Questions about a Fighter's Union

That's part of the reason for the thread. What are some key points I'm missing?

Well, I think one key thing people on here are conflating are regular unions vs. sports league unions. They are both unions, but it is best to analogize with sports unions like NFL, NBA, MLB. In each of those leagues, I don't know any argument that says they haven't helped the athlete immensely. Salaries for the cream of the crop don't seem limited (the big argument I see is that the Conor McGregors won't get paid), yet the worst benchwarmer in the league still makes a very good salary (better than probably 95% of the UFC roster).

Don't argue about unions in general here. It seems like apples and oranges.
 
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We have all seen how socialism and communism work, capitalism is not perfect, but is far better than any alternative.

People who think there are 2, 3, 4 discrete choices for an economic system shouldn't be involved in conversations about choosing an economic system.
 
Well, I think one key thing people on here are conflating are regular unions vs. sports league unions. They are both unions, but it is best to analogize with sports unions like NFL, NBA, MLB. In each of those leagues, I don't know any argument that says they haven't helped the athlete immensely. Salaries for the cream of the crop don't seem limited (the big argument I see is that the Conor McGregors won't get paid), yet the worst benchwarmer in the league still makes a very good salary (better than probably 95% of the UFC roster).

Don't argue about unions in general here. It seems like apples and oranges.
What about the associations for professional golfers and tennis players? Would they be comparable? All three are usually individual sports.
 
What about the associations for professional golfers and tennis players? Would they be comparable? All three are usually individual sports.

I'm not really aware of those sports (re: unions), or if they even have unions? But it is a good point (about being individual sports). The things I would say against those sports in comparing to MMA is that: a) tennis and golf don't seems have deplorable or even substandard conditions from what I know. They seem reasonably compensated. Secondly, tennis/golf aren't brutal sports where the players suffer tremendously post-career (with medical bills).
 
TS, the first thing you need to understand is the definition of a "union". Because I don't think you have a good grasp of what it actually is and how it works.
Why don't you enlighten the man since you seem to know so much?
 
Without some type of legal backing from a federal agency a union will be very hard to accomplish. They individually sign for a set number of fights and can't fight for anyone else until they complete these fights or get released by the UFC. Each fighter has a different contract, different financial situation, and they come from numerous different countries of origin. It is easy for the UFC to offer bonuses to the desired fighters individually that is too good to refuse. The union would need very good lawyers while having low funds to pay for the legal assistance. If they go on strike, they must keep fighters from almost every continent in line and refusing to fight. Many of these fighters are from poverty level countries and know that their window of opportunity to make good money is limited in this career.
 


GSP got a title shot and dropped out. UFC scared Cowboy out. TJ was given a coaching gig on TUF and a title shot so he dropped out. Kennedy retired 2 months after joining so he had no pull.
 
We can agree to disagree. I have seen what unions have done to our schools and manufacturing base in our country. Unions were useful when companies were abusing employees with long hours and unsafe work conditions. I saw my town, once a prosperous, thriving town, destroyed because every manufacturing plant pulled out due to taxes and unions. These jobs are now in India and China. Union's day has come and gone. I certainly appreciate differing views, this is my opinion.
Yes those manufacturing plants pulled out because of unions. That is likely true. But - and this is very key - that's because unions force companies to pay more. So they went to where either the workers couldn't unionize because some idiot who hates unions made it a right to work state which pays 1/2 or overseas because another idiot thought it was good to let our companies go anywhere they pay $2 a day. So now it's a perpetual race to the bottom for blue collar workers. And it's the unions fault because they should know better than trying to get workers higher wages.
 
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UFC will just cut anyone who unionizes or tries to form an association
True, but if those fighters were really about it they would not give up so easily, look at Leslie smith & Kajan Johnson. They practically gave up on their crusade which leads me to believe they were not about it in the first place
 
All the other major sports have unions. There can be a fighter union. The barrier really comes down to the top tier fighters not being able to sit out for a year and holdout.
 
We have all seen how socialism and communism work, capitalism is not perfect, but is far better than any alternative.
socialism-you-line-up-for-bread-capitalism-bread-lines-up-for-you.jpg
Systems liek those those can only work in a fantasy setting, real life humans are too corrupt l, power hungry, egotistical, and selfish to ever make it work
 
I'd say the bulk of the roster are doing pretty well commensurate with their talent, their earning potential outside the UFC and comparison with similar sports like boxing. The problem lies at the top of the card where the big names are certainly earning less. So why should the average fighter want a union or an Ali type act which, if the arguments we hear on Sherdog are anything to go by, would mean more for the top guys and less for them?
 
Hows the violence and inequality working out. Pretty sure there are more people in poverty in usa than russia. Tell this story to china in a few years. Take a trip to scandanavia where there is fairness and equality. The usa is self destructing and you still champion capitalism. I'm all for free enterprise but full blown capitalism is as bad as full blown communism. I'm pretty sure during the capitalist great depression people lined up for food. Mind blown.
You dont know anybody who grew up in Russia...
 
We can agree to disagree. I have seen what unions have done to our schools and manufacturing base in our country. Unions were useful when companies were abusing employees with long hours and unsafe work conditions. I saw my town, once a prosperous, thriving town, destroyed because every manufacturing plant pulled out due to taxes and unions. These jobs are now in India and China. Union's day has come and gone. I certainly appreciate differing views, this is my opinion.
I am fully willing, and already have admitted that unions are far from perfect and have been abused in certain circumstances. The WWEFC isn’t your town. It isn’t a company that can just pick up some new 3rd worlder to replace Kamaru Usman.
It is despicable that a company would put folks out of work rather than treat them fairly but unfortunately that is what happens sometimes. It’s a complex issue that in part goes back to the fact that Americans are lazy and worthless and would rather have a crappy product for cheap than see their neighbors employed. Same way Sherdog users would rather call Jon Jones a duck than see him get paid what he deserves.
 
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