Ronda doesnt need to fight Cyborg

[fightfan84]

Your use of personal attacks is an indication that you are losing the debate, and you are one of the simple minded people here. But I'll give you a shot to redeem yourself. Go ahead, explain how making the biggest wmma fight in history is bad business.

Its a one off fight with the companys cash cow(besides conor). For them to even promote the fight they would have to advertise the shit out of cyborg dumping a bunch of money and bringing new eyes to who she is. Say she wins this fight (possible) the next step for her is to go to another org where they have a weight limit for her to compete at, there for the ufc ends up spending money to create a star for someone else to capitalize on all while killing off their hype machine rousey and the aura of being the greatest ever. Long term lose wouldnt be worth the short term gain. Unfortunately for us "hardcore" fans this is the biggest Wmma fight, but for the casual tate will sell just as well. It does not benefit ufc to do a one off fight, they need a way to use cyborg win or lose after this match

There hopefully thats simple enough for you to understand. Spelling mistakes on an anonymous fight forum shouldnt dictate whats right or wrong, your obviously emotionally invested in this, its weird man

 

[Enders]

Its a one off fight with the companys cash cow(besides conor). For them to even promote the fight they would have to advertise the shit out of cyborg dumping a bunch of money and bringing new eyes to who she is. Say she wins this fight (possible) the next step for her is to go to another org where they have a weight limit for her to compete at, there for the ufc ends up spending money to create a star for someone else to capitalize on all while killing off their hype machine rousey and the aura of being the greatest ever. Long term lose wouldnt be worth the short term gain. Unfortunately for us "hardcore" fans this is the biggest Wmma fight, but for the casual tate will sell just as well. It does not benefit ufc to do a one off fight, they need a way to use cyborg win or lose after this match

There hopefully thats simple enough for you to understand. Spelling mistakes on an anonymous fight forum shouldnt dictate whats right or wrong, your obviously emotionally invested in this, its weird man

So they are afraid she's gonna lose, gotcha. Just like her whit knightng fans.
Dumb argument anyways as providing the fans the best fight possible is the best for their brand.

You are delusional if you think a third Tate fight would be bigger than a Cyborg fight. Considering your other arguments, i'm not surprised you're wrong on that count also.

 

[Malthian]

So they are afraid she's gonna lose, gotcha. Just like her whit knightng fans.
Dumb argument anyways as providing the fans the best fight possible is the best for their brand.

You are delusional if you think a third Tate fight would be bigger than a Cyborg fight. Considering your other arguments, i'm not surprised you're wrong on that count also.

I'm not sure whether you're 12 years old or just naiive.

The UFC isn't afraid that Rousey WILL lose, they're afraid that she COULD lose. They are very different propositions.

MMA is a fairly random sport. Literally almost anything can happen. A person can get a cut and the fight can be called. Or the fighter could suffer a freak injury ala Silva. Or the better fighter can lose to a freak knock out. Etc, etc.

If you run a business your job is to make money and minimize losses under ALL possible scenarios. IE, you need to be in a position to make money no matter what the outcome of event turns out to be.

Having a Rousey vs Cyborg fight without having a guarantee that Cyborg will continue to fight under your banner for the foreseeable future (multiple fight contract within an active division) puts you in the position where you are losing money if something goes wrong. IE, it's stupid business.

Even if you think that Rousey is a 20-1 favorite, there's still always the 5% chance that Cyborg gets lucky and you lose a ton of money. If you have half a brain you make sure that you're covered.

I suggest you read a bit more about business or talk to someone who actually has been in business, because right now you sound like an internet troll having a tantrum.

 

[Rematch]

If Cyborg wants the fight, she needs to have a test fight at 135 that's not even required to be in the UFC and make 135 in UFC for the title. It's simple.

If Cyborg is unwilling to do those things, it affects her legacy, not Ronda's.

 

[Enders]

I'm not sure whether you're 12 years old or just naiive.

The UFC isn't afraid that Rousey WILL lose, they're afraid that she COULD lose. They are very different propositions.

MMA is a fairly random sport. Literally almost anything can happen. A person can get a cut and the fight can be called. Or the fighter could suffer a freak injury ala Silva. Or the better fighter can lose to a freak knock out. Etc, etc.

If you run a business your job is to make money and minimize losses under ALL possible scenarios. IE, you need to be in a position to make money no matter what the outcome of event turns out to be.

Having a Rousey vs Cyborg fight without having a guarantee that Cyborg will continue to fight under your banner for the foreseeable future (multiple fight contract within an active division) puts you in the position where you are losing money if something goes wrong. IE, it's stupid business.

Even if you think that Rousey is a 20-1 favorite, there's still always the 5% chance that Cyborg gets lucky and you lose a ton of money. If you have half a brain you make sure that you're covered.

I suggest you read a bit more about business or talk to someone who actually has been in business, because right now you sound like an internet troll having a tantrum.

This coming from someone that thinks Rousey Tate is a bigger fight that Rousey Cyborg. Sorry, but you have no credibility. I own a company by the way, and if you knew the first thing about running a business you would know that the customer is always right, but I doubt you even know what that means.

 

[Malthian]

This coming from someone that thinks Rousey Tate is a bigger fight that Rousey Cyborg. Sorry, but you have no credibility. I own a company by the way, and if you knew the first thing about running a business you would know that the customer is always right, but I doubt you even know what that means.

Cyborg has no track record of media presence, PPV sales, or other track record.

Miesha Tate has a track record of social media presence and is currently the 2nd most popular female fighter in the UFC.

Without the UFC expending money on the promotion of Cyborg, as of now it's quite conceivable that she doesn't draw many additional viewers at least among casuals which are the bulk of Rousey's audience.

And no, the customer is NOT always right. The customer is often a complete idiot. Customers often want things that they are not entitled to have. They want higher quality, higher service for less or for free. They also fundamentally couldn't care less whether you make a buck or for the welfare of your workers other than in the most abstract sense.

There's a reason the idea of price point exists. It's not about selling to the most people, it's about making the most profit. Sometimes that's selling in volume, sometimes it's about selling to a small percentage of people that actually want your product or service and are willing to pay for it.

The UFC currently has a 100% guarantee of earnings from Rousey fighting the women who are on the current roster. Fighting Cyborg is not a 100% guaranteed win, which means without Cyborg secured on a contract they are needlessly putting the earnings of their organization and of Rousey at risk.

The same people who are willing to pay $60 for a Rousey-Cyborg fight today, will gladly pay that same amount or more in 2 years or 5 years. You think it's an accident that it took so long for Mayweather-Pacquio to happen?

The consumer will get Rousey-Cyborg when the UFC and Rousey is good and ready to give it to them under the terms they find acceptable at the time. And right now, given Rousey's popularity and selling power those terms are NOT doing so at a catch weight or 145.

I'm not going to say much more other than if you're using the cliche of "the customer is always right" as some sort of argument then we're not even coming from the same planet, let alone a similar point of reference.

 

[Enders]

Cyborg has no track record of media presence, PPV sales, or other track record.

Miesha Tate has a track record of social media presence and is currently the 2nd most popular female fighter in the UFC.

Without the UFC expending money on the promotion of Cyborg, as of now it's quite conceivable that she doesn't draw many additional viewers at least among casuals which are the bulk of Rousey's audience.

And no, the customer is NOT always right. The customer is often a complete idiot. Customers often want things that they are not entitled to have. They want higher quality, higher service for less or for free. They also fundamentally couldn't care less whether you make a buck or for the welfare of your workers other than in the most abstract sense.

There's a reason the idea of price point exists. It's not about selling to the most people, it's about making the most profit. Sometimes that's selling in volume, sometimes it's about selling to a small percentage of people that actually want your product or service and are willing to pay for it.

The UFC currently has a 100% guarantee of earnings from Rousey fighting the women who are on the current roster. Fighting Cyborg is not a 100% guaranteed win, which means without Cyborg secured on a contract they are needlessly putting the earnings of their organization and of Rousey at risk.

The same people who are willing to pay $60 for a Rousey-Cyborg fight today, will gladly pay that same amount or more in 2 years or 5 years. You think it's an accident that it took so long for Mayweather-Pacquio to happen?

The consumer will get Rousey-Cyborg when the UFC and Rousey is good and ready to give it to them under the terms they find acceptable at the time. And right now, given Rousey's popularity and selling power those terms are NOT doing so at a catch weight or 145.

I'm not going to say much more other than if you're using the cliche of "the customer is always right" as some sort of argument then we're not even coming from the same planet, let alone a similar point of reference.

"And no, the customer is NOT always right. The customer is often a complete idiot."

All I can say is you have proven that you have no idea what that saying means, so stop trying to act like you know anything about business.

The fact that your argument for why the fight shouldnt happen is it's bad business hsnt even begun to refute why the fight shouldnt happen for the good of the sport, Ronda, Cyborg, and the fans. So unless you can begin an argument on that front, your failed business arguments wouldnt even have mattered if they were cogent.

 

[LouisBolanos]

This coming from someone that thinks Rousey Tate is a bigger fight that Rousey Cyborg. Sorry, but you have no credibility. I own a company by the way, and if you knew the first thing about running a business you would know that the customer is always right, but I doubt you even know what that means.

Rousey Tate is not a bigger fight than Rousey Cyborg, true, but that's completely besides the point. The relevant fact here is Rousey vs. [anyone not named Cyborg] is a 10x bigger fight than Cyborg vs. [anyone not named Rousey]. Need I remind you how much more popular Rousey is than Cyborg, or anyone else under Zuffa?

https://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=/m/04gttgp, /m/04f2vvb&cmpt=q&tz=Etc/GMT+7

Sure, Rousey will make a million or two more if she fights Cyborg, on top of the millions she'd already be making fighting anyone else. She'd be getting a small bump in popularity - almost none actually at this point, since everyone already knows who she is. Cyborg on the other hand, would be making more money in that one fight than the rest of her career, combined. She'd become 10x more well-known overnight, and that would open up opportunities for her she's never seen before.

Rousey is already a megastar. Cyborg needs her way more than she needs Cyborg, and that's exactly why Rousey sets the rules, pure and simple. 135lbs, take it or leave it.

 

[Enders]

Rousey Tate is not a bigger fight than Rousey Cyborg, true, but that's completely besides the point. The relevant fact here is Rousey vs. [anyone not named Cyborg] is a 10x bigger fight than Cyborg vs. [anyone not named Rousey]. Need I remind you how much more popular Rousey is than Cyborg, or anyone else under Zuffa?

https://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=/m/04gttgp, /m/04f2vvb&cmpt=q&tz=Etc/GMT+7

Sure, Rousey will make a million or two more if she fights Cyborg, on top of the millions she'd already be making fighting anyone else. She'd be getting a small bump in popularity - almost none actually at this point, since everyone already knows who she is. Cyborg on the other hand, would be making more money in that one fight than the rest of her career, combined. She'd become 10x more well-known overnight, and that would open up opportunities for her she's never seen before.

Rousey is already a megastar. Cyborg needs her way more than she needs Cyborg, and that's exactly why Rousey sets the rules, pure and simple. 135lbs, take it or leave it.

That's fine, but she will live with that asterisks her whole life.

 

[trac209]

This coming from someone that thinks Rousey Tate is a bigger fight that Rousey Cyborg. Sorry, but you have no credibility. I own a company by the way, and if you knew the first thing about running a business you would know that the customer is always right, but I doubt you even know what that means.

Exactly ^^^^^^ when you go to look new vehicle and say show me your 3/4 ton trucks what would say if the sales person took you to see the new Prius lol. That's the UFC in a nutshell,cramming a square peg in a round hole over and over. When they are already looking at a rousey Tate 3 you know the pool is shallow and it's time to look in the deep end

 

[LouisBolanos]

That's fine, but she will live with that asterisks her whole life.

Sure, but she'll be a multi-millionaire mega-star with a tiny asterisk regarding her WMMA GOAT status that the 1% hardcores will argue over ad infinitum, while Cyborg will live in near complete obscurity and poverty (relative to Ronda).

If you're a $10 million company negotiating a deal that would change your company forever with a $10 billion fortune 500, you don't get to meet in the middle, even if you do hold a key patent that would be useful to the fortune 500. You do everything in your power to meet their demands.

 

[Enders]

Sure, but she'll be a multi-millionaire mega-star with a tiny asterisk regarding her WMMA GOAT status that the 1% hardcores will argue over ad infinitum, while Cyborg will live in near complete obscurity and poverty (relative to Ronda).

If you're a $10 million company negotiating a deal that would change your company forever with a $10 billion fortune 500, you don't get to meet in the middle, even if you do hold a key patent that would be useful to the fortune 500. You do everything in your power to meet their demands.

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does, but they both need the fight legacy wise.

 

[Malthian]

The fact that your argument for why the fight shouldnt happen is it's bad business hsnt even begun to refute why the fight shouldnt happen for the good of the sport, Ronda, Cyborg, and the fans. So unless you can begin an argument on that front, your failed business arguments wouldnt even have mattered if they were cogent.

Good of the sport? Really? That may be one of the lamest arguments I've ever seen.

MMA as a sport and the UFC isn't going to suffer if the Rousey-Cyborg fight doesn't happen. Nobody lost their jobs because Silva-GSP didn't happen. Nobody went broke because Lesnar-Fedor didn't happen. The sport keeps on chugging along. It's in more countries than ever, with more events than ever, with more athletes than ever.

Rousey's making plenty of money and is the most visible star in the UFC. Rousey and her top tier management team is watching for her welfare just fine unless you think you can do a better job than William-Morris Endeavour.

As for the fans, the fans want their fights yesterday and that hasn't changed since UFC 1. I didn't lose a wink of sleep because Silva-GSP didn't happen. I doubt anyone else did either. At most it's a footnote discussion in the darker corners of the internet forums.

What your argument basically boils down to is "WAAAAAAH, I want to see it NOW!"

And the business arguments matter because they are the ONLY reason the fight hasn't happened already. Business is ultimately why the negotiations between Fedor and the UFC fell through. It's why Mayweather-Pacquio took years to happen.

Money makes MMA go around. It's a PROFESSIONAL sport. It's not a hobby. It exists to make money for the promoters and the athletes who participate otherwise they'd all be slugging it out in their back yards and driveways.

It will happen when the money and terms make sense for everyone. Wishing that it was different won't make it so.

 

[LouisBolanos]

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does, but they both need the fight legacy wise.

What legacy? Ronda's legacy is already secure among 99% of the casuals. The hardcores will argue about it if she doesn't fight Cyborg sure, but the hardcores will always find things to bitch about Ronda, like how she's a weakling woman who's never fought men. Cyborg on the other hand, will be next to nothing without Rousey. You can't say because they're both champions, they have to meet in the middle. That would only make sense if they're champions of roughly equal status, which couldn't be further from the truth.

Is it a bitch move on Ronda's part? Sure, especially considering how she repeatedly says she can beat anyone with or without drugs, how she would give special allowance to Gina, but the bottom line is it's the Ronda Rousey show, and she gets to call the shots. If Cyborg wants to have a legacy, she needs to play ball.

 

[mkess101]

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does, but they both need the fight legacy wise.

Okay, let me get this out of the way first:

I hope the fight happens. I really, REALLY do. At any weight honestly. As both a fan and a bettor. I just put a nice wager on Ronda today that's valid if the fight happens before December 31, 2016.

That said, if you think Ronda needs this fight for her legacy you're nuts. With or without a Cyborg fight, 100% of casuals and the overwhelming majority of diehards will still rate her as the best women's fighter ever. Right now, she's probably the most famous woman athlete on the planet. She's almost a 3 to 1 betting favorite over Cyborg without the books even knowing what weight they'd agree to fight at.

Cyborg's best 2 career wins are probably her wins over Coenen (maybe throw Carano in there but probably Coenen). She stopped Coenen in the third and fourth rounds in those two fights. Meisha Tate, despite being smaller, also stopped Coenen in the third. By the end of this year Ronda will have beaten Meisha 3 times, all with ease.

I'm not saying this to be a dick, but it seems like it's hard for you to see the big picture in terms of legacy. You and the small % of diehards who'd really hold it against Ronda if the Cyborg fight never happened (but somehow not Cyborg, as if a fighter that can easily make the lower weight and is the champ in that class is obligated to move up if it's tough for the larger fighter to cut more weight--but I digress) just don't matter. YOU believe her legacy would be negatively affected but the thing about legacies is that they aren't decided by a tiny minority of fringe diehards who voice their opinion on internet forums.

Again, I'm with you in that I really hope the fight happens. But you also have to keep perspective.

 

[eiyuu]

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does, but they both need the fight legacy wise.

GSP didn't need the Anderson Silva fight for his legacy

 

[georgejjr]

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does, but they both need the fight legacy wise.

Just like Liddell needed to fight Fedor for his legacy. And Hughes needed to fight Franklin. And GSP needed to fight Anderson. And Anderson needed to fight Jones. And Jones needed to fight Cain. And Aldo, and Barao, and Demetrius, and ...

None of those folks have legacies because they didn't fight the champ in the weight division above them. Seriously? Because if Rousey doesn't go up in weight to fight the dominant champ above, that's the company she keeps, legacy wise: Liddell, Hughes, GSP, Anderson, Jones, Barao, Aldo, DJ - not that bad a legacy.

 

[Zigmeister]

Cyborg would stand in the pocket and KO Honda...but she will likely never make 135lbs....at least not any time soon.

 

[riceburned]

First sensible thing you've said.

I never said cyborg doesn't need the fight more. She does,

 

[loisestrad]

Cyborg would stand in the pocket and KO Honda....

She's got a chance. But then again, that's assuming Ronda is gonna go for Cyborg as she did Bethe, which she isn't. So Cyborg isn't gonna stand in any pocket, she'll get tossed on her back, repeatedly - that is if Ronda doesn't finish Cyborg on the ground the first time she gets tossed.