O'Reilly gets owned

[JonnyRingo84]

Really, what Koppel says here could apply to any of the goons on Fox or MSNBC, so I didn't post this to exclusively hate on Bill.



O'Reilly: "Commentators like me have just ruined the country..."

Koppel: "It's true you have."

I think for-profit media has largely killed real journalism. More people need to say this.

 

[Deleted member 457759]

"It's about selling soap"

-Izzy Asper

 

[TheComebackKid]

Really, what Koppel says here could apply to any of the goons on Fox or MSNBC, so I didn't post this to exclusively hate on Bill.



O'Reilly: "Commentators like me have just ruined the country..."

Koppel: "It's true you have."

I think for-profit media has largely killed real journalism. More people need to say this.

Wait...why do you believe real journalism is dead?

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Wait...why do you believe real journalism is dead?

i dont think it is, but i do think its in the minority of political media.

 

[TheComebackKid]

i dont think it is, but i do think its in the minority of political media.

But you just said real journalism has largely been killed. How can something be killed but not be dead? And what is the "minority of political media"?

 

[Gervinho]

real journalism is boring

i dont think it is, but i do think its in the minority of political media.

Most people dont know what real journalism is. Also with 24/7 news channels. Its impossible to fill it with real journalism. Opinion shows are much easier and cheaper to make and they fill the time slots

 

[Blackened]

I agree. Fox has been trash for many years and now we are seeing the leftist media go down the same path (probably in a worse fashion than even fox).

 

[JonnyRingo84]

But you just said real journalism has largely been killed. How can something be killed but not be dead? And what is the "minority of political media"?

of all cable news shows, i think that those that truly attempt to be objective are in the minority. so there are fewer of those than the entertainment and partisan news, but journalism isnt completely absent.

 

[djacobox372]

It's sad that young people these days probably wouldn't even recognize a real journalist if they saw one.

BTW I like how Bill-O admits to all of it at the end. I may not like Bill, he's an a-hole, but I do think he's a honest a-hole.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

real journalism is boring

Most people dont know what real journalism is. Also with 24/7 news channels. Its impossible to fill it with real journalism. Opinion shows are much easier and cheaper to make and they fill the time slots

you're 100% right. difficult to fill that time slot with real investigative reporting, and it would be tough to compete with big brother 23 even if you could.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

It's sad that young people these days probably wouldn't even recognize a real journalist if they saw one.

idk older folks seem to eat it up as much as anyone in my experience.

 

[Letssnuggle]

If real journalism wasn't dead -

Donald Trump wouldn't be the Republican nominee and Hillary Clinton would be in jail.

 

[Fedorable]

But you just said real journalism has largely been killed. How can something be killed but not be dead? And what is the "minority of political media"?

 

[TheComebackKid]

of all cable news shows, i think that those that truly attempt to be objective are in the minority. so there are fewer of those than the entertainment and partisan news, but journalism isnt completely absent.

Oh gotcha. I actually agree with you on that. But weren't you just balking at the idea that the "majority" media is biased? Just the other day you argued against the idea that the media is shaping narratives with their biased agenda. Now you are saying real, objective journalism has largely been killed..which means we have non-objective and biased journalism.

Square this for me please.

 

[JosephDredd]

Real journalism is definitely dying. From old school journalists I've talked to about this, the major turning points were:

1. The Pentagon embedding journalists with troops during the Gulf War. All of a sudden journalists couldn't report objectively and started telling news stories glorifyng the troops keeping them safe. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, except then it led to an atmosphere where the government's actions were no longer scrutinized and questioned like in Vietnam. We might not agree as to whether or not it happened under Obama or Dubya, but I think most of us will agree we reached a crisis point with this.

2. The 24/7 news channel. Stories must be made where there are none and they must be told as entertainment.

3. The internet, the death of print newspapers and the inability to get paid to be a real journalist. In non-traditional news outlets (documentaries, the internet) it can be just as profitable (or more profitable) to tell lies as it is to tell the truth.

4. All media owned by a handful of people.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Oh gotcha. I actually agree with you on that. But weren't you just balking at the idea that the "majority" media is biased? Just the other day you argued against the idea that the media is shaping narratives with their biased agenda. Now you are saying real, objective journalism has largely been killed..which means we have non-objective and biased journalism.

Square this for me please.

right

i was trying to claim that you guys are looking at it backwards imo. i dont think that most networks give a shit so much who wins. what they care about, is that theyre telling their group of consumers, what their group of consumers wants to hear. if fox polling and ratings suggest higher ratings during positive takes on ben carson, then thats what theyll show more of. if msnbc has reason to believe that people want more bernie, theyll get more bernie.

they dont need to shape and pick winners to make money, which has to be their goal.

 

[TheComebackKid]

right

i was trying to claim that you guys are looking at it backwards imo. i dont think that most networks give a shit so much who wins. what they care about, is that theyre telling their group of consumers, what their group of consumers wants to hear. if fox polling and ratings suggest higher ratings during positive takes on ben carson, then thats what theyll show more of. if msnbc has reason to believe that people want more bernie, theyll get more bernie.

they dont need to shape and pick winners to make money, which has to be their goal.

Oh I see. I disagree...completely...but I understand where you're coming from and see that you are not contradicting yourself.

 

[Unknown Pleasures]

Yep, intellectual honesty is dead in TV journalism.

I do believe Mr. Koppel took O'Reilly to task before as well.

" Finally, the novelist must always tell the truth as he understands it while the politician must never give the game away. Those who have done both comprise a very short list indeed. The fact that I was never even a candidate for the list had to do with a choice made at twenty that entirely changed my life. " G. Vidal

Substitute novelist with journalist above.

 

[Thunderflash500]

Real journalism is definitely dying. From old school journalists I've talked to about this, the major turning points were:

3. The internet, the death of print newspapers and the inability to get paid to be a real journalist. In non-traditional news outlets (documentaries, the internet) it can be just as profitable (or more profitable) to tell lies as it is to tell the truth.

4. All media owned by a handful of people.

These two are conflicting. Before the internet information was much more tightly controlled, because like you said, the media is owned by a handful of people. A handful of people decide what the American people see, hear, think. The internet is changing this. People are losing faith in major news media. The internet is bringing back real media. People are allowed to speak freely, and have longer conversations. Also, in mainstream media it's also just as profitable to lie, or simply not tell the truth. Instead of talking about a scandal, just talk about the Kardashians.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Yep, intellectual honesty is dead in TV journalism.

I do believe Mr. Koppel took O'Reilly to task before as well.

" Finally, the novelist must always tell the truth as he understands it while the politician must never give the game away. Those who have done both comprise a very short list indeed. The fact that I was never even a candidate for the list had to do with a choice made at twenty that entirely changed my life. " G. Vidal

Substitute novelist with journalist above.

yea watching fox or msnbc is like watching a constant stream of strawmen. vidal has lots of good quotes.