- Joined
- Jun 7, 2012
- Messages
- 10,949
- Reaction score
- 1,331
Previous Thread
Current big news:
Mod note from previous thread: Please post in here with regards to the subject at hand. Any general chat can go in the WR Lounge thread.
Just to be clear, going forward, these type of posts also count of derailing:
1. Talking about how the thread is derailed/ how mods should handle a situation (report and continue on topic discussions)
2. Joking about posters who are reply banned from the thread
3. Posts with only flaming that do not have any other information about the topic
4. A reply to any of the above
Stop doing these. This isn't some game of getting each other reply bans and infractions. Just stay on topic, report when needed. We have the WR OT for posts like the ones above but they have no place in a normal thread.
Major events so far:
Current big news:
- BuzzFeed has reported that Trump personally directed Michael Cohen to lie to Congress about a construction deal in Moscow. They cite two unnamed federal officials and underlying documents and texts.
- Democrats have called on Trump to resign or face impeachment.
- Two days earlier, Bill Barr, the AG nominee, said that lying to Congress or asking someone to lie to Congress could be obstruction of justice and an impeachable offense.
- Cohen has separately alleged that Trump instructed him to hire people to rig polls in 2013 and 2014.
- OSC has filed more than 200 pages detailing the ways in which Paul Manafort violated his plea agreement.
Just to be clear, going forward, these type of posts also count of derailing:
1. Talking about how the thread is derailed/ how mods should handle a situation (report and continue on topic discussions)
2. Joking about posters who are reply banned from the thread
3. Posts with only flaming that do not have any other information about the topic
4. A reply to any of the above
Stop doing these. This isn't some game of getting each other reply bans and infractions. Just stay on topic, report when needed. We have the WR OT for posts like the ones above but they have no place in a normal thread.
Major events so far:
- Manafort, Trump's campaign manager and transition committee member has been indicted arising from misconduct reaching into 2017 related to payments received through 2014 from the pro-russia faction of Ukraine's pre-war government. Manafort pleaded guilty agreed to cooperate with federal prosecutors, and then lied to them.
- Michael Cohen, Trump's attorney, has pleaded guilty to campaign finance violations, which he claims to have committed at Trump's direction to influence the election. Cohen cooperated with federal prosecutors and received a 3-year sentence.
- Allen Weisselberg, the Trump Org. CFO, has agreed to immunity in exchange for cooperating with federal prosecutors
- Rick Gates has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI and conspiring (with Manafort) to commiting tax fraud, failing to register as a foreign agent, and lying to the FBI
- George Papadopolous pleaded guilty to lying to federal investigators in 2017 about activities occuring 2016-17. Admits to meeting with various Russian officials regarding setting up meetings and "dirt" on Hillary while acting on behalf of the Trump campaign, something he previously denied. Papadopoulos is now accusing Mifsud of being a deep state plant on Twitter.
- Mike Flynn, Trump's National Security Advisor, has also pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about several meetings that he had with the Russian ambassador. Flynn was allegedly involved in other business involving Turkey, but has not yet been charged with respect to that behavior.
- 13 Russian indictment for activity starting in 2014 and continuing through 2017. A US citizen pleaded guilty for agreeing to help them. There is also a separate 12 count indictment targeting GRU officers
- An attorney linked to Manafort, Gates, and a Russian oligarch has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI
- Yohai, Manafort's former son-in-law has agreed to cooperate with the Justice Department
- Daniels's lawsuit has somehow, insanely, gotten linked up to the Mueller investigation thanks to alleged wrongdoing and influence-peddling by Michael Cohen. Who has pleaded guilty and offered to fully cooperate.
- Twelve Russian intelligence officers have been indicted for conspiracy against the United States and aggravated identity theft
- Bruce Ohr, of dossier fame, has been working to obtain information from Russian oligarchs since 2014.
- Documents relating to Manafort's guilty plea implicate Tony Podesta. Tony Podesta is the brother of Clinton's campaign advisor, John Podesta. His former firm, which is now cooperating with the probe, worked for Manafort in Ukraine.
Collusion isn't a crime!
No. Conspiracy to do crimes is.
Where's the evidence?
There's been plenty in the links and throughout the threads, and appears to be a ton more under seal. If you've missed the evidence it's because you haven't looked.
That wasn't a criminal campaign finance violation because Edwards!
The sticking point was willfullness. That's satisfied in Trump's case.
Fruit of the poisonious tree!
That excludes evidence obtained during an illegal search. You need to identify that search. It also doesn't vacate guilty pleas.
Comey told Flynn not to bring a lawyer!
Nope. He said he could, but other lawyers would also be involved. That's ok. Also, not letting someone have a lawyer comes under the fifth amendment and requires other circumstances not applicable here.
They already had what they needed! The like wasn't material! Perjury trap!
Materiality turns on whether something is important to the investigation. X can be a material fact even if there's already evidence on that specific issue, because lying about x keeps the investigator to getting to underlying facts. In Flynn's case, lying about whether he had certain contacts meant investigators couldn't get to the underlying nature of the contacts.
The 304 has the wrong date!
That's an actual nothingburger
Phones deleted!
Yeah, after having their data reviewed by a federal agent.
No. Conspiracy to do crimes is.
Where's the evidence?
There's been plenty in the links and throughout the threads, and appears to be a ton more under seal. If you've missed the evidence it's because you haven't looked.
That wasn't a criminal campaign finance violation because Edwards!
The sticking point was willfullness. That's satisfied in Trump's case.
Fruit of the poisonious tree!
That excludes evidence obtained during an illegal search. You need to identify that search. It also doesn't vacate guilty pleas.
Comey told Flynn not to bring a lawyer!
Nope. He said he could, but other lawyers would also be involved. That's ok. Also, not letting someone have a lawyer comes under the fifth amendment and requires other circumstances not applicable here.
They already had what they needed! The like wasn't material! Perjury trap!
Materiality turns on whether something is important to the investigation. X can be a material fact even if there's already evidence on that specific issue, because lying about x keeps the investigator to getting to underlying facts. In Flynn's case, lying about whether he had certain contacts meant investigators couldn't get to the underlying nature of the contacts.
The 304 has the wrong date!
That's an actual nothingburger
Phones deleted!
Yeah, after having their data reviewed by a federal agent.
Last edited:
