Mir's all time status?

Amerikuracana said:
Are some of you guys asleep putting Mir ahead of Werdum so easily?? In Werdum's last 6 fights he has wins over:

Fedor (the first loss)
Nog
BF Silva
Nelson
Russow

Over his career? Notable wins?

Fedor
Nog
Overeem
BF Silva
Alex Emelienenko
Gonzaga x2
Vera (when he was still Vera)
Erickson
Nelson
Zentsov
Russow
Kyle
Einemo

Worst losses?

Decision (close) loss to Arlovski where they just boxed?

Split decision vs Sergei?

If you have Mir ahead of Werdum in this thread, make these two lists for Mir and then make a case for Mir being ahead.. I'll wait.

Fabricio Werdum, 17-5

http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Fabricio-Werdum-8390

Frank Mir, 16-8

http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Frank-Mir-2329
Click to expand...


Anybody??

I'm open to anybody making a case for Mir being ahead of Werdum? Can you do it?
 
Presinator said:
There are plenty of fighters who maybe could or did beat Mir, but who is really ahead of Mir in terms of accomplishment?

UFC guys like Carwin and Lesnar didn't achieve as much as Mir, despite physical ability.

The only guys I'd really consider as possibly ahead of him in terms of accomplishment are Fedor, Nogueira, Barnett, Cro Cop, Couture, and soon JDS and Cain.

That said, modern MMA isn't very old, so expect Mir to be eclipsed by more in relatively short order.
Click to expand...

Good post. I'd add that Frank's legacy will also be his BJJ as a HW, which IMO is the best we've seen (in the context of MMA).
 
You guys love you some Mir.

If he is top 10 then he is at the bottom of that top 10.
 
One of the top 10 UFC HW's. Vastly overrated.
 
The5thgod said:
May be top 10? Of course he's top 10. He's top 5.
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Top 5 UFC. No way top 5 MMA. Just how many bonus points are you giving him for fighting his whole career in the UFC, especially considering how terrible that division has historically been?
 
Just outside the top 10. He beat some name guys but mostly after they were washed up. He has some big wins but he also has some big losses to guys no top HW should lose to. If he was more consistent he would be higher.
 
Area809 said:
One is a former champ and the other one is not.
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meaningless in a sport where the opportunity to fight for the title is given based on the best interests of the promoter

Werdum beat the consensus# 1 of the longest time in Fedor

that is a greater feat than being champ of the ufc in the dark ages, or having the interim belt
 
Area809 said:
One is a former champ and the other one is not.
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Holding a belt makes someone a greater fighter? It doesn't give anyone superpowers and belts don't mean much except who you beat to get it.
 
I don't get how everybody is putting Nog before Mir. I'm really a Nog fan and not so much a fan of Mir's but noone can argue that he beat Nog TWICE. And that wasn't at the end of Nog's career either where Nog would be old and Mir young.
 
Nelly said:
On top of my head, and in no particular order, the top 10 would be Fedor, Big Nog, Cro Cop, Mir, Couture, JDS, Cain, AA, Sylvia, and last spot I'm not sure, maybe Barnett or Coleman.
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I think Werdum may need a spot on that list and Barnett should definitely be in there. Sylvia and AA probably not.
 
Area809 said:
One is a former champ and the other one is not.
Click to expand...

:icon_lol:

Werdum won the #1 fighter in the world championship when he beat Fedor, the only one that matters.. He should not have fell down so much against Overeem in the 2nd fight, because he out-boxed Overeem and without the stupid stradegy still have the #1-2 spot..
 
jmk1502 said:
Top 5 UFC. No way top 5 MMA. Just how many bonus points are you giving him for fighting his whole career in the UFC, especially considering how terrible that division has historically been?
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How many bonus points are people taking away from him for only fighting in the UFC. The UFC puts you against fighters that they have on equal terms. Pride seemed to give you a tough fight and then a few easy fights in between. You may as well not look at who they had but who they fought.

If Fedor had fought Werdum in Pride who is to say he didn't get beat back then and the Fedor train got derailed years prior? Nog had the toughest schedule in Pride Fedor just happened to kill Nog whenever they matched up head to head. Fedor should have fought Werdum, Barnett, Ricco, Hendo and Shogun back in Pride instead of the stupid aquash matches they had him in. It is a lot easier to win a fight a year vs top opposition than it is 3 fights a year against top opposition. There is a reason the UFC HW title is topped out at 2 defenses and it isn't necessarily because they all suck but maybe because they match up evenly.
 
CinemaKingdom said:
Holding a belt makes someone a greater fighter? It doesn't give anyone superpowers and belts don't mean much except who you beat to get it.
Click to expand...

Last I checked, most athletes compete to be champions in sports, unless your name is Tank Abbott or Butterbean. I don't think we should get to put an asterik by someone's record. When Werdum and Mir started their careers, their goal was to be champ--one accomplished it and the other didn't. If the question is who can beat who, then that's another story. Werdum beats him right now, but Mir has the official accomplishments.
 
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