North Korea Threatens to Scuddle Talks

The lefties couldn't be happier if NK ended peace talks.
 
lfd0311 said:
China is less inclined to support them than they've ever been. I understand China's concerns, but those are drastically outweighed by thier inability to control him they way they could his father and grandfather, and with their constant pressing need to feed their people, which is in large parts solved by thier trade agreement with the US.
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Feeding the North Korean people or lack there of is part of the strategy. Go on youtube and watch some of the North Korean propaganda videos, they've basically ingrained in their people that "while the food situation here is bad, it's worse other places" they have videos of winter time in Detroit and it's all "look how the Americans ate all the leaves off the trees, look at all the homeless people freezing on the street in America" they have built a cult of personality on the concept of personal sacrifice for the advancement and protection of their society. It's Orwellian in it's most basic form.
China's involvement is a matter of convenience. It was convenient for the Chinese to encourage Kim Il Sung to support his invasion of the south especially since the Soviets bankrolled it, it was convenient for Chairman Mao to send in the "volunteers" since he was facing his own issues including famine, it helped him secure one of his borders and it created an external threat that justified the fact that millions were starving, it's been convenient for them to support the North due to cheap coal and labor among other things as well as having a buffer between it and a major US ally. That doesn't mean they don't think the North Koreans are a pain in the ass and sometimes wish they didn't have them.
Also China is playing "the rational one", Trump's rhetoric, Kim's rhetoric and then you have China saying "you should all play nice and work this out". China is playing the game, China is playing it very well. Regardless what happens, China is poised to be the winner in this whole situation and improve their position in the pan Pacific region. This is apparent by Russia trying to coat tail China on the whole thing.
 
lfd0311 said:
They fear starvation....
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They obviously don't.

They blame it on America, and the people believe it. Kim's greatest political domestic challenge is convincing the people of NK, that they shouldn't attack the US the next day.

You think people chanting death to America is bad?

Wonder what most would think of the brain washed masses in NK.
 
SMillard said:
Feeding the North Korean people or lack there of is part of the strategy. Go on youtube and watch some of the North Korean propaganda videos, they've basically ingrained in their people that "while the food situation here is bad, it's worse other places" they have videos of winter time in Detroit and it's all "look how the Americans ate all the leaves off the trees, look at all the homeless people freezing on the street in America" they have built a cult of personality on the concept of personal sacrifice for the advancement and protection of their society. It's Orwellian in it's most basic form.
China's involvement is a matter of convenience. It was convenient for the Chinese to encourage Kim Il Sung to support his invasion of the south especially since the Soviets bankrolled it, it was convenient for Chairman Mao to send in the "volunteers" since he was facing his own issues including famine, it helped him secure one of his borders and it created an external threat that justified the fact that millions were starving, it's been convenient for them to support the North due to cheap coal and labor among other things as well as having a buffer between it and a major US ally. That doesn't mean they don't think the North Koreans are a pain in the ass and sometimes wish they didn't have them.
Also China is playing "the rational one", Trump's rhetoric, Kim's rhetoric and then you have China saying "you should all play nice and work this out". China is playing the game, China is playing it very well. Regardless what happens, China is poised to be the winner in this whole situation and improve their position in the pan Pacific region. This is apparent by Russia trying to coat tail China on the whole thing.
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That's all well and good. Except for not being able to actually control Kim Jong Un. China sent 350k Troops to the NK boarder earlier this year. That wasn't to help Kim Jong Un. Again, you're leaving out how massively important hegemony is in Asian Culture.
 
JonnyRingo84 said:
what?

did you not accuse everyone of being happy that NK has nukes? that isnt dishonest spin on your part?
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that's literally what was gleefully posted, in a 2nd thread might i add, about this topic. all of you are out over your skis about this, and on both sides might i add.
 
This seems like a good thread to drop a piece by Tom Nichols, a conservative who is a very smart dude and an expert on these issues.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...d-trump-kim-jong-un-caution-column/568508002/

He's arguing that NK has already had major victories in the last year, that Trump is goofing this up and even though we should be hopeful we should also be mindful of the dangers if this thing goes to shit.

Of course as the title suggests, Trumpsters that have already declared victory and gave Trump the nobel peach prize for solving NK are doing so irrationally.
 
thefirstemporer said:
The lefties couldn't be happier if NK ended peace talks.
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Do you have examples of this? The regular lefties in the WR and in the mainstream media are hoping this works out well but are skeptical, at least from what I'm reading/watching.
 
VivaRevolution said:
They obviously don't.

They blame it on America, and the people believe it. Kim's greatest political domestic challenge is convincing the people of NK, that they shouldn't attack the US the next day.

You think people chanting death to America is bad?

Wonder what most would think of the brain washed masses in NK.
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Wow.....

First of all, I was talking about China.

Secondly, The People of NK "believe" it because if they don't outwardly pretend to believe it they get rounded up and sent to camps. Note you've ignored about 3 times my question about what always happens to brutal dictatorships when they start to not be just a tiny bit brutal. They collapse and everyone who had been in power gets shot. That's what I was talking about.
 
VivaRevolution said:
And China supports North Korea for one reason. They don't want 25 million refugees surging across their boarder.

So basically, if they ever exercise that leverage, they will create the very thing they fear.
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They also support them because they are a thorn in America's eye. So the Chinese know they can use NK bellicosity to force the US to backdown on policies and actions the Chinese see as threats to their power.
 
Quequeg said:
Nope, just laughing at all the Trumtards with their premature celebrations and bragging about Trump.
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So like he said, you'd actually be excited. Think about how idioticly partisan a person would have to be to do something like that....
 
cincymma79 said:
no way a cia personnel broke down over this given the shit they read from afghans raping kids daliy
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The description is of the CIA field officers performing the torture breaking down in tears. Hardened CIA operatives in tears over waterboarding? Does that seem believable to You?

I think barbaric mutilation is what breaks a CIA officer. I think that is what is classified in the house Intel report.
 
kpt018 said:
This seems like a good thread to drop a piece by Tom Nichols, a conservative who is a very smart dude and an expert on these issues.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...d-trump-kim-jong-un-caution-column/568508002/

He's arguing that NK has already had major victories in the last year, that Trump is goofing this up and even though we should be hopeful we should also be mindful of the dangers if this thing goes to shit.

Of course as the title suggests, Trumpsters that have already declared victory and gave Trump the nobel peach prize for solving NK are doing so irrationally.
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Oh really? You don't say? Tom Nichols has somthing critical to say about TrumP? Huh....

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/18/magazine/never-trump-confidential.html
 
lfd0311 said:
Wow.....

First of all, I was talking about China.

Secondly, The People of NK "believe" it because if they don't outwardly pretend to believe it they get rounded up and sent to camps. Note you've ignored about 3 times my question about what always happens to brutal dictatorships when they start to not be just a tiny bit brutal. They collapse and everyone who had been in power gets shot. That's what I was talking about.
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That's not going to happen because the North Korean government has a 100% monopoly on information.

People believe what they are told.

You are a clear example of this.
 
kpt018 said:
What's your point man? It's well known that he is a never Trumper, but that obviously doesn't mean his criticisms are not valid.

For him it's not partisan (he's a conservative).
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He openly states that he's a Never Trump Republican. That's clearly a partisan issue.
 
lfd0311 said:
He openly states that he's a Never Trump Republican. That's clearly a partisan issue.
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No it isn't. Trump is a Republican, he is a republican. It is not about partisanship but about the man. And he has publicly made his case as to why he doesn't support Trump and it's well thought out.
 
VivaRevolution said:
The description is of the CIA field officers performing the torture breaking down in tears. Hardened CIA operatives in tears over waterboarding? Does that seem believable to You?

I think barbaric mutilation is what breaks a CIA officer. I think that is what is classified in the house Intel report.
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they didn't do that to ksm. i doubt it then. who knows though
 
lfd0311 said:
Wow.....

First of all, I was talking about China.

Secondly, The People of NK "believe" it because if they don't outwardly pretend to believe it they get rounded up and sent to camps. Note you've ignored about 3 times my question about what always happens to brutal dictatorships when they start to not be just a tiny bit brutal. They collapse and everyone who had been in power gets shot. That's what I was talking about.
Click to expand...

Pinochet wasnt shot.
 
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