Question for people with BJJ and Judo experience

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Jewlim3Ng, May 6, 2008.

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  1. Jewlim3Ng

    Jewlim3Ng White Belt

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    Hi guys,

    I'm looking for some opinions from folks who have trained in both judo and jiu jitsu. I saw the thread from a few days ago where someone asked about whether judo or BJJ would be a better introduction to grappling. My situation is somewhat similar, but with a bit of a twist in that I've been training BJJ for a couple of years. I really like my current coach/team. In a few months I'm going to have to leave to attend law school, so I won't be able to train at my BJJ academy except for a few days here and there over break for the next three years. I'd really prefer not to join another BJJ school, especially since law school will be close enough that typical BJJ politics might come into play at competitions and such (but not close enough that I will be able to drive 90 minutes each way several times a week to train). Instead, I'm currently leaning towards joining the judo club at the university. The coach is a very well-decorated judoka (world champion, Olympic medalist, etc.), so I'm not at all worried about the level of instruction and I've actually been pretty interested in studying judo at some point. However, I apologize for sounding ignorant, but I am wondering whether I need to be concerned about my ground skills eroding. Is this even something I should be worried about? How is judo newaza different from BJJ? Any general advice regarding my situation?

    Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
     
  2. georgejjr

    georgejjr Black Belt

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    World champion, olympic medalist ... are you talking about Jimmy Pedro? If you are, you're probably not going to lose any ground skills, and you're going to gain a lot of standup technique that will do you very good when you find a BJJ club later on.

    If its Jimmy, definitely go for it.
     
  3. knoxpk

    knoxpk Black Belt

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    If it is JP he was a judo champ and a college wrestler. No worries on losing ground skills in act you may be turned on to a different approach that can be very beneficial to you.

    As for the general question the answer depends on the school.

    Some Judo schools pracitce newaza every night along with the throws. So while you might not learn much "new" you may learna different approach while still getting to practice what you have already learned.

    Prepare to be frustrated whena guy holds you down in side control for 30 seconds and gets up as the winner.

    Remember Judo rules differ from BJJ so you cannot get upset about how they practice.
     
  4. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Nothing you should be worried about at all. Just enjoy having the opportunity to learn something new.

    Judo newaza is a bit more go-to on the ground, seeing as they have seconds (maybe longer, depending on the ref) to work for submissions/pins.
     
  5. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Pedro is a beast. Had the chance of coming to grips with him, and got thrown around like I had never done Judo before.
     
  6. Jewlim3Ng

    Jewlim3Ng White Belt

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    Thanks for all the replies, guys. The coach at the judo club isn't Pedro, it's Cho In Chul, who represented South Korea in 96 and 00. I have seen video clips of Jimmy Pedro, however, and the guy is flat-out amazing.

    I definitely plan to go into it with an open-mindset...I'm certainly more than happy to learn judo for its own sake, and I'm definitely aware that the rules are different. I'm just kind of in the dark as to the specifics. The level of technique and athleticism of the elite judokas is unreal and I'm sure that I'll get something worthwhile out of training almost exclusively in judo for 3 years, even if some of it isn't necessarily directly applicable to BJJ.

    More thoughts/experiences are welcome!
     
  7. Tony Manifold

    Tony Manifold Brown Belt

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    It will only help your game. The takedown aspect in itself is worth it, and the idea of quickly going for a sub. Pretty much the ideal in Judo would be to throw someone for an Ippon and lock on a sub for a tap before the Ref stops the match.
     
  8. grdstorm11

    grdstorm11 Blue Belt

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    It really depends on who is teaching Judo.

    if it is a Korean world champ, you might be in luck. I have no personal experience however all the elite level Judoka that fight in MMA have great ground skills (ex. Dong Sik Yoon).

    Korean Judo looks pretty good to me.
     
  9. jjmuaythaiguy

    jjmuaythaiguy Brown Belt

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    Take the judo, its going to help and you probably love it after a while. In judo, I learned so quickly because I am a sponge and take everything they say and just do it. Other people that come to my judo school come from other judo schools or have grappling experience so they have some conflicts but not me. I love judo.
     
  10. judogido

    judogido Aussie!, Aussie!, Aussie! ...

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    Some of your ground skills will probably get a bit rusty.

    However, other ground skills will improve and your standup certainally will, as will (probably) your strength and cardio.

    The BJJ-specific detail of the ground-game you can keep "fresher" by attending the occasional casual session once a month or so if you wish, but even if you cannot - once you start up BJJ again it doesn't take long for it to come back.
     
  11. Thrawn33

    Thrawn33 JUST BLEED Belt

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    Just remember when you're at a Judo club you're there to <b>learn</b> Judo not <b>practice</b> BJJ. Keep that mindset and attitude and you will do fine. Vice-versa is of course true for Judoka's going to a BJJ club.

    Had a former BJJ WB who wanted to do nothing but newaza show up once. He'd visibly pout when we worked the stand up side of things. When he finally got to do some newaza he wouldn't shut up. Just to piss him I did nothing but pins on him and he kept complaing about how that I should go for more subs...

    I know he's a bad example, but its a good illustration of what not to do.
     
  12. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    There's nothing better than a good example of a bad example. :icon_chee
     
  13. spat

    spat White Belt

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    Anyone heard of Lowell Slaven? It when to a school of his for a while because it was the only thing in town. He claimed to teach jj and judo with the emphasis on judo. I never heard anything other than how Judo was greater than Bjj and wrestling. The ground grappling was a bit lacking. Just an example of how Judo really, really depends on the school.
     
  14. judofarmerbob

    judofarmerbob Banned Banned

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    Learning Judo should never, ever hurt your grappling. I hate how BJJ guys talk like Judo guys don't roll enough. My club splits it almost perfectly between randori and newaza, depending on what the Grandmaster feels like doing.

    Then again, tonight he decided we were going to practice flying armbar for an hour and a half...I love that man.

    IOWA STATE FTW!!!
     
  15. Jewlim3Ng

    Jewlim3Ng White Belt

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    Thanks for all of the replies. I apologize if i gave off the impression that I was belittling judo in any way or that I would only learn judo for the sake of its applicability to jiu jitsu. I was deliberately trying not to seem like I was communicating that sentiment, and I feel that my previous posts indicate that. I'm just simply not very knowledgeable about judo aside from the fact that I know there's relatively less emphasis on the ground game in judo than in BJJ. That is why I'm soliciting you all's opinions. Trust me, I am not the guy who shows up and gets all whiny when asked to try something new nor am I the guy who is always insisting that my Tiger Kung Fu is better than your Dragon Fist or whatever. I just wanted to hear some thoughts before I jumped into judo, since I've never done it before. Again, I apologize if the question offended anyone. It wasn't my intent.
     
  16. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Nah man you didn't offend anybody. I don't think anyone was, at least. It's great to ask questions. I would definately do it man. You may have a little rust when/if you go bac to full time BJJ, but you'll be right back on track. It's worth it for the stand-up game.

    Just remember man. Judo can be pretty rough. Don't get discouraged, just keep yourself safe and get rally good at your ukemi (falling, receiving skills, rolling, etc.) It's never fun to be injured. It may be a difficult transition into Judo at first, but you'll get it.
     
  17. shmish111

    shmish111 White Belt

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    If you're planning on going back to BJJ after your degree, think how good it will be to have 3 years of good Judo under your belt, especially in competition. One of my BJJ teachers (who is a Black belt Judoka) always says it is good to take a good Judo grip at the start of a competition BJJ fight even if you don't do Judo. This will make the oponent think you are good at Judo and they will be tempted to jump to guard. If you're expecting him to do this then you're in a pretty good position to pass the guard before he even hits the ground leaving you in a dominant position. Also, if you actually do have 3 years of Judo, you're going to be pretty strong on your feet and people are going to struggle to take you down. You've got the advantage from the beggining. You're also going to get pretty good at basic ground work and be able to do it quick and strong. You can learn all the complicated BJJ techniques when you've finished law school!
     
  18. Thalion

    Thalion Green Belt

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  19. IChinaManI

    IChinaManI Green Belt

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    Listen to this guy, he speaks the truth. It doesn't take long for your ground stuff to come back, and if you're at a good club, they'll undoubtedly have alot of ground stuff. Like others have said, judo will only help, your takedown game will be stronger, and your base and control will be much much better. As far as ground stuff goes, you'll probably not have alot of instruction on what to do from the bottom, but you can practise your guard games in free newaza, and most likely they'll be a few guys who are into that stuff as it is, and you'll be able to train with them. Though your bottom game might not get much better, your top game will be way better with judo.
     
  20. Brooklyn BJJ

    Brooklyn BJJ CW Platinum Member

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    I would cross train in BJJ, right now i take BJJ and cross train in Judo/Sambo.. few things that bother me are:


    1) Grappling techniques are not perfectly executed (crossing legs on arm bar.. etc).
    2) Most of students there are not that great at grappling to have as a partner (I'm not great
    at all but sub all of them, unless they outweigh me by 40 pounds or something).
    3) I got subbed only by 250 pound guy who did JJ and another brown belt at judo who out weighted me and grappled me after 10 minute session. (I'm 165)
    4) You might be lucky to grapple with those two once a week for 5 minutes.

    So yeah.. you need to cross train to roll with better guys IMHO.
     
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