People learning useless BJJ submissions?

[Balto]

Unless threadstarter edited, he said gogoplata, not omoplata. None the less, I think the gogo is a solid submission.

He did edit it.

Originally he had listed as useless subs the gogoplata and the omoplata. He later changed that to the gogoplata and the twister.

 

[Stranger Come Knocking]

I think TS is saying that people should perfect their basic technique before practicing more advanced techniques.

Kinda like that kid who tries to practice all these crazy basketball moves when he cant even hit a freethrow. Shit like that.

 

[Smw]

I agree to a point with the TS. He isn't saying that adding more subs is useless, he is saying that you shouldn't be practicing your gogo if your RNC is horrible.

Learn to the high percentage subs, then move onto the lower percentage ones.

 

[Kakkarot]

great thread

 

[TheHighlander]

The basics that you should spend time on are the positions and transfers of position. The submissions should ALL be secondary.

The submissions you should focus on should be the ones that fit your game the best (including any typical break-downs of your game).

Above all, do what you enjoy. I feel sorry for anybody that isn't doing bjj because they enjoy it.

 

[Excelsior]

There's no such thing as a "useless" sub, any more than there is a "useless" punch. The more weapons in your aresenal the more likely you are to pull off the win. Semper Paratus.

 

[_Glorfindel_]

If you're training for MMA, you will not spend a lots of time on 'fancy' moves. There's 2 importants things when training mma. 1- there is no-gi and 2- you can get hit in the face.

So lets say bjj have 100 differents subs, with no-gi you've just cut about in half and if you add strikes (knee, fist) on the ground then you can almost cut in 2 again.

So 'effective' sub in a mma fight, are not the same as pure bjj or no-gi grappling, but i think you should cover some of them 'cause, like someone else said, you have to see it comming.

 

[350 lbs fist]

I think one of the biggest advantages good grapplers have over lesser ones are the extensive arsenal of subs at their disposal keeping the lesser guy wary at all times and thereby defensive.
That's what I feel when rolling with people much better than me. They pacify me with sheer sub possibility.

 

[Drew Foster]

All submissions are perfect. The problem is the person doing it, not the move.

 

[Tucker Smith]

Unless threadstarter edited, he said gogoplata, not omoplata. None the less, I think the gogo is a solid submission.

True. I've gogo'd a few people in mma training(not in an actual sanctioned bout, but still) its a good submission, although difficult to pull off. omoplatas are also very good.

 

[anaconda]

I agree 100% with the OP. I mean, the other day our instructor was teaching us a collar choke from the back. Who the f*** wears a gi in the street? Seriously!

 

[Prokofievian]

Just a point here. I'm not very good at BJJ by any stretch of the imagination; however, tonight we were working butterfly guard. I used an omoplata to sweep my opponent, took the back, and won the roll. So, if a chump like me can do something like that, just based on creativity and a "fuck, why not" additude, the inherent nature of these techniques must be "effective."

 

[Knots619]

master the basics before you even look at the high techniqual subs.

all the same after a few months of training in my club my membership was up and i was in school so i decided to buy stephen kestlings kneebar dvd, and digest that. i think focusing on one aspect of bjj and working on that until its second nature has great benifits.

 

[Doop]

its important to understand every move because it might not be yours but it might be your opponents

 

[El Ninja]

Because not everybody who trains BJJ does it for MMA purposes.

 

[Nickynoneck]

Because not everybody who trains BJJ does it for MMA purposes.

end of thread

 

[srphm]

The only thing that prevents BJJ/etc from being the SAME thing over is people taking chances with low percentage moves. If everyone did the same thing, with the same counters, it wouldn't be what it is. Practicing a various amount of submissions and other moves is what keeps your opponent thinking, have to get them out of their comfort zone some how.

 

[Hit-or-be-hit]

I've seen so many people always working on a gogoplata, twister or some really useless submission. Most MMA fights end with armbar, RNC, leg lock or kimura if it's going to be finished by submission. So why not learn these techniques perfectly instead of adding submissions you probably won't ever use. The only reason I'm pissed at this, is because the same people have crappy technique in as basic armbar, RNC, etc., and always brag about how their next fight is going to end with a gogoplata.

na i know a guy whos go 2 move is a gogoplata.
And he gets it at he pleases he can get it from the back he wants.
And it works.
then another person i train w go 2 move is an omoplata and his works really good 2

 

[Gsoares2***]

Yeah the twister is useless in mma


Gogoplatta finishes top guys as well - Gomi vs Diaz perfect example.. If its good enough to beat Gomi, its good enough for me. Funny thing is i dont even use the submission.. but thats doesnt mean its no good..

Sounds like your new to the sport of bjj - and your reiterating what your coach yells at all the white belts about not getting into the fancy crap. Fancy stuff is fine if you have a solid base in the sport.. youll understand one day.. when your older.. :icon_chee

Omo platta can also be used as positional control, or sweep.. IE Tank abbot, vs Frank Mir... Mir omoplatta'd to Toe hold.. and won.

People do the weird stuff simply because its Fun... and there is nothing wrong with that... if this sport wasnt fun.. i wouldnt do it.

 

[yodaman]

This isn't a sharpshooter or some other pro wrestling garbage. Any move, when you have things like logistics and physics on your side, will work if trained enough. Look at Brad Imes, Nick Diaz, Aoki, etc. Look at Mayhem's one fight in the WEC. He was owning his opponent from Twister Side Control.

It's all a matter of training the move. That said, basics should be mastered first, which might have been what you meant or what you were getting at. That I agree with. Reading Eddie Bravo or watching the Bas Rutten DVD's of combat with zero BJJ experience is close to trying to get Larry the Cable Guy to read Latin. But look at it a few months later. Stuff falls into place.