Law Police departments facing critical shortages so some are lowering standards.

[Bald1]

This is a self fulfilling prophecy.

Cops suck.
Defund the police.
Nobody applies.
Standards get lowered.
Shit candidates get hired.
Cops suck.

Round and round we go.

 

[method115]

We disagree on one fundamental issue. We both agree it’s easy to get, we have a ton of overdoses, we need more free rehabs, more education, more resources period. I know we can’t arrest our way out of this issue, however, I believe things would get worse, not better, if the hardcore drugs were legalized. Stigma is a very big factor. It is both negative and positive. It is negative in that normal people that are addicts would fear seeking treatment because it labels them an addict and that has a scummy feel to it as a label. But stigma is also what keeps many people from trying it as well as being illegal. If you legalize it, people assume it is safe, and it never is whether regulated or not. And it may be easy now, but make it legal, and it is absolutely everywhere. Before my back surgery, I was on opioids for severe pain. The week before the surgery, the doctor told me that I had to go off of them or he said I would be in more misery than I could imagine because the pain meds after the surgery would be almost ineffective if I didn’t go off of them. That meant cold Turkey because I had no other options. I finished out the script and didn’t get a refill. That week was so fucking miserable. I remember it was my daughter’s sixth birthday and I struggled through the party and after it was over, I was in my attic crawling up the walls. Withdrawal is a bitch on wheels. I remember thinking that I was a cop and if I wanted ti get some pills, I wouldn’t even know where to start nor would I have done it, but if that shit was available in stores, I wouldn’t have made that week probably without buying more. Even with my neural pathways getting adjusted to being off the pills, the surgery was still miserable. They removed two discs and fused the spine then put brackets on both sides of the spine. Every time I moved, it felt like I was splitting in half. I can only imagine if the pills at the hospital had been less effective. But after all of that, I had to go off of them again, which I tapered and it wasn’t as bad, but still sucked. Now I would never take something not prescribed to me and sure as fuck bit something illegal, but if it was easily accessible in stores….that “illegal” stigma is erased. I would have never told anyone that a few years ago because I was so embarrassed. I had a hard time telling my wife how bad the withdrawals were and was so ashamed. But since, I have opened up to people and have realized that I was in so much pain that medication was the only way I could sit or move and I shouldn’t be ashamed and should be proud that I made it through when so many don’t. So again, stigma isn’t a powerful positive and negative motivator

It's funny because I had a very similar experience. Except I was just taking the pills recreationally my friend was giving them to me. Getting high off weed and taking opioids is still one of the best feelings I've ever had in my life. There are very few things in life that have topped that feeling for me and nothing tops it as far as how long it last.

Then one day out of nowhere I threw up in the morning and I had no idea why. What's crazy is that without even knowing anything about opioids I knew this was because of the pills. I called my friend up and told him what happened and he explained to me that the pills are addictive and this can happen when you go threw withdrawals. So I stopped taking them and went through 2 weeks of feeling like shit. I still remember what it was like coming home one day and just feeling happy for the first time in 2 weeks.

You took that experience and have decided that society can't handle something like that being readily available. Even though you yourself managed to stop. I took it and realized it wasn't that bad to get off of I just stopped taking them. Yes it sucked for 2 weeks and then I was good and this was over a year of taking them daily.

I think the biggest thing I realized with hanging out with all my old friends most of which I lost due to opioid addiction is that none of them were happy with their lives. They all had deep shit to deal with and they self medicated to try and deal with the pain. Every single one of my friends who were happy outside of just using drugs is successful and doing fine these days. I don't talk to most of them just from us drifting apart but we are all on FB and they seem to be doing great.

If we don't want to make all drugs legal fine at the very least we need to stop arresting and imprisoning users and frankly stop with the war on drugs in general. Just leave all that shit alone. That will lead to it's own problems since people will still OD from drugs being laced but we have to stop putting users in jail it's not doing anything positive for our society.

 

[freakroor]

arent there damn near a million LEO's in america? i doubt we need more. that's just the propaganda they feed us.

We need fewer cops , not more. they need to be better at their job.

 

[SummerStriker]

This is a self fulfilling prophecy.

Cops suck.
Defund the police.
Nobody applies.
Standards get lowered.
Shit candidates get hired.
Cops suck.

Round and round we go.

Cops are always going to suck because 100% of the people who become cops have something wrong with them that makes them think that they should do violence on other citizens, and the only reason they exist is because the self imposed process of domestication our early ape ancestors started out on is incomplete.

 

[Bald1]

Cops are always going to suck because 100% of the people who become cops have something wrong with them that makes them think that they should do violence on other citizens, and the only reason they exist is because the self imposed process of domestication our early ape ancestors started out on is incomplete.

Chances are pretty good that I've run across more cops than most people and this just isn't rue.

 

[spamking]

Nah, I had a sister 2 years older so my ass was pretty safe.

I'm not kidding. It happened all over. Few towns over there was a huge scandal eventually. Football team was on a trip. Older kids grabbed the younger ones and started shoving shit up their asses. One of the kids who got a pine comb stuck up his ass wouldn't stop bleeding, so he told the whole thing to his mom. All hell broke loose:

A Long Island school board has voted to end a high school football team's season amid allegations that some players were sexually assaulted by older teammates at a training camp.

The Bellmore-Merrick school board decided at a Wednesday night closed-door meeting to cancel all of the Mepham High School football team's games, Newsday reported in Thursday editions.

Three varsity players, ages 15, 16 and 17, allegedly sodomized three junior varsity players with a broomstick, pine cones and golf balls while other players watched, the newspaper reported.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/sodomy-shocker-at-ny-high-school-02-10-2003/

Same shit was going down at my school, and the coaches even found out eventually, but they managed to keep things quiet. Kids who did it are legit NYPD now.

Wow. I couldn't imagine what I'd do to the kids who did something like this to one of my own . . . and the coaches who let it happen.

 

[Mohawk Mauler]

The kids I grew up with who microwaved gerbils and sodomized the underclassmen in the locker room all went on to join the NYPD. Their psychological screening process obviously needs some work and I can't imagine how the NYPD could make their standards any lower.

Someone in the old neighborhood was once known for tying up his OWN dog and repeatedly shooting it with a bb gun just because it wouldnt stop barking,same guy would fight you just because you were laughing or smiling out in public n he thinks you made a joke or rude comment about him that he didnt hear.....Drugs/Alchohol consumption was through the roof with this guy also.

Same guy is a cop now.

 

[Kirra]

This is a self fulfilling prophecy.

Cops suck.
Defund the police.
Nobody applies.
Standards get lowered.
Shit candidates get hired.
Cops suck.

Round and round we go.

I think Uvalde proved that heavy funding to the police isn't really helping either.

There needs to be a reform, preferably one that completely tears down that garbage of an institution and replaces it with something less shitty.

 

[spamking]

This is why people are turning on police, because they are showing everyone they don't give a fuck and will do whatever they want.

Then you have cops like this who are showing restraint . . . when deadly force is very likely justified.

 

[Bojka]

My brother in law told me that this is rubbing off on Canada and even they now can't find qualified applicants... lol.

 

[Bald1]

I think Uvalde proved that heavy funding to the police isn't really helping either.

There needs to be a reform, preferably one that completely tears down that garbage of an institution and replaces it with something less shitty.

Just throwing money at problems in hopes that things will sort themselves out isn't a solution either, no. You're right on that. But neither is what you're advocating.

War on drugs, making cops a revenue generating agency, the us vs them mentality and the unwillingness to report their own, etc etc, has poisoned the institution in some cases as well. There's lots of issues that need to be addressed, but tearing it all down is a cure that's worse than the disease. Most people are consequentialists so we need people to dole out consequences. There's no getting around that.

 

[SLUG1186]

Then you have cops like this who are showing restraint . . . when deadly force is very likely justified.

This isn't really the best example. While deadly force would have been justified, there was a kid in the car that you have to take into consideration. No kid in the car, light it up, but you do have to consider what you could potentially hit in that situation. There were a number of other bystanders.

It's a balancing act. I don't want DA's and prosecuters throwing cops under the bus and releasing criminals, but I also want accountability. We can't even have an honest conversation with the current rhetoric of "all cops are bad and racist black lives matter" crowd vs "cops can do no wrong blue lives matter" crowd.

 

[nhbbear]

Hes not the only one. Im pretty pro cop but every person i have ever known personally to go into the force has been abusive, unstable, or had a chip on their shoulder. None of the best people i know are cops and thats unfortunate because a few of them would be an improvement on this shit.

Edit. How do they attract better men in your opinion?

Raise the requirements or have incentives for college educated people to take the job.

For example, if you offer 20k for a college degree, 30k for an advanced degree, and a contract of five years (you don’t want them taking the money and then skipping out a year later), or offer a pathway to get the degree, and a lower bonus. As I said earlier, college degrees don’t guarantee a good cop, but generally, it does because you learn to navigate people better, have a better grasp on how to research and think, are a little more mature than a high school ged and being 18 years old, it’s life experience, and in the case of criminal Justice, you have a jump on the material and understand police work a little better.

If you raise the standards, you have to do something to keep those good officers there, so health insurance is a big incentive as is longevity pay of say 5% every five years or maybe 3%, but the only raises I got were from promotions and the odd 3% raise, but that only happened like 3 times during my career.

 

[nhbbear]

It's funny because I had a very similar experience. Except I was just taking the pills recreationally my friend was giving them to me. Getting high off weed and taking opioids is still one of the best feelings I've ever had in my life. There are very few things in life that have topped that feeling for me and nothing tops it as far as how long it last.

Then one day out of nowhere I threw up in the morning and I had no idea why. What's crazy is that without even knowing anything about opioids I knew this was because of the pills. I called my friend up and told him what happened and he explained to me that the pills are addictive and this can happen when you go threw withdrawals. So I stopped taking them and went through 2 weeks of feeling like shit. I still remember what it was like coming home one day and just feeling happy for the first time in 2 weeks.

You took that experience and have decided that society can't handle something like that being readily available. Even though you yourself managed to stop. I took it and realized it wasn't that bad to get off of I just stopped taking them. Yes it sucked for 2 weeks and then I was good and this was over a year of taking them daily.

I think the biggest thing I realized with hanging out with all my old friends most of which I lost due to opioid addiction is that none of them were happy with their lives. They all had deep shit to deal with and they self medicated to try and deal with the pain. Every single one of my friends who were happy outside of just using drugs is successful and doing fine these days. I don't talk to most of them just from us drifting apart but we are all on FB and they seem to be doing great.

If we don't want to make all drugs legal fine at the very least we need to stop arresting and imprisoning users and frankly stop with the war on drugs in general. Just leave all that shit alone. That will lead to it's own problems since people will still OD from drugs being laced but we have to stop putting users in jail it's not doing anything positive for our society.

I am fine with not arresting addicts, but they often are involved in other crimes to support their habit. My suggestion is that we have enough treatment centers that you can take a guy with a b&e charge and offer him treatment in lieu of jail or prison.

And most people are not like us in that if the drug is available that prevents withdrawals, they will take it. I simply can’t imagine going to a store and buying heroin or meth-can you? I freely admit I don’t know what the answer is, but decriminalization does not feel right to me.

 

[SLUG1186]

Police are fucking tyrants. They abuse everyone. They have abused me and I don't break the law.


When a knife carrying psycho broke into my home in 1997, the police response time was 55 minutes.

They hate the Constitution. They don't know the law and they want to kill you.







How about trying to kill a pregnant woman because she wanted a safe place to stop?

Qualified immunity. Never accountable.

How about straight up murder and then rendering no aid?




MURDER.

Police are taught to hate us. They earn their own hate.

I try not to go that far. The culture that has persisted is one of us vs them and a lot if it comes back to the "warrior cop training" that's been pumped into their heads. One of the more troubling things you do see, is how angry and agitated they get when they deal with someone who does exercise their rights. It is troubling how little they actually know about the laws they are supposed to be enforcing. It may be ignorance of the law but I think most often it's them hoping their subject is ignorant of the law and is intimidated enough to waive their rights thinking they will get better treatment. When really your just helping them try to incriminate you.

 

[spamking]

This isn't really the best example. While deadly force would have been justified, there was a kid in the car that you have to take into consideration. No kid in the car, light it up, but you do have to consider what you could potentially hit in that situation. There were a number of other bystanders.

I figured you might use the kid as a reason they showed restraint . . . and that's fine. I'm glad they were able to actually not respond with deadly force. In the heat of that moment it would've been understandable to for a cop to do something different without knowing there was a kid involved. The point was there are those out there who would say cops are mindless in how they respond and how they go about just shooting first and asking questions later. This was just one example of them not doing that.

It's a balancing act. I don't want DA's and prosecuters throwing cops under the bus and releasing criminals, but I also want accountability. We can't even have an honest conversation with the current rhetoric of "all cops are bad and racist black lives matter" crowd vs "cops can do no wrong blue lives matter" crowd.

Definitely a balancing act.

 

[nhbbear]

There are alot more fat cops now

Yeah, I have little tolerance for really fat people in general and definitely don’t like to see fat and out of shape cops. I am not, nor have I ever been a good runner. In a foot chase, I was rarely helpful, but I could bench press a truck and I have been training bjj since 1997 and started kickboxing in 2002, so I am good in a fight. I think there should be regular fitness tests with goals or incentives for working out. Maybe 1.5 hours of comp time(used like vacation) every week for working out was an idea I tried to float to my old dept. In tx, the state police put a cap on officer size with a 40 inch waist which is an interesting idea. As for the fitness test, I hate that departments and academies put so much stock in running and as you age, obviously the fitness test becomes more difficult so it should take that into account. There is a local police chief that is around 350 and it is embarrassing.

 

[nhbbear]

It's not really a matter of simple disagreement when the policy you want to keep has ruined and keeps ruining countless lives while simultaneously wasting taxpayer money.

Are drugs even decriminalised in Washington? They seem to be going back and forth on that issue, but feel free to post some stats.

sorry, I meant Oregon. And the counter ti that argument is that drugs have ruined lives and families. People choose to use drugs and choose to break the law so in my opinion, the laws are not to blame, people choosing consciously to violate the law is what ruined their lives by selling drugs or using drugs and breaking other laws. I am in favor of treatment for addicts over incarceration. If you decriminalized all drugs, you would still have massive amounts of violence because now there is no pressure on dealers to stop and there is money to be made so they defend their turf with violence and create criminal gangs to go into the drug business. It would be worse if it were decriminalized.

And this is off topic. There are plenty of threads on this topic if you want to continue there

 

[My Spot]

Departments everywhere are feeling the squeeze, but definitely more so in big cities. Particularly those run by democrats. If you’re qualified why would you work for a shitty big city when you can make 6 figures in the suburbs? Only makes sense and the current climate isn’t helping.

Local PD here starts out at $40k. Atlanta PD starts out at $48,500 but I doubt the added stress is worth the money.

 

[rearnakedchoke]

Based on uvalde, seems lowering standards may actually be beneficial.