Passing full guard?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Greero, Jun 16, 2008.

  1. Greero

    Greero White Belt

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    Okay, I used search so please don't flame me. Today in class I was rolling with this guy wanted to keep me in his guard the whole time. I tried every pass i knew on this guy and just couldn't get out.

    I tried my elbows in his thy, I tried under hooking him, I tried rolling back and going for and ankle lock.

    So basically, what works best for you?
     
  2. whipyourasstyle

    whipyourasstyle Exitus acta probat

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    When a guy is intent in keeping a closed and locked guard, it is very difficult to open it.

    There are several "baiting" things you can try but generally they are not the best ideas unless your a bit more advanced.

    Just remember for him to attack you in any way he is going to have to open the guard. Your best bet is to work your passes and be patient, he'll open and move for a sweep or attack eventually.
     
  3. Ohnani

    Ohnani White Belt

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    I'm only a beginner myself, but one that seems to work for me is to dig the elbows in the thighs and eventually, my partner will open one of the legs. At this point, I pin his thigh down with my knee, and try to go into side control from there.
     
  4. Lopes

    Lopes The Ayatollah of Rock and Rollah

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    Stand up and pass, elbows in the thighs is a waste of time.
     
  5. Greero

    Greero White Belt

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    Thanks, I guess I was just getting frustrated and rushing my passes.
     
  6. FLMikeATT

    FLMikeATT Purple Belt

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    If you have proper posture and hand position, you should have no problem breaking open a guys guard no matter how strong his legs are. Breaking the guard isn't really the hard part, passing the guys open guard is usually where the difficult battle lies.

    Some high percentage guard breaks:

    1. Stack him up so you can get the knee in his butt (keeping control of his arms so he can't sweep you), then go to combat base. From there his guard is already pretty much open.

    2. Get a grip on his pants near the legs with both hands and push him away from you.

    3. Get a double lapel grip with one hand, and with your other push the knee down to the ground. Make sure your leg is stretched back on the side you push his knee down.

    4. Grab a sleeve (or hand for no gi) and stand up. If his guard doesn't break from that, with your opposite hand push down his knee while 'shrugging' your body.

    5. Trap a hand behind his back, and push down the same side knee. He won't be able to prevent his guard from being broken. The key here is to get the hand behind his back. Once you've got that, passing his guard is real easy.

    6. Can opener. I don't really go for this because it can leave you open for an armbar and some people have strong necks and won't even be bothered by it. Usually a waste of time, so use it only if everything else fails.
     
  7. Chinaboxer

    Chinaboxer Blue Belt

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    it's all in the details. ask your instructor and he will show you all the fine details to make the pass work. otherwise, you're probably making so many mistakes, that you "feel" that it's not working.

    here's a basic double under pass that i use alot.

    1. make sure you sit back on your heels and posture. put both hands on his belt or pants. If you're leaning even slightly forward, he will pull you in or sweep you.

    2. without letting go of your grips, create space and break his guard by placing your elbows against the inside of his thighs, at the same time, push your spine back (think of the shape of a hooded cobra). Do not lean forward or he will pull you in or sweep you!

    3. quickly, get BOTH underhooks around the legs, and establish a palm to palm grip, then suck him into you taking away the space. Make sure that the leg you are going to pass is high on your shoulder. Do not continue to lift him upwards with your grip! you have to keep the pressure down towards the ground.

    4. sprawl both legs out putting pressure on him. Do not let go of your grip!

    5. with thumb in, grab his lapel and use the other hand to "feed" the collar until it is very high and tight. Do not pull the free arm out or else you will get triangled! maintain both grips.

    6. while maintaining the high lapel grip, jam your forearm into his neck. while still maintaining the sprawl, begin slowly "edging" your way around the leg that should still be high on your shoulder. Maintain your shoulder pressure against that leg!

    7. now prop your back leg up against the small of his back, and with that foot, begin walking it up from your heel then to your ball of your foot, continue this "creeping" from heel to ball of foot as if you are jacking up a car. Make sure to maintain the shoulder pressure on his leg and forearm pressure on his neck on the side you are passing.

    8. if you have done this correctly, he should be stacked and very uncomfortable. He will beg you at this point to pass! Without letting your shoulder pressure off, continue to pass until you have proper side control.

    9. Do not let go of the high collar grip and the pressure of your forearm against his neck, since you can transition right from side control into full mount and right into a collar choke from there.

    There are many other options along the way, of course. Have fun with it and keep asking your instructor questions.
     
  8. danielr

    danielr Yellow Belt

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    One move that I use a lot to break open someone's guard is something like this:

    1. I fix my posture and base to avoid being submitted or swept.
    2. I'll grab my opponent near their belt or on their thighs, keeping my elbows tucked in, and pushing towards them firmly.
    3. I put one of my knees right between their butt, trying to touch their tailbone.
    4. Turn my hips 90 degrees.


    If that isn't working, I stand up.
     
  9. Sanni Wehbe

    Sanni Wehbe Amateur Fighter

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    Sometimes the best thing to is bait your opponent and then when you know what submissions is coming, counter it and use it to pass.
    i.e Underhook legs for Triangles
     
  10. danielr

    danielr Yellow Belt

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    That works pretty good until you face someone who has a better triangle than your triangle escape, or a better armbar than your armbar escape.
     
  11. TJS

    TJS Brown Belt

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    I get very annoyed with people who wont open their guard. There is nothing wrong with a nice tight closed guard to set up sweeps and submissions..but the people that just lock you down into the jaws of life and do nothing but hold you drive me nuts.
     
  12. Sanni Wehbe

    Sanni Wehbe Amateur Fighter

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    Thats very true. But sometimes people are so stubborn from the guard and never try to open it for submissions unless they feel hundred percent sure. Kinda like giving them a false sense of security.
     
  13. krait

    krait Purple Belt

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    I follow this method for people hell bent on keeping the guard closed. Why waste the energy forcing something. Let him get tired and pass on a sweep or sub attempt. I train with a couple of farm boys that grew up riding horses. I have never been able to break their guards.
     
  14. idahofireman

    idahofireman Banned Banned

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    I agree with the elbows in the thighs. It's a weak move. Saulo ribeiro has some good guard passes check them out on youtube
     
  15. BlastBeats

    BlastBeats Cogito Ergo Dubito

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    These both work great in gi and no gi and I'd be pretty suprised if you didn't get him with one or the other. The 2nd one might be hard if you're rolling with someone much stronger than you and won't let you trap his hand behind him.

    Also, if he keeps just holding you in guard and never opening every session then I would have a talk with him and tell him that neither of you are learning anything from that. I was the same way when I first started and didn't really advance with my guard until I started opening up. Everyone would pass my guard with ease at first but I eventually got it down and only the more experienced dudes could get passed and not as easily.
     
  16. jiujitzurero

    jiujitzurero White Belt

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    Question: This is actually one of my favorite guard breakers since I hit it a high percentage of the time. However on rare occasions I run across guys with shorter legs, or their guard is simply tight than I and can't seem to reach me knee through his butt crack. Would anyone shed some light into this? Much appreciated. Thanks
     
  17. Chinaboxer

    Chinaboxer Blue Belt

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    if you posture and get one knee up but he prevents you from squeezing in, then wrap both arms tightly around his legs and sprawl hard. without letting go of his legs, grip the gi pants of the side you want to pass while maintaining the sprawl. Slowly hop both feet around while holding his gi pants and pass to the side.
     
  18. saywhuuh

    saywhuuh Brown Belt

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    professor? jk...this is one that they teach at my school too. very good explanation too.
     
  19. Calibur

    Calibur Jiu Jitsu Snob

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    You gotta think about your opponents level also. If the guy is experienced you may be doing everything right, but he is doing things to stop you that you dont recognize such as..

    controlling your collar
    rocking you with his legs
    controlling your sleeves
    moving your arms to the inside
    butterflying your elbows
    attacking your leg to disrupt your base


    All while keeping his legs closed. If you are new you might not realize all the little things your opponent is doing to keep you from opening his guard. Nothing that time wont fix. Learn one good guard pass from your teacher and learn how to do it on people your level and size (or better yet, weaker).a Than start trying it on better guys.

    Everyone treats opening guard like some kind of simple task. It's not. There is no trick to it. you just have to learn how to do it, and how to get past your opponents reaction to your opponents attempt to keep the guard closed. Putting your elbows into your opponents wont help, and neither will lifting weights. Only time and good instruction will help. I hope you have both.
     
  20. juiclaw

    juiclaw Yellow Belt

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    2 words mario sperry find atape of the way he opens the closed guard using the belt waork really well when they are doing every thing they can to not open it
     

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