Poll (By Request) -- Better Legacy: Shogun or Machida?

I love the 'Machida is pulling away' argument. 6-5 since getting that gift against Shogun.

Machida has looked way better and has beat much better competition though in that time. If people want to cry about Shogun's losses being robberies or flukes then the same can be said about 2 of those fights you just mentioned making him 8-3 since then.
 
Machida has looked way better and has beat much better competition though in that time. If people want to cry about Shogun's losses being robberies or flukes then the same can be said about 2 of those fights you just mentioned making him 8-3 since then.

Not really, only names Machida has over Shogun is Evans. Shogun has more top ten wins, including wins over Machida himself and Rampage. Competition is much closer than you believe.
 
Not really, only names Machida has over Shogun is Evans. Shogun has more top ten wins, including wins over Machida himself and Rampage. Competition is much closer than you believe.

Look at that quote I replied to. I wasn't saying all-time I was talking about since they had their first fight. A lot of people picking Machida are picking him due to his resurgence at MW. As I said, a year ago I'd pick Shogun, but Machida with his recent victories pushes him over Shogun slightly.
 
Look at that quote I replied to. I wasn't saying all-time I was talking about since they had their first fight. A lot of people picking Machida are picking him due to his resurgence at MW. As I said, a year ago I'd pick Shogun, but Machida with his recent victories pushes him over Shogun slightly.

How? Machida didn't win 2 major titles and he got KTFO by Shogun and most had Shogun beating him the first time too. Shogun also was number 1 longer than Machida was. Machida needs to win a second belt to pass Shogun.
 
How? Machida didn't win 2 major titles and he got KTFO by Shogun and most had Shogun beating him the first time too. Shogun also was number 1 longer than Machida was. Machida needs to win a second belt to pass Shogun.

Because longevity is an important criteria to me. Shogun had a lot more ups and downs compared to Machida. His ups are probably higher than Machida's, but he's had way more disappointing performances and slumps in his career. It's just my opinion, I don't care if people think Shogun is way ahead, they have a strong argument for it and it's not something I'll debate hours against. I just don't like when people make excuses for Shogun but don't give Machida benefit of the doubt.
 
Anyone who picks either as "clearly" is a delusional fanboy. What this poll demonstrates is Shogun has much more of those.
 
Its close, but Machida takes it. His career is still going strong. Hell, even as a young up and comer he finished Franklin before Rich went on his UFC title run.
 
If Machida manages to capture the MW strap then IMO he'll surpass Rua, but since he fell short of doing so in his last attempt, right now my vote goes to Rua.
 
Because longevity is an important criteria to me. Shogun had a lot more ups and downs compared to Machida. His ups are probably higher than Machida's, but he's had way more disappointing performances and slumps in his career. It's just my opinion, I don't care if people think Shogun is way ahead, they have a strong argument for it and it's not something I'll debate hours against. I just don't like when people make excuses for Shogun but don't give Machida benefit of the doubt.

So it's more about consistency for you that accomplishments? It's better to be consistently near the top than being at the top longer and winning more titles?

I don't think most people view it the way you do.

Based on your criteria I can see why you picked Machida but I don't think most people have the same criteria when talking about a fighters legacy. I think they think more about how many belts they won, how many top 10 wins they have, how long they were at number 1 ect. I believe Shogun leads him in all those categories and has the tie breaker of beating Machida(most think twice).

What do you mean by this?
 
Machida. Even in his losses against some future greats he has never looked overmatched unlike Shogun.
 
i would say machida,because win or lose,he generally performed excellent on a more consistent basis than shogun who was always hampered by injuries and came in to alot of fights as damaged goods,and not fulfilling his potential in the same way that Machida has.
Machida to me still looks the same after all these years,and can probably keep going for years to come,while still fighting the top fighters in the world,whereas shogun looks like he hasnt got 2 or 3 fights left in him.
 
Unless Machida gets another belt. Shogun still have a better legacy.
 
So it's more about consistency for you that accomplishments? It's better to be consistently near the top than being at the top longer and winning more titles?

I don't think most people view it the way you do.

Based on your criteria I can see why you picked Machida but I don't think most people have the same criteria when talking about a fighters legacy. I think they think more about how many belts they won, how many top 10 wins they have, how long they were at number 1 ect. I believe Shogun leads him in all those categories and has the tie breaker of beating Machida(most think twice).

What do you mean by this?

According to this:

http://forums.sherdog.com/forums/f2/documented-top-ten-wins-mma-fighters-pride-ufc-2166169/

Machida at this point has more ranked wins. They have similar enough accomplishments imo that consistency does play a factor. Shogun was amazing for several years, and then had flashes of greatness. Machida for the most part has been great throughout his entire career. I don't think that number of top 10 wins is more better than having won titles in many cases, but it's not like Shogun was a long time reigning champion or anything like that.

If you want to argue that Shogun's GP run and UFC victory is more impressive than Machida's entire career, then ok, cool. I really have no problem with anyone saying that.
 
Did you miss the Jones fight and Shogun rematch? Machida looked overmatched in both.

He won the first round against Jones and was beating shogun in their second fight before getting dropped. Getting finished isn't the same as getting dominated; Shogun has been thrashed from start to finish numerous times in his career.
 
If we're talking about UFC record only you have to go with Machida. But What Shogun did in PRIDE gives him the edge overall.
 
He won the first round against Jones and was beating shogun in their second fight before getting dropped. Getting finished isn't the same as getting dominated; Shogun has been thrashed from start to finish numerous times in his career.

I'm a huge Machida fan, but come on, that fight was three and a half minutes. the "he was winning until he lost" argument is lame enough as it is without being used on fights that didn't get out of the first round. Try to have a little objectivity man!
 
According to this:

http://forums.sherdog.com/forums/f2/documented-top-ten-wins-mma-fighters-pride-ufc-2166169/

Machida at this point has more ranked wins. They have similar enough accomplishments imo that consistency does play a factor. Shogun was amazing for several years, and then had flashes of greatness. Machida for the most part has been great throughout his entire career. I don't think that number of top 10 wins is more better than having won titles in many cases, but it's not like Shogun was a long time reigning champion or anything like that.

If you want to argue that Shogun's GP run and UFC victory is more impressive than Machida's entire career, then ok, cool. I really have no problem with anyone saying that.

I wouldn't count the Franklin one, he was ranked at MW and they fought at 214. So Machida has 1 more top 10 win but got finished by Shogun, doesn't have as many belts and wasn't number 1 as long, I think that more than makes up for 1 more top 10 win.

I can see your point of view but unless TS specifies what he means by Legacy we can't really answer the question very well as the people picking Machida seem to be picking him based on being consistently near the top and the people picking Shogun are picking him cause he reached greater heights in MMA and beat Machida up twice.
 
Back
Top