(NYT)Many Ways to Be a Girl, but One Way to Be a Boy: The New Gender Rules

[mixcontactsport]

Cultural marxism in action. Straight white males are the bad guys and everyone else is a victim.

Straight white males never asked for it, I know because a lot of them seems to be afraid of, or hate cultural diversity, and change. Sorry, I don't blame clueless people... no matter what color.

 

[bushman505]

well I, for one, have nothing against gay jesus, but you are a very forward, and liberal person for someone who's supposedly not. Is this what they call identity politics?

People should be allowed to fuck anybody they want as long as it’s consential. Or kids, nobody should be allowed to fuck kids.

 

[Islam Imamate]

edit:
I think the research/write-up does a bad job looking at the effect that women have on the boy gender norm. They essentially wrote it off as following the behavior of older men. Women can be quite cruel to guys they find weak.

I think that's a great point, ultimately boys are going to react to what girls think of them and which boys they seem to gravitate to and which ones they avoid. That matters more than what they may say or what they see on TV.

I think the last time American men were pushed towards being "stoic" was about the 1960's maybe.

From the looks of it, from observing American TV shows, movies, news, the new stereotype for men seems to be quite the opposite of stoic. Can you think of any American TV personality that portrays themselves as stoic, rather than animated, flamboyant, talkative, temperamental, even emotional? Including the president.

A stoic personality (which is a natural personality for many), in my opinion, is a niche in American society. Certainly not something that American boys are being steered towards. In fact, boys might be being steered away from it because America's modern culture does not exactly embrace the people who remain reserved and who do not emotionally react to situations.

It doesn't really matter what's on TV if ultimately the boys themselves don't get that message. Besides, I think boys will gravitate more towards media that is geared towards them and that media is more likely to have the old norms upheld. Not to mention I think their daily social interactions with their peers will have a greater effect.

People may pay lip service to the idea of bucking the old male gender norms but unless boys see that in enacted in their social environment its not likely to happen and as jrams points out sometimes girls and women can, intentionally or not, be quite vicious in upholding those standards.

I think you shouldnt put too much stock in surveys that use 1,000 people to extrapolate results across 300,000,000 people. Just my opinion though.

Its nationally representative and 1,000 is a rather good sample size.

 

[Seaside]

no, you're wrong. You don't live in America. I'm very open-minded, and tolerant, and I feel like society expects men to look and act a certain way. If you're not what they expect, they think less of you.

the way I see it, we're all getting cucked, some just more than others.

I can point to studies. And evidence and left wing political leaders.

The right is the ones with the hard on for aggrression and outdated concetps of masculinity.

I dont need to live in America to see the evidence on internet, media, and journals and studied done.

But some male Trump supporters literally call him "daddy"... hmmm...

The right is the ones with the hard on for aggrression and outdated concetps of masculinity.

I dont need to live in America to see the evidence on internet, media, and journals and studied done.

They worship power and toxic masculinity. That is not tolerant or progressive let alone what i am talking about.

I think the last time American men were pushed towards being "stoic" was about the 1960's maybe.

From the looks of it, from observing American TV shows, movies, news, the new stereotype for men seems to be quite the opposite of stoic. Can you think of any American TV personality that portrays themselves as stoic, rather than animated, flamboyant, talkative, temperamental, even emotional? Including the president.

A stoic personality (which is a natural personality for many), in my opinion, is a niche in American society. Certainly not something that American boys are being steered towards. In fact, boys might be being steered away from it because America's modern culture does not exactly embrace the people who remain reserved and who do not emotionally react to situations.

Russians are stoic. Slavs often are.

American media is not

 

[ShadowRun]

NYT is sexist and this confirms it

 

[Cirris]

What??? You going to sit here and say you don’t like watching circle jerks???

I'll only watch if there's a cute busty Japanese girl in the middle getting drenched moaning "Kimoo Chiii"

 

[trac209]

In a new poll, girls say they feel empowered, except when it comes to being judged on how they look. Boys still feel they have to be strong, athletic and stoic.



What do you guys think? Is this shift in gender norms a promising or discouraging sign for this generation of young people? Is the resiliency of traditional norms for boys to be stoic and strong and the importance of girls' looks good or bad? Do you think the long term effect of #metoo will be positive or negative for this generation?

EDIT: Forgot to include this interesting bit from the article


I think this part in particular is a very bad sign. The US already has declining birth rates and I think its important for children to grow up with the idea that marriage and parenthood are important milestones even if the exact manifestation of those milestones doesn't necessarily conform to traditional expectations.

All my other thoughts on the way society is heading on this topic aside declining birth rates as far as the population goes would be the last worry on this list.

 

[Islam Imamate]

All my other thoughts on the way society is heading on this topic aside declining birth rates as far as the population goes would be the last worry on this list.

I don't quite get what you mean, are you saying declining birth rates are the last worry on your list or that everything else addressed in the article is?

 

[trac209]

I don't quite get what you mean, are you saying declining birth rates are the last worry on your list or that everything else addressed in the article is?

What I mean is any low birth rates as a result of this topic. The world for sure isn’t running out of people in 2018.

 

[Islam Imamate]

What I mean is any low birth rates as a result of this topic. The world for sure isn’t running out of people in 2018.

But declining birth rates are terrible for the modern, developed economy. An ageing population is destined for economic stagnation.

Remember you asked me in the other thread if I think countries should be able to ban Muslim immigration? Well, developed countries wouldn't need large scale immigration, Muslim or otherwise, if their birth rates were above replacement levels.

 

[Unknown Pleasures]

Women can be anything they want. Problem is, as Chris Rock would say, nothing dries a pussy up faster than a woman opening her wallet for a man.

It's gonna take a long time for women to accept being breadwinners in a relationship and potentially supporting men. Men generally can tolerate it if their wives or girlfriends lose their jobs. Money is the leading cause for divorce, and even if not explicitly the reason, it's often the real reason behind the "we fell apart." And let's not pretend women don't initiate divorce significantly more than men.

Marriage and kids will only continue to further to decline as corporate america continues it's assault on the family in order to continually expand the economy and cheapen labor. Corporations love having women working unpaid overtime to buy shit they don't need to impress people they don't like.

Then when they have their thirtieth birthday party, they can start crying about how old they are and not married with no kids.... over a nice bottle of wine. Now that they're out of the raising a family game, they can entirely focus their efforts on their career and gobble down anti-depressants and sleep aids to make it through the day.

 

[nac386]

Good luck to parents.

It's seems difficult to navigate, but it really isn't. Talk to your kids, have good relationships, support them, hold them to a high standard but be understanding, etc. Everything works out fine.

 

[gassius_clay]

I know because a lot of them seems to be afraid of, or hate cultural diversity, and change.

A lot of them are sick of the jealous petty racist bullshit.

 

[trac209]

Tr

But declining birth rates are terrible for the modern, developed economy. An ageing population is destined for economic stagnation.

Remember you asked me in the other thread if I think countries should be able to ban Muslim immigration? Well, developed countries wouldn't need large scale immigration, Muslim or otherwise, if their birth rates were above replacement levels.

Perhaps not, but is perhaps overpopulation of certain areas of the world that leads to poverty,starvation,wars religious or otherwise that causes mass fleeing,migrants etc? Perhaps these things are systematically related. I can’t help but think if other regions of the planet had a little less population it would leave a bit of breathing room. I have a marine aquarium and I can have two species that in a 50 gallon would kill each other almost instantly, yet in 250 gallon live just fine. But I don’t wanna get off topic lol

 

[Islam Imamate]

Tr

Perhaps not, but is perhaps overpopulation of certain areas of the world that leads to poverty,starvation,wars religious or otherwise that causes mass fleeing,migrants etc? Perhaps these things are systematically related. I can’t help but think if other regions of the planet had a little less population it would leave a bit of breathing room. I have a marine aquarium and I can have two species that in a 50 gallon would kill each other almost instantly, yet in 250 gallon live just fine. But I don’t wanna get off topic lol

I don't want to drag the thread off topic either but IMO overpopulation is an overrated problem, especially when compared to over-consumption which is more often driven by developed countries.

For the developed countries, declining birth rates are a major problem and its a virtually universal one among them.

 

[Deleted member 409801]

Will it though? I don't think its some sort of genetic trait that can be selected for like that. Across the entire developed world, from the US to Japan, we see this trend of low birth rates.

It could just be that the nature of a developed society is such that a certain portion of people who grow up in them willing decide not to reproduce. Then in the next generation, now smaller than the first due to the lower birth rates, the same portion of people decide to forego parenthood and so on and so on until you find yourself where Japan is, where schools are closing and the ratio of adult diaper sales to baby diaper sales is rapidly increasing.

I'd chance a guess that people born into more traditional 2....3...4 child homes would be more likely to be more traditional going forward though. Prob does correct for itself over time

 

[Islam Imamate]

Women can be anything they want. Problem is, as Chris Rock would say, nothing dries a pussy up faster than a woman opening her wallet for a man.

It's gonna take a long time for women to accept being breadwinners in a relationship and potentially supporting men. Men generally can tolerate it if their wives or girlfriends lose their jobs. Money is the leading cause for divorce, and even if not explicitly the reason, it's often the real reason behind the "we fell apart." And let's not pretend women don't initiate divorce significantly more than men.

Marriage and kids will only continue to further to decline as corporate america continues it's assault on the family in order to continually expand the economy and cheapen labor. Corporations love having women working unpaid overtime to buy shit they don't need to impress people they don't like.

Then when they have their thirtieth birthday party, they can start crying about how old they are and not married with no kids.... over a nice bottle of wine. Now that they're out of the raising a family game, they can entirely focus their efforts on their career and gobble down anti-depressants and sleep aids to make it through the day.

The only remedy thus far for this is to promote immigration. I'm not staunchly anti-immigrant or anything but to me that's a short term solution to the problem since those immigrant communities also see a drop in their birth rates over time. Hypothetically if the developing world were to become as developed as Germany or Japan within ten years and followed the same trend in birth rates, the human race would presumably calmly walk towards extinction while mindlessly consuming whatever the latest distraction the mega-corporations can pump out until the global economy collapsed under the weight of the unsustainably ageing population, Children of Men style.

I'd guess though that people born into more traditional 2....3...4 child homes would be more likely to be more traditional going forward though. Prob does correct for itself over time

The evidence suggests the opposite, birth rates are steadily declining across the developed world. The more developed, the lower the birth rates are. Even immigrant communities from highly conservative cultures see their birth rates drop generation to generation when they move to developed countries.

 

[Unknown Pleasures]

The only remedy thus far for this is to promote immigration. I'm not staunchly anti-immigrant or anything but to me that's a short term solution to the problem since thos eimmigrant communities also see a drop in their birth rates over time. Hypothetically if the developing world were to become as developed as Germany or Japan within ten years and followed the same trend in birth rates, the human race would presumably calmly walk towards extinction while mindlessly consuming whatever the latest distraction the mega-corporations can pump out until the global economy collapsed under the weight of the unsustainably ageing population, Children of Men style.

The evidence suggests the opposite, birth rates are steadily declining across the developed world. The more developed, the lower the birth rates are. Even immigrant communities from highly conservative cultures see their birth rates drop generation to generation when they move to developed countries.

I'm inclined to agree that immigration right now is partially a short term tie over as we move to a more automated lifestyle where rationing and universal basic income will become necessities. I think 100 plus or so years from now the world is in a sense going to flip. I see lower birth rates, longer life spans, and no real retirement age. I picture robotic maids/housekeepers. Individuals not owning cars, but essentially having a driverless Uber-like network of highly efficient cars. Lot of time spent in Virtual Reality (simulated vacations etc). Tones of low value add jobs will become extinct and changed into care giver like jobs for the elderly.

I don't mean this as a negative vision, I think life in 100 years will be a LOT better than it is now. I think though that it will be unsettling for a lot of people to go through so much change.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I'm inclined to agree that immigration right now is partially a short term tie over as we move to a more automated lifestyle where rationing and universal basic income will become necessities. I think 100 plus or so years from now the world is in a sense going to flip. I see lower birth rates, longer life spans, and no real retirement age. I picture robotic maids/housekeepers. Individuals not owning cars, but essentially having a driverless Uber-like network of highly efficient cars. Lot of time spent in Virtual Reality (simulated vacations etc). Tones of low value add jobs will become extinct and changed into care giver like jobs for the elderly.

I don't mean this as a negative vision, I think life in 100 years will be a LOT better than it is now. I think though that it will be unsettling for a lot of people to go through so much change.

Perhaps but if we don't make it to that utopia in time everything could collapse and send us back hundreds of years. I'm probably overstating things with this doomsday scenario but I think demographic and environmental collapse should be taken seriously.

 

[trac209]

I'd chance a guess that people born into more traditional 2....3...4 child homes would be more likely to be more traditional going forward though. Prob does correct for itself over time

Unless some of those two,three and four child households are producing these untraditional kids. And let’s face it regardless of your religious,political moral views in 2018 the kids and even 30-50 year old demographic is vastly different than it was even as little as 20 years ago. This issue won’t go away as long as some are dead set on pushing society in this direction.