vertical one with his weight placed behind it. I'm just wondering if anyone else has read his book, and can comment on this that is ACTUALLY a boxer. Dempsey comments that if you turn your fist horizontal, then you're making another much, more of a looping punch than a "true" straight right. He also advocates using the last 3 knuckles to ESPECIALLY for bare-knuckle boxing.

I have not read Mr. Dempsey's book, but try the different punches and note what is happening with the elbow. The twist punch causes the elbow to flare out and is not as straight of a line. I am not saying it is good or bad, right or wrong but it is what it is. There is a time for both, as I said at the beginning of this thread.

With regards to the 3 knuckle punch. You have to exercise great care when working this as many, many fighters have a tendency to cock their wrist when they throw it this way. Wrist fractures are no fun! The visualization of the inline knuckles seems easier for most to grasp.

One other thing to be careful of with the twist punch is that you never fully lock it out. This is tough and the joints, and leaves you vulnerable to a number of standing joint locks and even a joint break

There are many, many things that you can do with your punch. Different fist formations, Different twists. Try different things but always remember that each method has its trade off.