Now I gots an IBJJF question (Hillary pls halp)

[Dean Lewis]

Seeing as these two moves are things that I tend to do, I'd like to know the legality of them. I'll let the video speak for itself, as I explain my question pretty thoroughly in it and it would be redundant to write it all out here. (I am attempting to embed, if someone would like to do so go ahead and do it since I'm not positive if I'm doing it right)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYI3VjEDqGo&feature=youtu.be

 

[ValveBJJ]

I'm not an expert but I'd say you might get into trouble for the first one.

The second situation I don't see a problem.

 

[Hillary]

I only clicked the link because you said "halp" instead of help. Making me do work and shit.

First one is illegal once the foot crosses the hip/thigh. I like to pull that foot back and push on/hook the thigh or back of the knee there--from that position I run zero risk of getting DQed.

Second one is fine.

*edited

 

[Budo Jake]

Hillary has posted. Thread is done.

 

[Hillary]

Damnit now Jake has me second guessing myself. I'm pretty sure my answer is right, but I sent the video to some of the head refs and I'll wait for response.

 

[Dean Lewis]

Thanks Hillary, that explanation helps a lot to avoid the possible DQ scenario. As far as phrasing the question, I knew "halp" would get more interest. Call me a businessman, I suppose.

Thanks for sending the video around, I'd be glad to get a definitive answer on both of these.

 

[ValveBJJ]

Is it actually reaping though?

I'm starting to second guess as well.

It's like a reverse reap

 

[Dean Lewis]

Is it actually reaping though?

I'm starting to second guess as well.

It's like a reverse reap

That's so meta

But yes, this is essentially my concern. The action is somewhat similar, but in reality you have much less ability to continue reaping the leg, unlike the classic "reaping" position where you have a better angle to force your opponent to turn and torque the knee...

 

[Rawex]

For your next video tell the cameraman not to chew gum

 

[Hillary]

I got one response back from a head ref that's also a friend, and they are saying that where you cross your foot over the hip is reaping. I'm in the process of arguing this with bossman (I sincerely disagree, as the foot is neither trapped nor intertwined with the leg as in classical reaping), but we'll see. I don't know if the "ugh I hate this rule," at the end of my email helped, hahaah.

 

[Hillary]

Response: "Everybody hates this rule." Then he goes onto explain that there is torque on the knee.

Sorry to take your funsies from you, kid.

 

[ValveBJJ]

http://www.ibjjf.org/docs/rulesibjjf1stedition.pdf

page 22:

Crossing outside foot inwards across opponent

 

[Dean Lewis]

Response: "Everybody hates this rule." Then he goes onto explain that there is torque on the knee.

Sorry to take your funsies from you, kid.

That is definitely not fun, sadly. Thanks for trying to argue it. I hit a similar sweep in nogi pans without any problem but I'm glad that I know not to work this particular sweep now...I'll try using your suggestion with hooking the foot inside, as that seems fairly logical.

The move from regular DLR is fine though, right? I believe that question has been asked before frequently.

 

[Lokeh]

Thanks for answering these questions Hillary! I've been wondering about these instances as well. I have a couple other questions:

What if one lets go of the foot after the RDLR/Spiral sweep?

I often use this position to set up the berimbolo, which requires putting my shin across their waist, but I abandon the underhook on the foot for the belt to do this.

Is there a question of intent/force involved, as well? E.g. if he sits to his butt to prevent the traditional backtake from here and I'm not pressuring on the leg, but my foot is hanging on the air above his hip, am I going to get DQ'd?

This is one of my favorite sweeps/transition positions, so it's very relevant for when I go to compete next year.

 

[Hillary]

With any questions please use videos. I'm allergic to many named positions in BJJ and trying to picture something just never works the way you want it to.

 

[Rawex]

With any questions please use videos. I'm allergic to many named positions in BJJ and trying to picture something just never works the way you want it to.

Good so i am not the only one who cant picture what someone means when they explain this like that :icon_lol:

 

[Shemhazai]

I got one response back from a head ref that's also a friend, and they are saying that where you cross your foot over the hip is reaping. I'm in the process of arguing this with bossman (I sincerely disagree, as the foot is neither trapped nor intertwined with the leg as in classical reaping), but we'll see. I don't know if the "ugh I hate this rule," at the end of my email helped, hahaah.

Jesus ... so any time any foot crosses the opponent's leg from outside to inside, it's 'reaping'? And they will call a reap on this type of move, yet never DQ anyone for applying tremendous knee-torquing pressure with Lucas Leite style half guard sweeps? The mind boggles.

 

[redaxe]

Wow, that rule blows. He can relieve the knee pressure by simply turning away, so if he hurts his knee resisting, it's his own fault.

So sweeping while hooking the leg with your arm from DLR and RDLR is basically illegal now?

Come on guys, can we not be such huge pussies about our knees? The IBJJF rulebook is getting a little ridiculous.

Thank you for explaining though, Hillary.

 

[KarateFist]

is it only illegal because he's still maintaining that underhook on the foot while he throws his leg across? what if he's just grabbing the ankle with his hand?

 

[Dean Lewis]

Now I'm still confused, is inverting from DLR illegal? Like I said in the video, I understand clasping the hands and pulling is illegal (like the rulebook shows), but what about just using one hand and inverting?