Roberto Duran vs Tito Trinidad at 147 Prime vs Prime

So Antonia Tarver is top 5 ATG in his weight class? No.

As somewhat of an aside, you think Antonia Tarver P4P is nearly as good as prime Sugar Ray Leonard? I sure as fuck hope not. SRL shits all over Tarver.

Sorry man, try again.

And now you're changing the argument again. Now its not just greatness but only certain levels of greatness eh?
 
And now you're changing the argument again. Now its not just greatness but only certain levels of greatness eh?

Yes, a level of greatness that goes beyond chad dawson. LOL.

SRL, top 20 ATG. Chad Dawson.... somewhere int he top 2000 maybe. What a joke.
 
:icon_lol:

I don't need to convince anyone of a fact. If you need help wrapping your head around said fact, that's your problem. It's not my job to convince you. Read the past two pages as many times as you need to. Fighters moving up in weight to beat better younger guys is not new. It happened before Duran and it's happened since. Once again, that is a fact. Set whatever fantastical, circumstantial parameters you like, you can't refute fact.



I suppose that's a matter of opinion. But the fact is that it happened. You said it didn't.

I didn't say it didn't happen. I just wanted the list.

All I got was this piss poor Chad Dawson shit that anybody who really knows boxing would be completely fucking embarrassed to bring up.

This is some of the weakest shit I've seen that is very symptomatic of a "boxing" forum embedded in an MMA website.

Embarrassing garbage.
 
I didn't say it didn't happen. I just wanted the list.

All I got was this piss poor Chad Dawson shit that anybody who really knows boxing would be completely fucking embarrassed to bring up.

This is some of the weakest shit I've seen that is very symptomatic of a "boxing" forum embedded in an MMA website.

Embarrassing garbage.

211_kleenex.jpg
 
i enjoy seeing you come back here every few months and complain how shit this forum is
it pleases me.
 
i enjoy seeing you come back here every few months and complain how shit this forum is
it pleases me.

He needs a board full of nostalgic weirdos like himself who look at older fighters with a sense of grandeur for some reason.
 
At LHW, he's undoubtedly an ATG. Aren't you the guy who said Floyd Mayweather isn't even top 50?


Oh my quoted for lols

You're either under 20 years old or wearing tmt gear and yelling TBE with strange king
 
Oh my quoted for lols

You're either under 20 years old or wearing tmt gear and yelling TBE with strange king

I literally have no idea what you're talking about. Anyone who doesn't have Floyd Mayweather in their top 50 GOAT should immediately stop watching boxing and get into golf.
 
Chad Dawson ATG not Floyd.

Dawson has a pretty solid resume at 175. I'm not sure what your issue is. No he's not Ezzard Charles. But he has some quality wins at the weight.
 
Greb.

Robinson.

Floyd Mayweather.

Ray Leonard.

Henry Armstrong.

Evander Holyfield.


Off the top of my head I came up with 6. Nice try.

None of this has a thing to do with my argument either way. But this is what you do.

Mayweather and Holyfield never beat a prime ATG in a higher weight class and SRL got beat in his prime by Duran I don't get your point
 
Mayweather and Holyfield never beat a prime ATG in a higher weight class and SRL got beat in his prime by Duran I don't get your point


Leonard wasn't an all time great when Duran beat him.

See this is the thing. You look at a fight like Hearns vs Leonard and give Leonard credit for beating the entire legend of Hearns. You say "Oh Hearns beat Duran later on!"


You have to be more objective and not compare a legendary career of an opponent, to a single win over a recent fighter.

Fighters from past era's are often considered great for fighting each other. Bing involved in classic fights, having a style that fans enjoy etc.

But when you really break it down, look at resumes, quality of opponents etc.- Classic fighters are no different than modern fighters. Just remembered more fondly.
In 20 years, there'll be some prospect and we'll all be saying "This guy isn't worth a pimple on Floyds ass," just like people said Robinson "wasn't fit to shine Pep's shoes."

I don't buy the nostalgia arguments.

I mean, these conditions you guys have put on greatness here to avoid comparing Floyd to great fighters is hilarious. "Did Floyd ever go up in weight, fight an all time great in his prime, who was 5'11", with certain gloves, who's middle name is Mel? Didn't think so!! AHA!"

Leonard never did that. Unless you consider Donny Lalonde an ATG. Or Want to try to tell me Hagler was in his prime.

Hearns never did that.

Hagler never did that. Hagler never went up in weight at all. What a scrub.

Ali never did it.

I could probably sit here alll day and list great fighters who don't meet the absurd conditions that some of you have tried to apply to greatness and watch you guys slowly adjust your criteria over and over when I point out your flaws.
 
Leonard wasn't an all time great when Duran beat him.

See this is the thing. You look at a fight like Hearns vs Leonard and give Leonard credit for beating the entire legend of Hearns. You say "Oh Hearns beat Duran later on!"


You have to be more objective and not compare a legendary career of an opponent, to a single win over a recent fighter.

Fighters from past era's are often considered great for fighting each other. Bing involved in classic fights, having a style that fans enjoy etc.

But when you really break it down, look at resumes, quality of opponents etc.- Classic fighters are no different than modern fighters. Just remembered more fondly.
In 20 years, there'll be some prospect and we'll all be saying "This guy isn't worth a pimple on Floyds ass," just like people said Robinson "wasn't fit to shine Pep's shoes."

I don't buy the nostalgia arguments.

I mean, these conditions you guys have put on greatness here to avoid comparing Floyd to great fighters is hilarious. "Did Floyd ever go up in weight, fight an all time great in his prime, who was 5'11", with certain gloves, who's middle name is Mel? Didn't think so!! AHA!"

Leonard never did that. Unless you consider Donny Lalonde an ATG. Or Want to try to tell me Hagler was in his prime.

Hearns never did that.

Hagler never did that. Hagler never went up in weight at all. What a scrub.

Ali never did it.

I could probably sit here alll day and list great fighters who don't meet the absurd conditions that some of you have tried to apply to greatness and watch you guys slowly adjust your criteria over and over when I point out your flaws.

LOL at how your entire existence seems to be around making stuff up and bringing Floyd into the talk. M.O. to make up how great and deep boxing is now. Give it a rest.

The topic wasn't whether or not Duran could move up in weight and beat a great in "fantasy" type match ups. Not that guys who didn't move up and beat All-Time great fighters can't be all time greats. So shut up trying to say things like Hagler ain't an ATG because he didn't move up. Nobody is making that argument. Stop trying to create illogical things to make yourself sound smart.

And fact is, much like you point out, Duran did something not many other fighters could do. Move up two weight classes (or one "old-school" weight class), and beat someone who was naturally bigger, younger, champion of the world, and considered an elite fighter in the sports history, and why not throw in there doing it with no concessions. Other guys generally got destroyed (i.e. Foster vs Frazier, Napoles versus Monon).

The best examples the scrubs here could come up with is around Tarver/Hopkins/Stevenson/Dawson. At least go a bit warmer and say Mosely over Oscar. Needless to say, all from the "22 undefeated world champs" era of boxing.
 
leonard wasn't an all time great when duran beat him.

See this is the thing. You look at a fight like hearns vs leonard and give leonard credit for beating the entire legend of hearns. You say "oh hearns beat duran later on!"


you have to be more objective and not compare a legendary career of an opponent, to a single win over a recent fighter.

Fighters from past era's are often considered great for fighting each other. Bing involved in classic fights, having a style that fans enjoy etc.

But when you really break it down, look at resumes, quality of opponents etc.- classic fighters are no different than modern fighters. Just remembered more fondly.
In 20 years, there'll be some prospect and we'll all be saying "this guy isn't worth a pimple on floyds ass," just like people said robinson "wasn't fit to shine pep's shoes."

i don't buy the nostalgia arguments.

I mean, these conditions you guys have put on greatness here to avoid comparing floyd to great fighters is hilarious. "did floyd ever go up in weight, fight an all time great in his prime, who was 5'11", with certain gloves, who's middle name is mel? Didn't think so!! Aha!"

leonard never did that. Unless you consider donny lalonde an atg. Or want to try to tell me hagler was in his prime.

Hearns never did that.

Hagler never did that. Hagler never went up in weight at all. What a scrub.

Ali never did it.

I could probably sit here alll day and list great fighters who don't meet the absurd conditions that some of you have tried to apply to greatness and watch you guys slowly adjust your criteria over and over when i point out your flaws.


tbe tbe
 
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