Paramilitaries stage 'coup' in Donetsk, Ukraine.

[Tseren**]

Yes.

They must alternate between those and Adidas tracksuits. An Adidas tracksuit embargo was the main reason Putin was petrified of German sanctions. The mullet law, modelled on Kim Jong-Un's haircut rule, is due to be enacted next month.

Why don't you just come out and say it- you're Russophobic.

 

[Kirku]

Why don't you just come out and say it- you're Russophobic.

 

[Quipling]

Some Ukrainian army regimens are suspected to supply the patriots in the East with battle supplies because they disapprove of the government in Kiev... you know... because it's so popular.

Ah. That must be where these "patriots" are obtaining the chechnyans. Ukrainian "battle supplies."

 

[GhostZ06]

A Ukrainian helicopter Mi-24 gunship fires decoy flares over a residential area moments after attacking Donetsk international airport May 26, 2014. Three Ukrainian helicopter gunships mounted a heavy attack on the rebel-held international airport terminal at Donetsk on Monday, firing rockets and cannon and throwing out decoy flares as militants shot at them from the ground. (*******/Yannis Behrakis)

 

[tkotom]

From what i have seen, the Ukrainian side are just some young soldiers fighting for what they believe in or just following orders.

The "Russian" side, are very hardcore, filled with guys from all the dark corners of Russian Federation, cossacks, chechens, gopniks, all kinds of mercenaries... + some professional soldiers, and very, very few locals, so yeah not a nice bunch.

I really feel for the Ukrainian side.

Sounds horrible.

 

[Scrody]

Great. Ukraine is in a tailspin.

 

[AA4142CA]

The men identified themselves as members of the Vostok Battalion, a pro-Russia militia group. Vostok Battalion, a unit of Russia's military intelligence (GRU), is based in Chechnya.

Nobody knows what happened there, at least not yet.

As for Vostok battalion the one reporters have mentioned is complete mess up.

Vostok battalion (translation- East) has nothing to do with the one that has been based in Chechnya under GRU control because it doesn't exist. First of all Vostok GRU unit has been dimantled back in 2008 after war in Gerogia. The main reason is murder of their commander Sulim and the death of General Troshev (air crash) who was the main GRU player in Chechnya. It was the only unit that Kadyrov could not control.

The current Vostok in the east of Ukraine bares the same name because of their location (east). The reason of mix up (or prapoganda) because there are small numbers of chechens in that battalion.

 

[Kirku]

Vostok battalion (translation- East) has nothing to do with the one that has been based in Chechnya under GRU control because it doesn't exist.

Sukhov and Galeotti don't agree.

The unit, however, was not truly dissolved.

"It was never really broken up, it was re-profiled and incorporated into a Defense Ministry unit based in Chechnya," says Ivan Sukhov, a Russian journalist and North Caucasus expert.

Despite Russia's claims that it isn't involved in the eastern Ukrainian conflict, the emergence of a Vostok Battalion in Donetsk is not entirely surprising.

"We know there are well-trained North Caucasus units, formed on the basis of their ethnicity, that are ready for combat and have long been in reserve," Sukhov says. "They were used during the war with Georgia in 2008, and those in charge no doubt remember they have this resource at their disposal."

"I think the heart of the unit is made up of veterans of the original battalion," says Mark Galeotti, a New York University professor and expert on Russian security affairs. "But it is clear that the present incarnation also includes non-Chechens and soldiers who did not fight in the earlier force."

 

[AA4142CA]

Sukhov and Galeotti don't agree.

Again, what he writes about is what you call it "Far-fetched". Battalion East has been created by Donbass separatists before chechens entered the scene. Also their patch completely different and bares a slavic symbol. It's obvious that chechen Vostok former fighters have the same military jobs, but how can you track them? So far there was no proof of original Vostok former fighters presence in Ukraine.

I'd say it's good to speculate on that matter because it spices things up. It's the same as if you search through the russian news about killed chechen separatists, you'd find that most of them were Al Qaeda members or at least have the connections. Or for example if any of the national guard soldier is a Right Sector member.

The picture is also horrible from the religious point of view. Slavic christians sending muslims to kill christian slavic brothers.

 

[AA4142CA]

The Kiev propaganda machine got exposed for their bullshit while Kirku was running around here, licking Kievan junta balls like a whore calling me names.

It didn't get exposed. There are chechens who are fighting on the separatists sides. In modern days you have to keep up with propaganda war rules, I know it's dirty, but look around ones more and you'll see that russian propaganda is 100 times worse. Please, don't quote me to send some personal abuse, keep me out of it.

 

[Tseren**]

It didn't get exposed. There are chechens who are fighting on the separatists sides. In modern days you have to keep up with propaganda war rules, I know it's dirty, but look around ones more and you'll see that russian propaganda is 100 times worse. Please, don't quote me to send some personal abuse, keep me out of it.

I wouldn't go that far as to say such a thing but that there is misleading, misrepresentative, and frequently false information from Western journalists is a concession Kirku has been unwilling to make.

 

[AA4142CA]

I wouldn't go that far as to say such a thing but that there is misleading, misrepresentative, and frequently false information from Western journalists is a concession Kirku has been unwilling to make.

Local russian propaganda looks something like this:

1. Find the most dramatic picture on the net (killed child in the arms of mother, destroyed building, wounded civilians, funeral)
2. Sign it under Ukraine's junta, Right Sector
3. Wait for the effect to gel in
4. Done. Enjoy the shit storm.

 

[ZroC]

From Ukraine chopper bombs residential area to Ukraine chopper fires decoy flares.

 

[ZroC]

Local russian propaganda looks something like this:

1. Find the most dramatic picture on the net (killed child in the arms of mother, destroyed building, wounded civilians, funeral)
2. Sign it under Ukraine's junta, Right Sector
3. Wait for the effect to gel in
4. Done. Enjoy the shit storm.

Russian and Chinese propaganda tends to be presented in the most over the top way possible. If they fought a battle they can only inflict 1000 deaths on their enemy with a mere two casualties on their own side, but those casualties limped off and killed 5 more of the enemy each.

 

[Kirku]

From Ukraine chopper bombs residential area to Ukraine chopper fires decoy flares.

That's a photo from the airport assault - not the 'bombing' (not that helicopters carry bombs) of a residential area.

 

[Kirku]

I wouldn't go that far as to say such a thing but that there is misleading, misrepresentative, and frequently false information from Western journalists is a concession Kirku has been unwilling to make.

Sure about that?

 

[Kirku]

The Kiev propaganda machine got exposed for their bullshit while Kirku was running around here, licking Kievan junta balls like a whore calling me names.

1) Calling you what 'names', exactly?
2) This sounds like something straight out of the playground.

Edit: The change of style from ineffectually verbose to 'dudebro' is really quite amusing

 

[Kirku]

Again, what he writes about is what you call it "Far-fetched". Battalion East has been created by Donbass separatists before chechens entered the scene.

If that was the case (and it might well be) then why did the Chechens arrive on trucks emblazoned with 'Vostok Battalion' and openly saying 'Ramzan sent us'?

 

[AA4142CA]

If that was the case (and it might well be) then why did the Chechens arrive on trucks emblazoned with 'Vostok Battalion' and openly saying 'Ramzan sent us'?

It wasn't only chechens who arrived in the trucks with Vostok signings. You could spot cossacs, ossetians, russians and locals. You can also spot that now lots of separatists wearing arm bands with Vostok writing.

As for the guy who says "we are Kadyrovtsy" and then says "it was earlier" probably means he works or he worked for MVD of Chechnya. But Vostok has never been under Kadyrov or MVD command and thats the main reason Vostok has been destroyed and most of their leaders are dead.

You have to draw the line between the two. Original Vostok was created by Sulim as a part of National Guard of Independent Republic of Ichkeria with Maschadov being the president at the time. The name came from the location of the unit Chechnen (East) town Gudermes.

 

[Kirku]

It wasn't only chechens who arrived in the trucks with Vostok signings. You could spot cossacs, ossetians, russians and locals. You can also spot that now lots of separatists wearing arm bands with Vostok writing.

As for the guy who says "we are Kadyrovtsy" and then says "it was earlier" probably means he works or he worked for MVD of Chechnya. But Vostok has never been under Kadyrov or MVD command and thats the main reason Vostok has been destroyed and most of their leaders are dead.

You have to draw the line between the two. Original Vostok was created by Sulim as a part of National Guard of Independent Republic of Ichkeria with Maschadov being the president at the time. The name came from the location of the unit Chechnen (East) town Gudermes.

OK - you certainly know more about it than I do.

Who do you think sent these Ossetians, Cossacks and Chechens? Many have speculated that it shows clear Kremlin involvement - do you agree?