Prime HW GOAT, imo not Stipe.

In my opinion, the way to rank heavyweights is to talk about accomplishments that were unprecedented for their respective times.

1. Fabricio Werdum: Beat an undefeated Fedor Emilianenko; also Cain Velasquez, both of whom everyone considered unstoppable for their times. Werdum is incredibly underrated, but what he accomplished here is the equivalent of McGregor beating Jose Aldo (Cain Velasquez) and Khabib (Fedor Emelianenko). Look at it this way - if McGregor became a superstar for having defeated Jose Aldo, imagine where his legacy would be if he also defeated Khabib. This is essentially what Werdum successfully achieved, and he never received the credit he deserved. The MMA fans were only like "meh... okay, cool, whatever." In other words, they are sheep that let themselves be led by advertising, because let's face it, UFC didn't spend a dime to promote Werdum.

2. Stipe Miocic: I think everyone forgot the hype that surrounded Miocic vs Ngannou. Leading up to this fight, everyone (including the fans) was TERRIFIED of Ngannou, and almost no one could picture him getting defeated. Almost everyone said that Ngannou was gonna knock Miocic out in the first seconds of the fight, and it was almost impossible to imagine anything else occurring - in fact, because of this matchup, everyone believed the Heavyweight division was cursed and that every champion was condemned to defending the belt only twice... except Miocic, defying the imagination of virtually MMA fan, defeated Ngannou in a convincing fashion, AND broke the curse that inhabited the Heavyweight division. Of course, just like Werdum, the UFC spent no money promoting him despite this astonishing accomplishment, so the consumerist sheep didn't utter his name.

3. Fedor Emelianenko: Could arguably be number 1; however, some arguments have been made that he did not defeat any former UFC Champions in their prime (meaning he did not join the UFC to defeat the fighters that were en-route to becoming champions). I am not saying he is not the greatest heavyweight of all time, merely that the arguments made from both sides of the spectrum are acceptable; furthermore, Fedor is one of the most controversial fighters because of this reason, so unlike Werdum and Miocic, there is no consensus from the MMA community regarding his accomplishments.
 
No, TS, people don't say always this. As a matter of fact, few people consider Stipe the HW Goat.
Fedor has a bigger fan base, probably even DC has more fans than Stipe.
There were so many people here that wanted Stipe to get KOd by Ngannou, you believed Sherdog was Black fucking Panters.
You just needed some motivation to create another GOAT thread. Good for you!
Fan base doesn’t matter when two fighters are squared up. So I don’t see your point.
 
Any discussion of Cain's rank needs to specify between all-time rank and peak prime rank

All-time I don't even know if I have Cain top 5, but regarding peak prime I only have Fedor ahead of him
 
Stipe's competition is laughably old and shitty.

Dude has not beaten a single good fighter in their 20s. 90% cans and washed up old guys.

Cain got fucked by injuries and by fighting the same twp guys five times in his prime.
Good career but not earthshattering.
 
Fan base doesn’t matter when two fighters are squared up. So I don’t see your point.

I was commenting to "People always say 'Stipe is the HW GOAT' 'Stipe is better than Cain' 'Stipe is better than Fedor' etc etc… "
 
Stipe's competition is laughably old and shitty.

Dude has not beaten a single good fighter in their 20s. 90% cans and washed up old guys.

Cain got fucked by injuries and by fighting the same twp guys five times in his prime.
Good career but not earthshattering.
I've never seen thread that mentions Stipe without you posting bullshit.

Congratulations.
 
3. Fedor Emelianenko: Could arguably be number 1; however, some arguments have been made that he did not defeat any former UFC Champions in their prime (meaning he did not join the UFC to defeat the fighters that were en-route to becoming champions).

Arlovski had never looked better in his recent fights before fighting Fedor. Fedor beat the best version of Arlovski ever, that's not even debatable imo. He obviously also beat prime Nog who won the UFC belt after his prime, and Sylvia had lost his UFC belt only a year before facing Fedor.
 
Overeem and Werdum >>>>>>>>>> Stipe
 
White belt level post.

HW GOATS

Fedor
Nog
Werdum
Crocop
Couture.

I could care less about the next 5, since none of them put on the same level of excitement, or brought something new and fresh to the sport. Nothing about Stipe is epic and his level of competition wouldn't even give him a number 6 spot above Barnett, Arlovski, Sylvia, Mir take your pick.
 
Stipe is a bit overrated. His vaunted win streak was only 6 fights. Cain had 7 fight win streak and JDS had a 9 fight win streak.

I would honestly rank Big Nog over Stipe, IMO he's still #2 behind Fedor in terms of HW GOAT rankings.
 
I rank them like this.

1. Fedor
2. Cain Velasquez
3. Daniel Cormier
4. Stipe Miocic
5. Could be a lot of diff guys with arguments for each, former champs like Randy, Sylvia, Brock, Carwin, Mir, JDS, BIg Nog, Werdum, guys who have consistently won like Overeem, Kharitonov, Barnett, Arlovski, Ngannou, but no clear guy near the 4th spot.
Since I already heavily invested time into this topic, I'll simply quote my own thread:
Criteria:
  • Number of top ten opponents at Heavyweight.
  • Time spent ranked as a top five fighter in the Heavyweight Division
  • Only listing #1-10 Heavyweight ranked opponents in candidates' resumes.

Honorable Mention - Cain Velasquez
ufc155_12_velasquez_vs_jds_045.jpg

Velasquez' resume:

#3 Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
#1 Brock Lesnar
#9 Antonio Silva
#1 Junior dos Santos
#3 Antonio Silva
#2 Junior dos Santos
#8 Travis Browne

Velasquez defeated seven, top ten opponents.
Velasquez was ranked in the top five from 1/1/10 to 1/1/15 and 7/1/15 to 10/1/17 for a combined total of 7 years and 3 months.

The overly redundant resume and the fact that a large portion of the time that Velasquez was ranked in the top five he was inactive due to injury, is why he gets only an honorable mention.

#5 - Fabricio Werdum
werdum-696x392.jpg

Werdum's resume:

#4 Gabriel Gonzaga
#1 Fedor Emelianenko
#5 Travis Browne
#5 Mark Hunt
#1 Cain Velasquez
#8 Travis Browne

Werdum defeated six, top ten opponents.
Werdum was ranked in the top five from 4/1/08 to 10/1/08, 7/1/10 to 10/1/11, 4/1/12 to 1/1/13, 7/1/13 to 4/1/18 for a combined total of 7 years and 3 months.

#4 - Stipe Miocic
nintchdbpict000331979555.jpg

Miocic's resume:

#5 Mark Hunt
#3 Andrei Arlovski
#1 Fabricio Werdum
#3 Alistair Overeem
#5 Junior dos Santos
#2 Francis Ngannou
#1 Daniel Cormier

Miocic defeated seven, top ten opponents.
Miocic was ranked in the top five from 4/1/14 to 7/1/14 and 4/1/15 to Today for a combined total of 4 years and 11 months.

#3 - Junior dos Santos
jdsbelt.jpg

dos Santos' resume:

#4 Fabricio Werdum
#9 Mirko Filipovic
#6 Shane Carwin
#1 Cain Velasquez
#4 Frank Mir
#9 Mark Hunt
#6 Ben Rothwell
#4 Derrick Lewis

dos Santos defeated eight, top ten opponents.
dos Santos was ranked in the top five from 10/1/09 to 4/1/10, 10/1/10 to 1/1/16, 7/1/16 to 1/1/18, and 4/1/19 to Today for a combined total of 7 years and 11 months.

#2 - Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
Antonio.jpg

Nogueira's resume:

#5 Valentijn Overeem
#5 Gary Goodridge
#3 Mark Coleman
#6 Ricco Rodriguez
#5 Mirko Filipovic
#10 Heath Herring
#9 Fabricio Werdum
#3 Josh Barnett
#9 Tim Sylvia
#5 Randy Couture

Nogueira defeated ten, top ten opponents.
Nogueira was ranked in the top five from 4/1/01 to 1/1/10 for a combined total of 8 years and 9 months.

#1 - Fedor Emelianenko
3234.jpg

Emelianenko's resume:

#8 Renato Sobral
#6 Semmy Schilt
#1 Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
#9 Gary Goodridge
#9 Mark Coleman
#7 Kevin Randleman
#2 Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
#4 Mirko Filipovic
#4 Mark Coleman
#7 Mark Hunt
#8 Tim Sylvia
#6 Andrei Arlovski
#8 Brett Rogers

Emelianenko defeated thirteen, top ten opponents.
Emelianenko was ranked in the top five from 4/1/02 to 1/1/11 for a combined total of 8 years and 9 months.

For those who will undoubtedly ask about Daniel Cormier:
Cormier's resume:

#6 Antonio Silva
#8 Josh Barnett
#7 Frank Mir
#1 Stipe Miocic
#5 Derrick Lewis

Cormier defeated five, top ten opponents.
Cormier was ranked in the top five from
7/1/12 to 1/1/14 and 10/1/18 to Today for a combined total of 2 years and 8 months.

Cormier has the least amount of top ten wins and the shortest amount of time spent in the top five rankings out of everyone in this list (including Velasquez).
 
Gifted a bullshit draw after getting fucking schooled by Fury.

2 10-8 rounds for Wilder & don't forget some of the early rounds had so little action that it could have gone to either way.
 
1 year past prime stipe would still k*ll baldonado and hendo in a single night

1 year past prime as fedor fans claims got ktfo by hendo
dc was also superior than fedor. he throwed around hendo like a helpless kid inside the cage

i know its hard to accept theres lots of better fighters than fedor

bigfoot is cains punching bag,have u even watched bf vs fedor

now think of what i posted re read
 
Since I already heavily invested time into this topic, I'll simply quote my own thread:
Well done indeed. I don't respect any ranking that doesn't have Fedor at 1 and Nog at 2. But I don't buy the quality of Dos Santos wins even if they are top 5. Too many opponents he beat were on rapid decline. And I still regard Crocop's wins in k1 and kickboxing as a valid contributor to his overall greatness as an MMA fighter. So goes in top five for me not to mention the sheer epic ness and excitement that has rarely been duplicated. Couture belongs above Cormier or even Cain in my book.
 
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