Social Oh Dear Mr. Gruden-Raiders coach gone.

[Scerpi]

1. Emails sent on a business computer/ phone are not considered private. Even if they were - these emails were leaked, they weren't released as part of the official investigation. Who leaks stuff like this? Usually a disgruntled person or a person who feels a light needs to be shined on bad behavior. This was more likely released by a paralegal of one of the investigating law firms than Roger Goodall. Think Snowden, Manning, the FB lady. This wasn't some convoluted plot to get the Raiders out of a bad contract. Imaging thinking that?
2. I'm pretty sure if you're an owner you can survive just about anything. Donald Sterling was still a billionaire after losing the Clippers.
3. I don't care how many coaches would survive this; hopefully none as they would be exposed as not fit to lead men if they're so ignorant.
4. Too many players already get away with this type of shit, but they aren't usually in leadership positions so that would be more of a business/ PR decision.
5. Gruden caved IMMEDIATELY. No fight. He didn't even try to "survive". Why is that? Maybe he was taking personal responsibility for his actions. Some people actually do that.

Well... Congrates on missing the point completely. Actually, this proves my point. Gruden's email were "leaked" by someone on the inside. What's to stop this from happening if Apple and the Authorities start getting access to everyone's phones messages and photos. Did Gruden send these messages from his business account? I don't know. He wasn't employed with the NFL at the time.

Remember how Kolby's crash photos were leaked? People in positions of power do this shit all the time. Stuff that's supposed to be confidential. I'm sure they get paid for them... at least the possibility is there and once it's on the web, it can never be scrubbed.

It doesn't even have to be illegal content. In fact... Gruden's emails weren't even illegal.... At least, I haven't heard if it was. It's possible. Regardless, these types of leaks have become far too common and always happen.

I mean... Have you forgot the celebrity photos that were leaked a few years ago?

 

[ferrisjso]

Going to ask you a straight and direct question - in all of the years that Gruden has been coaching, and in the light of what has transrpired over the past week - have you heard or can quote a single player, coach, etc who believes Gruden is a racist? Keyshawn has had an axe to grind with Gruden that has been publicly known for more than a decade. He calls him a "fraud", a "used car salesman". Are those the same as calling him racist?

You believe he is. He messed up, there's no denying it. But you have pounded the table in this thread (and others, to which I quoted you and you conveniently ignored), and have yet to show a single black source back your assertions....amongst the THOUSANDS he has worked with over the years. He's a massive idiot, a crude loudmouth and a bad play caller. I don't think you'll have anyone argue otherwise. But go ahead, let's see what else you have on the "racist" evidence aside from one email making fun of the NFLPA president for having big lips. We'll wait.

And this is why Gruden would have survived just that email. He was doomed because there was a shit ton of them and it was not just one email.

While the first one was leaked the rest of them were given to the Raiders by the NFL.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Well... Congrates on missing the point completely. Actually, this proves my point. Gruden's email were "leaked" by someone on the inside. What's to stop this from happening if Apple and the Authorities start getting access to everyone's phones messages and photos. Did Gruden send these messages from his business account? I don't know. He wasn't employed with the NFL at the time.

Remember how Kolby's crash photos were leaked? People in positions of power do this shit all the time. Stuff that's supposed to be confidential. I'm sure they get paid for them... at least the possibility is there and once it's on the web, it can never be scrubbed.

It doesn't even have to be illegal content. In fact... Gruden's emails weren't even illegal.... At least, I haven't heard if it was. It's possible. Regardless, these types of leaks have become far too common and always happen.

I mean... Have you forgot the celebrity photos that were leaked a few years ago?

No, I didn't miss your point as you don't really have one. You're jumping between leaks made by insiders and hackers who obtain information via nefarious means as well as trying to draw parallels between people who possess child pornography and woman who had their phones hacked for nudes. You're all over the place and it comes down to stomping your feet that people have access to private information and betray the trust of the owners of that information. Welcome to the human race.

The Fappening and the Pentagon Papers on not the same thing.

And Gruden was emailing his brother, who worked for Washington, the subject of the investigation that yielded the leaked emails.

 

[ShadowRun]

No, I didn't miss your point as you don't really have one. You're jumping between leaks made by insiders and hackers who obtain information via nefarious means as well as trying to draw parallels between people who possess child pornography and woman who had their phones hacked for nudes. You're all over the place and it comes down to stomping your feet that people have access to private information and betray the trust of the owners of that information. Welcome to the human race.

The Fappening and the Pentagon Papers on not the same thing.

And Gruden was emailing his brother, who worked for Washington, the subject of the investigation that yielded the leaked emails.

Haven’t seen you in WR much hope things are good. Do you see the potential for abuse and weaponizing Apple’s plan? I think there is a fine line for me though because I would like the CIA to have access to Twitter accounts that are talking in code for attacks (many attacks have been foiled by this). Apple didn’t want to unencrypt those shooters in CA’s phone but now a few years later they are all about that

 

[Strychnine]

Going to ask you a straight and direct question - in all of the years that Gruden has been coaching, and in the light of what has transrpired over the past week - have you heard or can quote a single player, coach, etc who believes Gruden is a racist? Keyshawn has had an axe to grind with Gruden that has been publicly known for more than a decade. He calls him a "fraud", a "used car salesman". Are those the same as calling him racist?

You believe he is. He messed up, there's no denying it. But you have pounded the table in this thread (and others, to which I quoted you and you conveniently ignored), and have yet to show a single black source back your assertions....amongst the THOUSANDS he has worked with over the years. He's a massive idiot, a crude loudmouth and a bad play caller. I don't think you'll have anyone argue otherwise. But go ahead, let's see what else you have on the "racist" evidence aside from one email making fun of the NFLPA president for having big lips. We'll wait.

The proof is in the 10 YEARS worth of emails. If you don't think that's racist.

Fine.

The NFL thought otherwise.

This isn't some fratboy post-teen who thought would be funny to blast those emails around at a keg-party. He was a grown-@$$ man and he still took the time, to think it out, type it out, and hit SEND.

Yeah, Billionaires LOVE it when their head coaches (who are supposed to be THE leader) basically think that their team members are "less than" and make it known to the TEAM. Yeah, he's racist and if you don't think so, fine.

We'll agree to disagree.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Haven’t seen you in WR much hope things are good. Do you see the potential for abuse and weaponizing Apple’s plan? I think there is a fine line for me though because I would like the CIA to have access to Twitter accounts that are talking in code for attacks (many attacks have been foiled by this). Apple didn’t want to unencrypt those shooters in CA’s phone but now a few years later they are all about that

yeah, i'm not here that often, but things are well; cheers.

I see a lot of potential for abuse. I think this type of tech demands an extraordinary level of oversight and transparency.
- oversight to make sure its not being abused by Apple or its employees and not open to hacks that could compromise national intelligence.
- transparency so that we know that those identified are getting prosecuted to the full extent of the law and not being protected because of their power/ position/ celebrity and that investigations aren't going beyond its intended scope.

 

[Hatorade]

His emails should be private IMO.

With that said, when you're a head coach in the NFL making millions of dollars, there's a sense of professionalism that goes with that. I'd fire him if I owned the Raiders.

 

[DrDune]

The proof is in the 10 YEARS worth of emails. If you don't think that's racist.

We'll agree to disagree.

10 years worth of racist emails? Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. If so, show them. It is ONE racially insensitive email that made fun of someone’s big lips, in 2011. Where are the others?

We will agree to disagree since you can’t even get the baseline facts correct. Whew.

 

[44nutman]

1. Emails sent on a business computer/ phone are not considered private. Even if they were - these emails were leaked, they weren't released as part of the official investigation. Who leaks stuff like this? Usually a disgruntled person or a person who feels a light needs to be shined on bad behavior. This was more likely released by a paralegal of one of the investigating law firms than Roger Goodall. Think Snowden, Manning, the FB lady. This wasn't some convoluted plot to get the Raiders out of a bad contract. Imaging thinking that?
2. I'm pretty sure if you're an owner you can survive just about anything. Donald Sterling was still a billionaire after losing the Clippers.
3. I don't care how many coaches would survive this; hopefully none as they would be exposed as not fit to lead men if they're so ignorant.
4. Too many players already get away with this type of shit, but they aren't usually in leadership positions so that would be more of a business/ PR decision.
5. Gruden caved IMMEDIATELY. No fight. He didn't even try to "survive". Why is that? Maybe he was taking personal responsibility for his actions. Some people actually do that.

Good list but will add, someone may have gotten paid when they leaked them.
Imagine being a low paying paralegal tasked with going through hundred of thousand of emails. Some of them are probably a Washington Football team executive being asked by his wife to grab some milk on the way home. You see Grudens email and some of them may have been as simple as trying to schedule a tee time with his buddy, but everyone knows Gruden. You come across him getting the topless cheerleader photos, then you see he said some dumb shit and your thinking maybe I can sell this to someone at Grudens expense.
The other version is Washington trying to save their own ass because they know people are going argue back and forth, that is it really racist and statue of limitations on saying offensive shit. This is the perfect rage porn story, cable news uses to sell boner pills. Rubes eat this kind of shit up. We get 4 or 5 days of whataboutisms, perfect story to have a panel of people argue back and forth, all the while it takes some heat off the WFT who are in a world of sexual harassment shit that is going to cost them bigly money. 15 women are part of the suit. You can weather one or two, and turn it to a he said she said, but 15 women shows there was a culture there that tolerated women being harassed and being forced to pose nude for photos.
Last scenario is the lawyer for those 15 women leaked it, to put the screws to the WFT, they will dangle non disclosure for more cash.
Once again Gruden is collateral damage, which is why he resigned. He saw he had no moves and just flipped down his king. I think he resigned to save face for the Raiders.

 

[Whippy McGee]

I like how the NY Times plays this game. They leak out a single bad exchange. They wait for the apology and then slam him with the rest. Why was this done?

Gruden called Biden a "clueless pussy" and is clearly not a Leftists. That meant he had to go and his emails from a decade ago need to come out. Those that oppose the Establishment will pay the price!

Yes... Gruden is a fucking caveman. It's football. It seems some of you have never been in a locker room. My Dad owned the California Generals Semi-Pro team back in the 1990's. The words spoken in those locker rooms... it's a mad house and hilarious. I don't think any of the players had ill will, but they all got racial back and forth and laughed their asses off about it. Then they all went and got drunk together. They were brothers, regardless of race.

 

[mjfan23]

Good choices in poll but F you TS was the most appropriate

 

[Last Falconry]

 

[Strychnine]

10 years worth of racist emails? Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. If so, show them. It is ONE racially insensitive email that made fun of someone’s big lips, in 2011. Where are the others?

We will agree to disagree since you can’t even get the baseline facts correct. Whew.

Ask the NFL for them because they thought it was enough to have him removed.

I don't work for the NFL by the way...

Spoiler

 

[sickc0d3r]

10 years worth of racist emails? Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. If so, show them. It is ONE racially insensitive email that made fun of someone’s big lips, in 2011. Where are the others?

We will agree to disagree since you can’t even get the baseline facts correct. Whew.

It’s been reported there were a lot of emails with that kind of language over a 10 year period. Gruden even resigned because of it. Probably because they totally don’t exist.

 

[DrDune]

It’s been reported there were a lot of emails with that kind of language over a 10 year period. Gruden even resigned because of it. Probably because they totally don’t exist.

Nope. The NFL sent Davis the “extreme” emails for his review last week to see how the Raiders would discipline him. Here’s a quote on them

“aware of five to seven emails that were flagged by the league, including one in which he disparaged NFL commissioner Roger Goodell with a vulgar description, and others that included harsh words for a handful of team owners who were involved in the 2011 labor disagreement that led to a lockout.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.es...ew-actively-monitoring-situation?platform=amp

We have seen the list of emails from the NFL. I even saw a report from verified Twitter account that stated, from the NFL, that they were releasing more emails but only the initial one (Smith) was about race. Of course, we saw the remainder which was the death sentence to his career.

I’ll see if I can find that tweet. I am a Raiders fan and season ticket holder, on multiple Raiders forums. Trust me, if there were more race related emails available or mention of more race related emails, we would have been seeing and talking about them.

 

[DrDune]

Ask the NFL for them because they thought it was enough to have him removed.

I don't work for the NFL by the way...

Spoiler

Well, congrats on the retirement. Listen, I’m certainly not condoning Grudens behavior or language. I’m just not ready to call him a full blown racist without more evidence. Evidence to which has not been seen or referenced by any source to my knowledge.

 

[Strychnine]

Well, congrats on the retirement. Listen, I’m certainly not condoning Grudens behavior or language. I’m just not ready to call him a full blown racist without more evidence. Evidence to which has not been seen or referenced by any source to my knowledge.

Understandable and reasonable. I'm just going by the actions of the team owner and the NFL. I always liked Gruden. I loved calling him Chucky. My first pro game was the Browns Vs. the Oakland Raiders back in the day.

I really don't want to see any more negative emails about his words.

 

[Day Drinking]

That darn Super Bowl he won though.

If you can get hired for something 20 years ago, you can get fired for something 20 years ago

 

[Day Drinking]

Where does it allege he did that? From the links in the OP it just alleges that he used misogynistic, homophobic and racial language

Washington did that, it's what the lawsuit is about. Gruden got sent the photos.

 

[sickc0d3r]

Nope. The NFL sent Davis the “extreme” emails for his review last week to see how the Raiders would discipline him. Here’s a quote on them

“aware of five to seven emails that were flagged by the league, including one in which he disparaged NFL commissioner Roger Goodell with a vulgar description, and others that included harsh words for a handful of team owners who were involved in the 2011 labor disagreement that led to a lockout.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/32383229/sources-nfl-sent-las-vegas-raiders-more-jon-gruden-emails-review-actively-monitoring-situation?platform=amp

We have seen the list of emails from the NFL. I even saw a report from verified Twitter account that stated, from the NFL, that they were releasing more emails but only the initial one (Smith) was about race. Of course, we saw the remainder which was the death sentence to his career.

I’ll see if I can find that tweet. I am a Raiders fan and season ticket holder, on multiple Raiders forums. Trust me, if there were more race related emails available or mention of more race related emails, we would have been seeing and talking about them.

From your post it sounded like you thought only the one email existed, my bad if you were just saying the others didn’t contain racist language. I’m sure we’ll know more at some point, and I’m certainly not taking any Raiders official’s interpretation as gospel, but in any case they were reported to be full of highly inappropriate and offensive shit, and Gruden resigned because of it. Whatever, good riddance.