Most BJJ Fighters Can't Wrestle Because They Aren't Humble Like Maia, Says Askren

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Agree on that generation had a bad mentality.

A lot of the current no-gi guys are training a lot of wrestling and it showed at the recent ADCC
 
Is it wrong that I read "says Askren" and automatically clicked Disagree?
 
Aldo never uses his BJJ lol

He only shoots for desperation takedowns when he is hurt or gassed, i.e. Hominick and Holloway fights
He did when he fought Mike Brown (for the belt in WEC) for example
 
Cub Swanson is a blackbelt who has been grappling for 15 years. Not like he doesn't have the ability to stop a takedown.

Agree that Maia has good wrestling for a BJJ centric fighter. Not sure if it has anything to do with him being humble, maybe more with being realistic..

Black belts in wrestling ??
 
Ben is right, especially with Gracies, that's why they're garbage in modern MMA

Kron looked like a complete can in that fight
Exactly and in a pure Gracie tradition the boy has the nerves to pretend he won that fight.
{<jordan}
 
Not a lot of grappling clubs are offering wrestling as style taught. Some of the gyms that may model themselves as an “mma” gym may have hired a wrestler to teach it a couple/few times a week but there is zero money in a wrestling school for adults. Too many injuries and too hard for regular people to stick around.

Like someone said before, its hard for someone who never wrestled scholastically to pick it up post school age. Even if you join a local wrestling club (rare) its most likely gonna be filled with high-schoolers looking to up there game for college scholarships.

Where is a grown ass man who did JJ his whole life gonna just “learn to wrestle”? I dont think its that easy without money to spend on those resources, like private lessons and group wrestling sessions.
 
You aren't going to get good at wrestling unless you have other people to work with. It is tough to pick up throwing at an older age because it fucking sucks.
 
He's not wrong, but he's also guilty of the same thing. He can't throw a punch because he isn't humble. How many years in MMA and he literally can't throw a proper strike of any kind? Isn't that the same problem BJJ guys make by not learning wrestling and striking? Maia is the one guy who's learned to adapt his game to MMA. He's still a specialist, but he's a rounded specialist now
Very good point.
 
I agree most bjj guys lack wrestling skills and I agree Maia did the right thing working on his wrestling.
What I disagree with is saying moat guys can't wrestle because they aren't humble. That might bw the case for Kron and guys who train in the US, but it is very very difficult to find a good wrestling coach in Brazil. It has nothing to do with being humble or not. It is simply not something they have access to.
Also, If you fight on small events, most of the time bjj guys Will be successful, so they only realize they can't wrestle when they reach the UFC.
 
“Jiu Jitsu guys have no takedowns,” he said. “And we saw it with Kron Gracie. Kron Gracie is legit a very high-level grappler. This man won the ADCC’s. I can’t remember what year right now, but he won the ADCC’s, and yet he looked clueless. He looked absolutely freaking clueless on how to get a takedown last Saturday night! It was ridiculous! It’s not like Cub Swanson was a high-level division-one wrestler!

“And so one of the things that I actually appreciate and like about Demian, is that he’s a Jiu Jitsu guy who kind of put his ego away and said, 'Okay, well, I am a Jiu Jitsu guy, but I’m gonna learn how to wrestle so I can take people down and then do my Jiu Jitsu from there.' And I like that. And I don’t think enough Jiu Jitsu people do that. And I think if more people followed Demian’s lead they would be better off.”

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2019/10/18/20920240/ufc-singapore-ben-askren-on-demian-maia-fight-jiu-jitsu-guys-have-no-takedowns-mma-news

Yeah because wrestling invented double legs. lol
 
Cub Swanson is a blackbelt who has been grappling for 15 years. Not like he doesn't have the ability to stop a takedown.

Agree that Maia has good wrestling for a BJJ centric fighter. Not sure if it has anything to do with him being humble, maybe more with being realistic..

I think it has more to do with his loss against Jake Shields.
 
For the most part he's right, not a lot of BJJ specialists have good takedowns. There are exceptions of course like Arona, Jacare and Maia but a lot of BJJ guys focus more on striking than on learning how to take people down. Maia himself did that for a while and thought it was a mistake and worked more on his wrestling.
 
“Jiu Jitsu guys have no takedowns,” he said. “And we saw it with Kron Gracie. Kron Gracie is legit a very high-level grappler. This man won the ADCC’s. I can’t remember what year right now, but he won the ADCC’s, and yet he looked clueless. He looked absolutely freaking clueless on how to get a takedown last Saturday night! It was ridiculous! It’s not like Cub Swanson was a high-level division-one wrestler!

“And so one of the things that I actually appreciate and like about Demian, is that he’s a Jiu Jitsu guy who kind of put his ego away and said, 'Okay, well, I am a Jiu Jitsu guy, but I’m gonna learn how to wrestle so I can take people down and then do my Jiu Jitsu from there.' And I like that. And I don’t think enough Jiu Jitsu people do that. And I think if more people followed Demian’s lead they would be better off.”

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2019/10/18/20920240/ufc-singapore-ben-askren-on-demian-maia-fight-jiu-jitsu-guys-have-no-takedowns-mma-news
100% right.

Most wrestlers are willing to accept and train bjj, but most bjj guys aren't willing to train wrestling.
 
I think Ben has a valid point, but people have been saying the same kind of thing about him not learning to box. And added that he is content not to learn how to become a skilled striker, relying on his wrestling.
It is pretty ironic coming from such a one-dimensional fighter like Askren.
 
That's not true at all.

Wrestlers have access to the best BJJ training in the world, the way everyone else does. The reverse is not true for BJJ guys. It is very difficult to get good at wrestling, unless you did it in school. Access to it just doesn't exist at the same level, the way it does for BJJ. It's not as simple as just putting your ego away. The wrestling practices done in an MMA gym or even going to a wrestling club still won't provide anywhere near the level of training that someone like Askren can easily find for BJJ.
Man cut the crap,just wrestle,work on it and get that grind them bjj phonies dont have and then maybe they will start getting success with takedowns
 
Even with judo you still need wrestling. Okami realized this and trained with Chael after he lost to him. Aoki has a judo black belt, and he can take down lesser fighters in One, but he was absolutely ragdolled by Gilbert Melendez and KO'd stiff by Eddie Alvarez in their rematch (I don't remember if he tried taking Eddie down, but don't think he'd have success if he did). He would've run into the same problems with many other guys if he came to the UFC.
Having a "black belt in Judo" and being an elite Judoka isn't the same thing. It's the same difference between a D1 wrestler and "I wrestled in high school".

The elite Judokas in MMA have excellent takedowns, there just haven't been that many.
 
A lot of these guys have good takedowns for jiu jitsu or submission wrestling competitions where the fight is expected to go to the ground. It's a whole world when the other guy almost never wants to go to the ground and can punch and kick you. You have to train it completely differently.
 
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