Quick comparison of karate and pugilism

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by JohnPJones, Feb 5, 2020.

  1. JohnPJones Green Belt

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    Last edited: Feb 6, 2020
  2. Blake_UK Orange Belt

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    Interesting article (and well written).
     
  3. rmongler Black Belt

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    The most offensive thing here is the desire for reductive partisanship.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2020
  4. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    That's an interesting article. It also addresses some of the concerns I have about doing modern boxing.

    Having said that, I think modern boxing is very well designed, and work extremely well in a pragmatic sense. The whole key is getting used to it. This is precisely the inflection point I'm @ right now where I'm starting to get the footwork, but only starting.

    There is a certain what I will call 'feel' to it when it's right. Also, and this is certainly true for me, there are certain instructors who I warm to when I attempt my persona to it... such as that Gal Female Boxing Coach. Some of the guys are too stiff and muscly... she's more relaxed and less tense. So i found a double hurdle to getting off on the right foot if you want a non-pun pun.

    The other thing and I got this from viewing a number of the different boxing videos posted to my comments when I started out,,, is that while there are basics, and starting lessons, boxing accommodates a wide variation in personal style or modifications / accommodations.

    With the karate kumite videos, we see pretty much the opposite.<datassdom>
     
  5. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    The other thing about this video is that the boxing approach has stark difference to the boxing methods when you factor in the kihon (basic) and kata practice especially.

    Similarities in how to use the body physically are bound to happen. But I feel boxing has it's own science.
     
  6. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    The other thing about this article... is that it bears out my initial finding that karate has, what can I say, kind of a big universe of things to cover. Too big @ 1st blush.

    The article really speaks of a lot of promise, then you have videos like this.
    Can BJJ’s Quality Control exist in Kungfu? Tyler Casselman on BJJ and Wingchun

    4,630 views
    •Feb 10, 2020
    [​IMG]
    Ramsey Dewey
    134K subscribers
    Tyler Casselman is a BJJ coach at Refuge Martial Arts in Shanghai, China, and also a Wing Chun kungfu practitioner. Tyler talks about the system of checks and balances that exists in jiu-jitsu that is notably absent from wingchun, which goes far beyond stress testing.

    I'm really beginning to warm to this guys channel, don't get me wrong. But a BJJ guy's interpretation of Wing chun? Like in terms of some kind of 'quality control.' Then Dewey get's into that 'saving face' BS which is just like MMA... how it's evolved {BARF}. Then we see here posted videos of Reyes whifffing & whiffing... BUT then it's a very close fight w MMA & Greg Jackson's best {more BARF}.

    Here's the simple, adult answer in traditional Judo terms. You have to learn to do the throws right, then the holds next. Before that, you have to master the proper breakfalls. And you have to have, get into some level of decent physical shape.

    This talk about factions, conventions, face savings, all that may make some sense in choosing a school or instructor... but @ our dojo talk is @ a bare minimum. The art is conveyed by the instructors. Period. If you fall right, you are fine and ready to go. If you do the throw right, it's amazing how you can dump somebody so smoothly. The holds, hold downs are pretty effective, no magic. The side hold down... I have some issue with it's practicality. We have to hold the opponent down for 30 seconds to score... not the 3 second pin or whatever in wrestling.

    All this crap about 'quality control' and talk, talk, talk, is just an excuse for not knowing how to do an art.<HisEye>
     
  7. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    This is also, again, what I like about boxing and which I posted to start w that girly boxing challenge. You have to get in there & work... the nutrition, the conditioning, the basics, the bag workout... and rinse, repeat. Don't talk about your great insights compared to hundreds of years of boxing... just follow the instructor and make it happen, or not in which case you don\t have the gumption to learn & train.<{Joewithit}>
     
  8. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    Tyler Casselman: "I feed you punches, I give you pressure, but I want you to succeed."<{natewhut}>

    He talks just like MMA coaches who have FOUND the answer. Refer to the Jones / Reyes fight for your answer. Bozo.{<RR}<{nope}>
     
  9. JohnPJones Green Belt

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    The modern point fighting and kyokushin are both very modern, and I have major problems with both.

    While old school boxing never banned head punches most fighters avoid too many to avoid hand injuries, so old school boxing probably did look a bit more like kyokushin fights than modern boxing.
     
  10. StanClarker Banned Banned

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    Still up in the air. I've only taken a summary look. See problems like you.

    It's an interesting idea to review history. The bottom line though, is to go to class, and try to really understand. Start out slow... which is tough for MMA competitors. MMA rushes people, to ill effect.

    Was going over modern karate that was getting at difference to boxing. There's something more there which I felt when I started posting. Eh, it can wait. I'm plodding w boxing footwork. No pun. REally, I think it comes together when you get the whole body language to the punch. Otherwise, it kinda sucks & explains the lousy MMA performances.<{titihmm}>
     
  11. JohnMc Brown Belt

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    Great article. Thanks for sharing it.
     
  12. Safton Purple Belt

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    Yeah. I enjoy watching both and I think both backgrounds can create excellent fighters... but they need plenty of time and effort spent on adaptation; the styles "as is" have glaring holes due to their rule sets.
     

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