remember when Rampage use to slam guys

[Arrrrgh]

So what, Jackson couldn't have possibly been one of the minority who needed TRT in their mid-30's?


Your follow up conclusion is flawed given the above point I just made.


I'm not a fighter and I've never taken steroids, but even I get blood work done which by default includes a panel on my testosterone levels.


You're using "loophole" wrong, because TRT was literally approved by commissions for fighters to keep their testosterone levels normal as they aged.

The loophole was fighters using the TRT exemption to abuse steroids and up their testosterones levels to prohibited amounts.

We don't have proof that Jackson used steroids when it was prohibited, nor do we have proof that Jackson raised his testosterone levels above the permitted amount when he received a TRT exemption, and trying to conclude otherwise based on assumption and leaps in logic is a flawed argument.

So you just feel like arguing and defending that he also could have been clean other than TRT. I acknowledged that in the beginning of my post and in the conclusion, the part you failed to quote. Good day sir.

 

[PrepareForGlory]

I honestly thought that the unified rules of Mma stated that slams must have an arc to them and bringing your opponent strait down head first was illegal ?

You are correct. But Rampage creates the arc by turning him all in one motion. You can drive someone on their head as long as you turn them like he's doing.

You just can't pile drive someone straight up and down into the canvas.

 

[sweetviolenturg]

What a monster.

Pride and early Ufc rampage was probably my favorite fighter of all time to watch. I think big money took away his hunger to perform like that.

It wasn't so much the money as it was the injuries. All those slams of his turned his lower back into a horror show & as he began to age there were days when he couldn't even get up out of bed to train.

Rampage stopped slamming people for the same reason fedor stopped using his grappling. Back injuries.

Spot on. My wife was The OC Fight Doc, Bill Kessler's medical assistant for years & always had to work on Rampage's back. She helped Kessler run the office that he had at Colin Oyama's gym in Irvine about a decade or so ago. And Kessler & her worked on a large portion of the UFC roster there including Michael Bisping, the Diaz bros, Tito Ortiz, Diego Sanchez, & too many others to mention. But her favorites were Carla Esparza & Rampage. And Kessler & her were brought up to Big Bear to help him get through his training camps his back was so bad. It was a hot mess.

 

[Elvis.]

You are correct. But Rampage creates the arc by turning him all in one motion. You can drive someone on their head as long as you turn them like he's doing.

You just can't pile drive someone straight up and down into the canvas.

I’ve read it and I respect your interpretation of the rule , I would say you’re correct
It just looks like somebody is going to end up in a wheelchair or dead in this gif

 

[Bjjpitbull8]

It wasn't so much the money as it was the injuries. All those slams of his turned his lower back into a horror show & as he began to age there were days when he couldn't even get up out of bed to train.




Spot on. My wife was The OC Fight Doc, Bill Kessler's medical assistant for years & always had to work on Rampage's back. She helped Kessler run the office that he had at Colin Oyama's gym in Irvine about a decade or so ago. And Kessler & her worked on a large portion of the UFC roster there including Michael Bisping, the Diaz bros, Tito Ortiz, Diego Sanchez, & too many others to mention. But her favorites were Carla Esparza & Rampage. And Kessler & her were brought up to Big Bear to help him get through his training camps his back was so bad. It was a hot mess.

That makes sense. One bad formed rep deadlifting even slight weight can wreak havoc on the back. I can’t imagine what it would be like picking up a 200 plus human and slamming them with adrenaline fueling me.

 

[G10]

Not really: he got several KO wins/stoppages from slams. Probably slams were higher reward/lower-risk for him than for any other MMA fighter in history.

I meant in terms of energy expenditure, not in terms of effectiveness, but I guess "High Risk/High Reward" would more accurately describe the strategy. Rampage's slams were certainly powerful enough to finish guys, but it hurt him in fights when he couldn't. Had he not gone for the slam against Bader, he likely could have pulled off the win.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

There's still not any proof of him taking steroids prior though, that's just him taking testosterone therapy which "could" be for a multitude of reasons, I get what you're saying but TRT isn't a steroid and was legal at one point, it shouldn't have been but it was unfortunately, we're all assuming who was on it in Pride and who wasn't.

Yeah, a pro athlete needing TRT in his thirties is significant circumstantial evidence that he's been tampering with his hormone levels. There are reasons a fighter could need a TUE that aren't related to steroid abuse, but killing your test production via steroid abuse is far and away the most likely reason.

Years ago on Sherdog there was an interview with an endocrinologist about steroid use in fighters, and he was laughing about all the guys needing TRT. He indicated that as an endocrinologist he would start with the assumption that a pro fighter with low test had abused anabolic steroids in the past because that was so much more likely than other causes.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

There shouldn't even be an argument since the evidence is right here in the vid for everyone to see.

The evidence in the video shows both that Arona's head hit the canvas very hard and that Arona's head hit Rampage's head very hard.

You can't see enough to know whether Arona was out from the blow against the canvas before hitting Rampage's head, and no way either fighter would be able to tell which KOed Arona, because they occurred in rapid succession.

Personally, I think the fight would have been over regardless of whether the two clashed heads, based on the slam against the canvas. That's an opinion. No one really knows.

 

[TR1]

It wasn't so much the money as it was the injuries. All those slams of his turned his lower back into a horror show & as he began to age there were days when he couldn't even get up out of bed to train.


.

You can tell by the way Rampage moved by the time he got into the UFC- it was a slow decline, so not immediately evident, but was really becoming clear by the time he fought Jardine and Rashad.
He never engaged in offensive grappling by that point.

 

[jrleclerc88]

He’s always had that incredible core strength.

Kind of throws the steroid argument out the window.

WTF lol. Is that allowed in hs/college wrestling? Thats stupid strength the Weight isn't even at all

 

[willynyy]

There's no word to be taken. It's a video.
You have the cognitive processing power of a Gerber jar if you can't see it.

you can't tell by looking at the video when exactly he went out, even on slow motion. So stfu and let the dude have his opinion. Lol why you so mad ? Snowflakes

 

[Romo Gracie]

I remember him saying : Me Amy good gorilla.

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

He’s always had that incredible core strength.

Kind of throws the steroid argument out the window.

How does it throw steroids out the window? Plenty of hs athletes have used peds

 

[achoo42]

I can't believe that people are seriously arguing over whether Rampage, by far one of the strongest and most terrifying guys in Pride, was on PEDs.

They don't even drug test in Pride. Like someone else said, people are even encouraged to use them. There was close to zero reason not to use them and a million reasons to boost your performance in a sport where your entire livelihood and career is built around your strength and athleticism.

What's next, people asking whether Cro Cop was using PEDs? Hmm, what about Kevin Randleman?

This is like asking a physicist or a lawyer whether or not they would take an injection that gave them +10 IQ points. If it was allowed, why the hell not.

 

[Qays Stetkevich]

I meant in terms of energy expenditure, not in terms of effectiveness, but I guess "High Risk/High Reward" would more accurately describe the strategy. Rampage's slams were certainly powerful enough to finish guys, but it hurt him in fights when he couldn't. Had he not gone for the slam against Bader, he likely could have pulled off the win.

I gotchya. Good point. He pretty much became famous for slamming, but in the UFC that more often than not would lead to losing position. Still, I remember some older ones where I was REALLY surprised at how effective his slams were, like against Vovchanchyn, and I believe Ninja as well (although I remember thinking Ninja won that one)

 

[Ancient Warrior]

How does it throw steroids out the window? Plenty of hs athletes have used peds

It implies that he always had the strength and that he still had the ability when he entered the UFC’s stricter testing pool.

 

[Pancake Sprawl]

That makes sense. One bad formed rep deadlifting even slight weight can wreak havoc on the back. I can’t imagine what it would be like picking up a 200 plus human and slamming them with adrenaline fueling me.

i guarantee on that Arona slam he must've felt/heard things pop in his back. how high Arona was on his upper body must've put an enormous strain on his lower back. especially how it seems like he straight up good mornings Arona up into the air.

 

[lweiberg]

i guarantee on that Arona slam he must've felt/heard things pop in his back. how high Arona was on his upper body must've put an enormous strain on his lower back. especially how it seems like he straight up good mornings Arona up into the air.

Reminds me of when Nash injured his back during his first attempt to powerbomb the Giant

 

[Kwinkle Kwink]

"remember when Rampage use to slam guys"

So, what are you saying, that he's "straight" now and into "Women"?