Law Mississippi Abortion Law in SCOTUS: Roe v. Wade in the Crosshairs

[sickc0d3r]

What happened to separation of church and state.
I swear the older I get the more I side with Atheists

You and me both, pal.

 

[cooks1]

It will probably make kids and teens wait longer to have sex, and cause some adults to get married or married sooner

Less encouraging of promiscuous sex and more encouragement to wait until you're married to have sex

Even you can't possibly believe this. I'll grant you there are lot's of horny kids doing a lot of reckless shit. I see them all the time. I have a teenage daughter (thankfully a good girl so far). But I have never met or even heard of a single one saying, 'Don't worry, I can just get an abortion'.

For more anecdotal proof of this, I offer you the fact that red states with more pro life sentiment, and stricter abortion laws, while having the lowest teen abortion rates, generally have the highest teen birth rates. Which is not at all surprising. It's clear neither concerns about abortion or getting stuck with a kid mean jackety shit. They are fucking all the same. Why? Because they are young, stupid and horny.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/757792/us-abortion-rate-among-women-15-19-years-by-state/
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/teen-births/teenbirths.htm

 

[ElKarlo]

I was thinking along the lines of improved morning or week after pills. Or perhaps a male pill you could take to fuck with your sperm temporarily. We do have a lot of resources now. The problem is the people that need them have poor access to them. They need to be easy to get and free.

In my area aka Dc area they had free condoms. Schools and many community centers had them for free. Even on the 90s and early 2000s

 

[PrinceOfPain]

The United States spends close to a trillion dollars on welfare annually.

It should be embarrassing to the whole country that your foster care system is so bad that "it'll be a burden" is seen as a valid reason for one of your citizens to erase the potential and the existence of a future citizen.

 

[ElKarlo]

Let me ask you a question. An earnest question that I hope you will answer thoughtfully. I don't know how old you are or how prolific your younger years were. Perhaps you have been a responsible earnest man your entire life. Perhaps like many you were wild when you were young and grew into it.

But let us suppose at age 40 or so, you got served with a court order for a DNA test and it turned out you accidentally impregnated a woman 16 years ago. Maybe it was a one night stand and you wore a rubber but were unlucky. She somehow found you on social media. Whatever the case, like you, this woman is staunchly pro life and chose to keep the child. Not she is asking for child support retroactively. Which Yes, is a thing.

I am sure you would be deeply disappointed and angry about not getting to be part of the child's life and upbringing. But given your undying belief in responsibility and that reproduction has consequences, I am assuming you would have no problem whatsoever kicking in what would likely be between $50-200K. Am I right about that?

That would be a completely hypothetical situation. I’m 40 now and I have two kids and there’s zero chance I have others. I never did anything that would do something I wasn’t willing to take responsibility for.
And in this situation I would kick in the money. As it would be an obligation. How can you have a kid and walk away from any and all aide? I think people that can sever ties or not have any idea of responsibility aren’t adults and can’t be thought of as fully developed people.
I had a GF once and only had one condom at the time. I never thought about doing but it raw and honestly later on was happy I didn’t. She ended up be a drama queen. I didn’t know her well enough to even take that chance. I don’t see how most people do, as they just figure it’ll just work it’s self out somehow in the end

 

[58miles]

The United States spends close to a trillion dollars on welfare annually.

It should be embarrassing to the whole country that your foster care system is so bad that "it'll be a burden" is a valid reason for one of your citizens to end the existence of a future citizen.

It's not just financial there are many other burdens that go into having a child and some women are not prepared for that and decide to terminate the pregnancy and since they are the ones carrying the baby for 9 months the decision should be up to them.

 

[ElKarlo]

It will probably make kids and teens wait longer to have sex, and cause some adults to get married or married sooner

Less encouraging of promiscuous sex and more encouragement to wait until you're married to have sex

I think making so young adults can live on their own and be responsible would be better to encourage. Wait til 18 can be realistic. I got married at 29. I don’t think that’s responsible to wait.
Churches should help kids get jobs and help with housing then when they are young and allow them to get married and enjoy life. Not be stuck in to die parents house waiting to finally make enough
Good day don’t kids should have some sort of church apartments idk

 

[Mike]

Bizarre to me that the religious are still trying to use legislation to force secular people into following their rules. I dont care what your sky daddy says about anything.

 

[ElKarlo]

The United States spends close to a trillion dollars on welfare annually.

It should be embarrassing to the whole country that your foster care system is so bad that "it'll be a burden" is seen as a valid reason for one of your citizens to erase the potential and the existence of a future citizen.

I literally went to one of the best high schools in the nation in the 90s. Everything they did made things swords. Bigger classes, less time exercising all that. The govt really hasn’t been competent enough for decades to do anything like have a good child services on the fed level

 

[PrinceOfPain]

It's not just financial there are many other burdens that go into having a child and some women are not prepared for that

Other than raising the child, what are the insurmountable burdens of having a child?
Obviously, aside from situations wherein childbirth might harm the mother.

and decide to terminate the pregnancy and since they are the ones carrying the baby for 9 months the decision should be up to them.

9 months isn't really all that long. And the vast majority of pregnant women made the decision to be pregnant several times. Once that decision manifests as an actual pregnancy, the women's choices really should narrow, since they no longer impact only her.

 

[58miles]

Bizarre to me that the religious are still trying to use legislation to force secular people into following their rules. I dont care what your sky daddy says about anything.

The American Taliban only mentions what sky daddy has to say when it's convenient, they even claim sky daddy says things he never says. Btw the Bible doesn't say anything about being against abortion in fact I believe it gives directions on how to perform an abortion in Numbers 5:11-31. .

 

[Mike]

The American Taliban only mentions what sky daddy has to say when it's convenient, they even claim sky daddy says things he never says. Btw the Bible doesn't say anything about being against abortion in fact I believe it gives directions on how to perform an abortion in Numbers 5:11-31. .

I'm not talking about the Bible. The group vocally opposed to abortions and funding anti abortion legislation are largely the religious right. That's literally always been the case. They feel like it's immoral, and they should be able to force other people to live according to their religious beliefs. You can argue whether they or right or wrong to feel that way, but it would be incredibly disingenuous to say that isn't the group behind this.

 

[Mike]

The United States spends close to a trillion dollars on welfare annually.

It should be embarrassing to the whole country that your foster care system is so bad that "it'll be a burden" is seen as a valid reason for one of your citizens to erase the potential and the existence of a future citizen.

You should meet some people raised in the system and see what some of the typical outcomes look like for them.

 

[58miles]

I'm not talking about the Bible. The group vocally opposed to abortions and funding anti abortion legislation are largely the religious right. That's literally always been the case. They feel like it's immoral, and they should be able to force other people to live according to their religious beliefs. You can argue whether they or right or wrong to feel that way, but it would be incredibly disingenuous to say that isn't the group behind this.

They use the Bible which never says anything against abortion and in fact gives directions on how to perform an abortion as the reason they oppose abortion.

 

[Mike]

They use the Bible which never says anything against abortion and in fact gives directions on how to perform an abortion as the reason they oppose abortion.

The Bible says a lot of contradictory things. Makes it easy to pick and choose whatever matches their emotions at the moment.

 

[PrinceOfPain]

I literally went to one of the best high schools in the nation in the 90s. Everything they did made things swords. Bigger classes, less time exercising all that. The govt really hasn’t been competent enough for decades to do anything like have a good child services on the fed level

And that is in itself a problem.
Though, I wouldn't recommend a foster care or child services program that was solely run by a government - rather have the government encourage and support community-led private sector childcare initiatives.

Whatever the case though, there should be a viable alternate solution to:
A) ending the unborn's life;
B) Forcing an unfit mother to raise a child.

I refuse to err on the side of erasure.

 

[PrinceOfPain]

You should meet some people raised in the system and see what some of the typical outcomes look like for them.

Again, I don't think it's a great excuse to throw one's hands up and say "welp, we can't do foster care. Guess we're just gonna hafta kill 'em."
If that's what one's pro-abortion stance comes down to, it's pretty weak.

Try harder.

 

[sickc0d3r]

The United States spends close to a trillion dollars on welfare annually.

It should be embarrassing to the whole country that your foster care system is so bad that "it'll be a burden" is seen as a valid reason for one of your citizens to erase the potential and the existence of a future citizen.

No shit. We don’t do nearly enough, imo. People are afraid to have kids and be stuck with a major financial burden before they can get their shit together. Who’s picking up the kids from school at 2:40 when both parents have to work? How are they going to afford daycare or after care? What if a kid is sick and your job doesn’t let you work from home? We. Don’t. Do. Enough. Not even close. People more and more want to be financially stable first, which is totally understandable and responsible if you ask me. You want to reduce the number of abortions? Improve the social safety net.

 

[Mike]

Again, I don't think it's a great excuse to throw one's hands up and say "welp, we can't do foster care. Guess we're just gonna hafta kill 'em."

Try harder.

That's not the only issue. The right wants to force people that made a mistake to care for children they're ill equipped to care for. Which is bad for those parents, and society as a whole because they often have poor outcomes and unpleasant lives. The same people trying to force others to live bytheir moral code want nothing to do with caring for these children, or providing sufficient resources to help these parents care for them. They stick their fingers in their ears and ignore the valid complaints that it's infringing on people's liberties, the foster care system is riddled with abusers, there aren't enough people willing to adopt.

They flat out ignore these problems and say just force them to have these kids and it'll work out somehow. We tried that. It doesn't magically work out somehow. If the same people trying to control other people's reproduction also wanted to offer more social aid, this would be a very different conversation.

Instead they just want to say people should magically just be better on their own and willfully ignore the data we have that shows that they will not.

 

[Oedad]

They use the Bible which never says anything against abortion and in fact gives directions on how to perform an abortion as the reason they oppose abortion.

You got me curious so I looked up the chapter.

16 “‘The priest shall bring her and have her stand before the Lord. 17 Then he shall take some holy water in a clay jar and put some dust from the tabernacle floor into the water. 18 After the priest has had the woman stand before the Lord, he shall loosen her hair and place in her hands the reminder-offering, the grain offering for jealousy, while he himself holds the bitter water that brings a curse. 19 Then the priest shall put the woman under oath and say to her, “If no other man has had sexual relations with you and you have not gone astray and become impure while married to your husband, may this bitter water that brings a curse not harm you. 20 But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— 21 here the priest is to put the woman under this curse—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. 22 May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.”

Now I'm not one to doubt the effectiveness of ancient curses, but I don't think holy water mixed with some floor dust actually caused a lot of aborted pregnancies

The chapter is basically saying if you think your wife if unfaithful bring her to the temple and make her drink some water and if she was unfaithful god will curse her with a miscarriage and if she wasn't nothing will happen and you can know your wife if faithful lol.

Essentially the curse would never happen because holy water and dust doesn't cause miscarriages lol. Sounds like they made this one up to help soothe jealous husbands by assuring them all their cheating wives weren't really cheating.