Passing reverse De La Riva guard

EndlessCritic said:
read it as this for some reason.
Click to expand...

2169.jpg
 
sha said:
You definitely need both. But as things stand, specifics taught without concepts are still a lot more frequent than concepts taught without specifics. So I feel like most BJJ teachers could probably stand to focus a little more on concepts to restore the balance.
Click to expand...

100% agreed. We're incredibly fortunate at our gym to have seven different black belt instructors (myself included), all of whom have different approaches. There's quite a lot of concepts taught in addition to the technical aspects.
 
Uchi Mata said:
I agree with this completely. People also need to spend more time analyzing their own games and choosing what to include and exclude, especially as they get close to purple belt. Mat time is a precious commodity, open drilling time even more so, so you need to choose carefully what you want to drill because that becomes your game. I spent blue belt learning pretty much every position, and now I've spent purple belt whittling those positions down to my A game but it's very coherent and fits together well. There are no major and few minor positions or techniques that I don't have a rehearsed, specific answer for. Having that allows you to be faster because it shortens your reaction time when you know what you want to do in every position, and that sort of speed is worth its weight in gold. You can essentially 'outrun' the other guy becuase you're recognizing the position and reacting faster.
Click to expand...

great posts in this thread.
 
Uchi Mata said:
You can think of it in terms of gates if you like. The first gate to passing guard is dealing with any facet of the guard that prevents you as the passer from controlling distance, and then establishing the distance you want. That can be a spider hook, a DLR hook, a RDLR hook, a foot on your hip, a butterfly hook, whatever. If you allow the guarder to determine the distance at which you engage, you'll probably get swept.

The second gate is gripping/positioning. Once you've taken over controlling the distance, a good guard player will be fighting grips and positioning (e.g. trying for an underhook) to re-establish distance or go directly for the sweep. You need to establish grips that allow you to work a pass without serious risk of getting reversed.
Click to expand...

Why do you put the first and second gates in that order? In the first pass shown in the instructional, isn't he taking grips and then dealing with the RDLR hook, rather than the other way around? Or do you feel that to start the first pass shown, one must have already obtained some control over distance so that the first pass will in practice start only after going through some previous gate, like peeling the left foot off the hip?
 
ben35 said:
Why do you put the first and second gates in that order? In the first pass shown in the instructional, isn't he taking grips and then dealing with the RDLR hook, rather than the other way around? Or do you feel that to start the first pass shown, one must have already obtained some control over distance so that the first pass will in practice start only after going through some previous gate, like peeling the left foot off the hip?
Click to expand...

I'd put the gates in the same order. That RDLR hook isn't a distance hook at all. It's more of a pulling hook, whereas the foot on the hip is the distance hook. So, for the first pass, like you said, he would have already stripped the distance hook before getting his grips.

You can't get into, move forward, and pressure the person's guard until you've stopped their distance control.
 
virtuoso said:
I'd put the gates in the same order. That RDLR hook isn't a distance hook at all. It's more of a pulling hook, whereas the foot on the hip is the distance hook. So, for the first pass, like you said, he would have already stripped the distance hook before getting his grips.

You can't get into, move forward, and pressure the person's guard until you've stopped their distance control.
Click to expand...

Every guard is different, but there are layers of distance control, gripping, etc. The RDLR hook does have a distance control function, but it's more of a wall than an active mover like the DLR hook. The RDLR hook just keeps the passer from getting a knee all the way to the ground the knee cut passing. You can't really use it all that effectively to actively manage the distance.

Don't read too much into the 'gates' metaphor. It's a metaphor, it will apply more to some guards than others and all the steps are interrelated (e.g. you can't strip a distance controlling hook without first getting some sort of grips). But in general, first you have to kill distance control, then you run into a lot of grip fighting and you have to win that battle, once you've got your grips and are controlling distance you can clear the legs by whatever means you prefer, and then you have to settle the position and avoid recomposition attempts by the guard player.
 
Last edited:
goatfury said:
I've really enjoyed the dialog so far as well.
Click to expand...

Ok, I've got something else I'd like your thoughts on. When guard player underhooks your trapped leg, you show a transition to half guard. What is it that makes transitioning to halfguard more viable from that position than it would be if you directly tried to transition to halfguard before they underhook, just going to kneeling from standing in RDLR? I am guessing that the reason is that once they underhook your trapped leg, this takes away a lot of their options. They can't underhook your free leg and spin under, they can't switch to a knee shield or try to back take; all of those bad things are things that have happened to me when trying to force a halfguard from RDLR. Plus, they can't block a crossface. So, am I correctly understanding why the underhook makes it more viable to force halfguard?
 
ben35 said:
Ok, I've got something else I'd like your thoughts on. When guard player underhooks your trapped leg, you show a transition to half guard. What is it that makes transitioning to halfguard more viable from that position than it would be if you directly tried to transition to halfguard before they underhook, just going to kneeling from standing in RDLR? I am guessing that the reason is that once they underhook your trapped leg, this takes away a lot of their options. They can't underhook your free leg and spin under, they can't switch to a knee shield or try to back take; all of those bad things are things that have happened to me when trying to force a halfguard from RDLR. Plus, they can't block a crossface. So, am I correctly understanding why the underhook makes it more viable to force halfguard?
Click to expand...

I look at it like this: they're locking themselves into the position at that point, essentially making it impossible for you to move your leg backward, but very easy to move your leg forward. I think your thought process isn't incorrect here at all, but subtly different from mine. Hope that helps!
 
I took a look and it seems like every video the guard player has his left foot on the floor. That is improper technique regarding the Reverse Del La Riva.. That foot should be pointed toes-in on the hip to control distance (or at minimal a knee shield if you loose the footing). Watch where Bruno puts his left foot in the beginning of the video. Without it, you have no control of your opponents hips or distance. I don't mean to rude or judgmental, just trying to help!

https://youtu.be/L6Mtijo70Pc
 
jasonbass said:
I took a look and it seems like every video the guard player has his left foot on the floor. That is improper technique regarding the Reverse Del La Riva.. That foot should be pointed toes-in on the hip to control distance (or at minimal a knee shield if you loose the footing). Watch where Bruno puts his left foot in the beginning of the video. Without it, you have no control of your opponents hips or distance. I don't mean to rude or judgmental, just trying to help!

https://youtu.be/L6Mtijo70Pc
Click to expand...

You are correct. That's why the early emphasis on blocking the hip.
 
Andrew, can you do an instructional called "toe holding the fuck out of the guy playing RDLR" ? Thanks.
 
I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't find RDLR that hard to pass. I'd much rather deal with RDLR than spider or DLR any day. I feel like if you can combo a knee slice, opposite side smash, and high long step pass together well RDLR shouldn't be a guard you fear all that much. Maybe I just don't roll against enough people who are really good at it.
 
Uchi Mata said:
I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't find RDLR that hard to pass. I'd much rather deal with RDLR than spider or DLR any day. I feel like if you can combo a knee slice, opposite side smash, and high long step pass together well RDLR shouldn't be a guard you fear all that much. Maybe I just don't roll against enough people who are really good at it.
Click to expand...

Yeah, definitely depends on the player, how well they're adjusting, etc. Of course, it's almost a moot point, because really good guard players will transition to another type of guard before you finish making your move, but I also enjoy passing RDLR nowadays (never used to, though!).
 
goatfury said:
Yeah, definitely depends on the player, how well they're adjusting, etc. Of course, it's almost a moot point, because really good guard players will transition to another type of guard before you finish making your move, but I also enjoy passing RDLR nowadays (never used to, though!).
Click to expand...

It's funny, because while I say I like passing RDLR, it's gotten harder lately at my school. I got really into the Mendes style RDLR (which I think is the most systematic and effective way to play the position that I've seen), and I started teaching it, and now people are getting much, much better at using RDLR to maintain distance which is really the key of making it effective. It is quite hard against a good player to prevent the re-guard, avoid or strip the cross lapel grip, and avoid or strip the foot coming to the hip all at the same time, and any one of those will make it hard to pass. I use RDLR mostly to get back to DLR, and I find it's very hard for anyone I roll with regularly up to and including black belts to stop that transition if I'm able to establish Mendes style grips. If you play it as a defensive/transition guard rather than trying to hang out there and attack it's much harder for the top guy to prevent you from getting back to a full open guard. It's probably the best defensive half guard position out there, though Z comes close.
 
I play RDLR a lot with foot on hip to control distance. Gotta watch for the Estima lock. That is RDLR kryptonite.
 
yovan said:
I play RDLR a lot with foot on hip to control distance. Gotta watch for the Estima lock. That is RDLR kryptonite.
Click to expand...

I love catching that for the first time on almost everyone.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,236,987
Messages
55,459,564
Members
174,787
Latest member
Freddie556

Share this page

Back
Top