Religion Fact or Fiction?

Originally posted by Lady N
Sith relegion?

Don't you watch Star Wars? :D

It's the DARK SIDE of the Force.

IE. Darth Vader becomes known as the Dark Lord of the Sith.

You guys really want to live in a dictatorship? Maybe we don't like religion, but I'm all for freedom of thought, and if you're not, you're fucking crazy....

There are many problems with a dictatorship model of government.

Not the least of which is the questionability of the new leader. It's possible to build a system where the dictator is elected from a body of people, elected by the populance to serve a fixed term.

This would ensure that people think REAL hard before they vote someone into politics and especially hard before they vote them into the role of a dictatorship.

The other largest issue I see if public perception of the dictatorship model of government. They see what they're giving up rather than what they stand to gain.

- The Jake
 
Originally posted by Lady N


Ahh, Star Wars. How could I forget? Thank you for the explanation!

The Force is strong with this one.

Come on Lady N, you gotta turn to the Dark Side too!!! JOIN US... JOIN US... heheh

- The Jake
 
I have to say that religion and believing in God are two different causes.Religion just like christianity forces people to believe in "their" god to hold them for their snouts.The best excample for it is the story of healingfoot (no offend).My country is conservative and catholic so people have no choice when they're born and young, they have to be christians.When I was 14 I realized that it has no sense and became an atheist.

To believe in God you need no religion, you must reflect over oneself and find some solutions blaablaa, etc.......(fuck this I'm starting to philosophize).

My solution was that THERE IS NO GOD because I don't need him and my "analyzes" brought me to the fact that his existence is not logic to the regularity of the whole fuckin world.

And as someone said, don't say that "God just simply is" because everything has it's beginning and it's end.

Just look at the buddhism.The buddhist people haven't been forced to believe in their religion, they realized some ideas by themselves.They believe in no god (Buddha was a human).Well they believe in some supernatural powers but it doesn't mean they exist, it's just a kind of philosophy,myth.They became reconciled with all the rules and orders of the world and because we just don't understand sth it doesn't mean that someone created it.
 
Lol.... My dumb ass thought Jake was serious...what a chump I can be!


And Irae, I migh be feeling stupid once you reply 2 this post but, I am not sure I understand by me being a good example. I am not mad or anything. Just trying 2 understand what you mean. I don't believe in god, not because i'm looking for an exuse 2 be a jerk and not worry about consiquence of hell or anything. Its because I have come 2 a personal conclusion that it (above all other things) does not make sense 2 me. I'm sure one can say that they don't belive in cars (just an example) because they don't understand how they work. But its obvious that cars exist. So I could see how a believer would think that it is rediculous that someone would say that they don't believe in god because they it does not make sense 2 them.

I like the fact that people can believe in GOD, but not RELIGION. Because religion seems like its a way 2 scare or trick or whatever you want 2 call it, people into staying a believer, or becoming one. They just believe in god for whatever reason they have. I just don't believe in God because I don't understand the whole thing, and I don't understand how life started. Not a priest reverend or even the pope can explain where god came from. All they can say is "God is" and leave it at that. It seems silly 2 me. On the other hand, science cannot explain what happend before the "Big bang". I just really don't know what 2 believe. I don't believe in God, and I don't think science has all the answers as well. I brought up this thread 2 get ideas and 2 get some brain stimulating conversation. It has turned out 2 be just that at the very least. I read every post on this thread. And they mostly have very intersting thoughts. But 2 say that God is, and that thats just the way it is, is very pig-headed. And along the same lines comes, There is no god, because the lack of evidence and science is obvious proof, well, is just as pig-headed. Its all a mystery 2 me.
 
What I meant for an excample was the way when believers (christians) force other people to their faith.Just like when parents force their kids to read the bible, go to church etc.That's all.Many people had no choice when they were young.So as an atheist I feel I'm free.
 
Ahh yes yes. Right, I almost feel like I was rebeling against my mother at times for making my decision. Because it was all I knew growing up and I had no choice. I see, yep. I feel even stupider now. Oh well.... thanks Irae!




HealingFoot sits on his bed slapping his head thinking "God what a moron I can be":confused:
 
Religion is like a real bad arse boil you can never get rid of. So are some ex girlfriends for that matter.
 
Originally posted by HealingFoot
Lol.... My dumb ass thought Jake was serious...what a chump I can be!

Who said I was joking?

It's an idea... I'm brainstorming....

I wouldn't say I'm joking but I wouldn't say I'm serious. I've thrown the idea out there as a topic for debate although so far nobody seems to be commenting on it....

Nobody wants to open that can of worms I see....

- The Jake
 
It's truly awe-inspiring to find out how many times the same thing could be said in a different way.
 
Fiction ^,^

I'm sorta surprised nobody has been quoting Marx yet...or maybe I just missed it.
Organized religion helps to justify the control, oppression, or destruction of one group by another. It's just a sociological tool.
Personal religion...well, I don't believe it but I don't really disdain people who do. If you've come up with your own beliefs, at least it means you've THOUGHT about them. If you've never questioned why you believe in what you believe, or if you accept it just because that's how you were rasied, then it's not worth anything anyway.
I was born and raised in a very Catholic family. When I was in middle school i started thinking about things, started reading up on religion and asking questions about it. I came to the decision that I thought it was all bull. Not everyone who has done the same thing has reached my conclusion, but still: Just THINKING ABOUT IT and examining it can make all the difference.
 
I read a great article where a very high ranking buddhist figurehead sent a young boy he has raised at his temple to America because he told him that there "is a higher force out there than us, and a creator that made the buddha" The kid who was a man by then came to america and became a christian. Buddhism has alot of positive things, that anyone could benefit greatly from. However denying a creator and worshipping a very profound man is not one of them. This thread has got alot of good things said so far. But the one thing I dont get is how alot of people think that stuff has to make sense to them. They believe that if they stand in the path of an A-Bomb they will die right? They probably dont understand how an atom bomb works or how to make one but they believe it can kill you. Now if the Atom bomb was detonated 2000 years ago and the only record was a highly detailed book about it, would they deny it ever happened? Everyone wants evidence about religion. Cause science has so much evidence.......you want evidence? How's 2000 years of belief and culture for evidence? What else that started that along ago has survived to this day? No club, or instsution has ever been as big or influential for that long of time. I bet its cause its all a big lie to control everyone. Does it look like Christians are in control of the world with all the deplorable things going on?
 
You didn't understand me, I wasn't talking about a rebelion or sth.It was just an excample .Maybe I said it wrong way, well my english probably is not very good (or whatever).After a few years I can see that my decision was made from my own experiences and thoughts and it wasn't directed against my parents.They even never forced me to do these thinks.So the growing up and the "teenager's anger" have nothing to do with it.Honestly.Yep that'd be stupid.

That's all.
 
Originally posted by Red Dragon
This thread has got alot of good things said so far. But the one thing I dont get is how alot of people think that stuff has to make sense to them. They believe that if they stand in the path of an A-Bomb they will die right? They probably dont understand how an atom bomb works or how to make one but they believe it can kill you. Now if the Atom bomb was detonated 2000 years ago and the only record was a highly detailed book about it, would they deny it ever happened?]

If what they described in a book matched up to the evidence of an A-Bomb, then it wouod have more credibility then a book(The Bible) that has little in common with the happenings of today.


Everyone wants evidence about religion. Cause science has so much evidence.......you want evidence? How's 2000 years of belief and culture for evidence? What else that started that along ago has survived to this day? No club, or instsution has ever been as big or influential for that long of time. I bet its cause its all a big lie to control everyone. Does it look like Christians are in control of the world with all the deplorable things going on?

Sure, the belief and culture has endured. As has the need to control the masses. The ancient Egyptians had many gods and whatnot. That lasted along time. So why not believe the Sun is actually a God? because there is nothing to substantiate it nowadays.

Remember, I'm not saying there isn't a God of some sort, but plain and simple, no one knows until they're dead. On that note, I'll paste a letter sent to a religious editorial writer(can't remember her name right now), and her demeaning of gays as it is against the teachings of "The Bible".......


a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbours. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female,provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

e) I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an
abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

g) Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?

i) I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear woolly gloves?

j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev.24:10-16) Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with
people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
 
Originally posted by LeftBench
Religion - Fiction

God - Fact

i feel this same way. i was raised my a catholic mother, and a jehovah witness father. i went to catholic school for 8 years, and after that I was so fed up with it, I went to public high school, and i became what I am today =)

As far as religion goes, I don't say anyone's religion is wrong. My mother bring filipino is devout catholic, but IMO religion leaves too many questions unanswered. I do believe that there is something out there thoough that created what we today know as "life" As with religion, evolution also leaves too many questions a mystery for me to believe that.

I think that if someone chooses to practice religion, any religion, if it makes them live a better and happier life, then that is f'in kickass for them, and how can that be wrong?

I think that religion was invented as a way on trying to control people. I personally believe that when I die, that's it. I'm dead, I don't want a heaven. I would rather my life come to an end and when it ends, I will leave with memories of the good, and when it's over, since I will be dead, I really won't remember the bad. And as far as heaven and hell goes, if it's true, I know where i'm headed
 
just remember, if you're in a plane and it's going down, all of your stankin' asses are gonna pray to GOD! it's easy to spout Marx and talk about how Christians are hypocrites, but when it hits the fan, most people will go back on their beliefs real quick!
 
Originally posted by Irae
You didn't understand me, I wasn't talking about a rebelion or sth.It was just an excample .Maybe I said it wrong way, well my english probably is not very good (or whatever).After a few years I can see that my decision was made from my own experiences and thoughts and it wasn't directed against my parents.They even never forced me to do these thinks.So the growing up and the "teenager's anger" have nothing to do with it.Honestly.Yep that'd be stupid.

That's all.


I said shit about being a rebel? Hmm I'm too lazy to look around to find out what you were talking about so I can respond...I don't think I replied to your post. I just relooked over everything and can't find out why I referred to at the top of your post.
 
Originally posted by A_Train
just remember, if you're in a plane and it's going down, all of your stankin' asses are gonna pray to GOD! it's easy to spout Marx and talk about how Christians are hypocrites, but when it hits the fan, most people will go back on their beliefs real quick!

First off, it's more of an expletive than plea for God. Second, if I'm about to die, I'll be thinking of my wife and children whom I'll never see again....not some God....but, that's just me
 
I beleive if there was a god it would be happy i am living life the way i want to.

To some extent i beleive in what jake says about the dictatorship, people are always scared about dictatorships but as long as the are progressive and not reactionary i wouldnt mind. its like people think they have aduty to rebel if something is denied to them.

I agree with ranger also, take a sociology class and you will see the idiology that is often perpetuated by religion. Its just a tool for the government to keep everyone in check. Look how it tried to keep down science and subjicate scientists. Something that proclaims itself to be holy and true shouldnt be worried about other theories. To me that shows fear.

Just look to saudi arabais and afghanistan to see what reactionary religion has done. Where did mohammed say that people should live like he did. Thats just bloody absurd and just a method of keeping people down. After all saudi would be overthrown pretty damn quickly, i could see some people getting a bit angry if they knew that they are feeding 15000 princes while they live in squallar.

Religious science is the new evil.
 
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