International Military history thread

This is actually a funny example of what you mentioned in the first part of your post. Polish calvary primarily fought dismounted, and the few charges they did were largely successful. The myth that they charged panzers came about after tanks showed up the day after the charge and then Germans took photos of the tanks next to bodies from the day before. Then Germany ran with that propaganda.

Good catch. I knew a little about that, but it wasn't foremost in my mind when typing the post. I knew that scenario was for national pride, though. They got destroyed. I did purposefully include the myth of Carthage salting the earth, just to emphasize the point. It would have been too expensive to salt all the fields. It is so easy to manipulate the public's perception to create enduring myths. I would say most of the things we accept as historical truths are probably false in some way. We could list a lot of things, but then we would have partisan hacks coming in to argue, with certain bluster, that the historical record is unquestionable, when it supports their view.
 
Understanding production & logistics, and the systems used by Germany, the Soviets, and the US. There's a reason that Soviet tanks were crude compared to their US & German counterparts, but it's entirely logical and not what you think.
Soviets found that tanks only need to last for about 10 hours in combat, so there's no point to building them so they last forever

 

https://youtu.be/Emz2Ae9R6bQ


Grandpa was sent with 196 INF out of SD for a buildup of troops in response to Japan bombing the alution islands (Dutch harbor).
(The family initially thought Korea)

My great great grandpa was deployed to France in WW1 out of Halletsvile with an arty unit.

Stepdad drafted for Vietnam.

None of them were lifers though (I was the only one not drafted) so they never spoke or really cared about their service.

would add pictures but this is the WR and can’t.

Something worth posting I did get my grandpas uniform and hat that he threw in the attic years ago. My grandma wanted me to have it since he’s passed for 30 years now. Anyways grandma tells me mice probably ate it to pieces and it’s probably ruined. Shit I got it out and you can damn near put the thing on! It feels like a burlap sack, but impressive how stuff was built to last for years then.

History Marche is my shit too..

 

A little history on the Martini-Henry rifle. Iconic because of the movie Zulu.

images
 
Good catch. I knew a little about that, but it wasn't foremost in my mind when typing the post. I knew that scenario was for national pride, though. They got destroyed. I did purposefully include the myth of Carthage salting the earth, just to emphasize the point. It would have been too expensive to salt all the fields. It is so easy to manipulate the public's perception to create enduring myths. I would say most of the things we accept as historical truths are probably false in some way. We could list a lot of things, but then we would have partisan hacks coming in to argue, with certain bluster, that the historical record is unquestionable, when it supports their view.
Yup, history is narrative essentially.
 
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There was even various use of Cavalry all the way up into WW2.

I'm a big fan of the 19th century military aesthetic. I even collect military sabres, primarily Austrian and Swiss. I have a few that are over 150 years old that still look brand new.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charge_of_the_Savoia_Cavalleria_at_Izbushensky
I posted about this already, but here are the real details
On August 24 at 3:30 am, an Italian mounted patrol, sent to recon the objective, made contact with the Soviets. The Soviets, having lost the element of surprise, opened fire on the entire line. With the camp under fire, Alessandro had no choice but to order, as a last resort, a cavalry charge with drawn sabers and hand grenades against entrenched infantry. While the horse drawn artillery (so called "flying batteries" or voloire in Piemontese) quickly deployed its four pieces and opened fire, the machine guns deployed at the front of the Italian camp and started firing back. Alessandro then ordered the 2nd squadron (over 100 horsemen) to attack the Soviet left flank. Under the command of Captain De Leone, the squadron began a winding maneuver through a gorge, succeeding in engaging the Soviets at the left end of the front, outflanking it and storming it longitudinally with drawn sabers and hand grenades.

Corporal Lolli, unable to draw, as his saber was stuck in its sheath, charged holding high a hand grenade; Trumpeter Carenzi, having to handle both trumpet and pistol, unintentionally shot his own horse in the head.[3] Some horses, even though riddled by bullets, would keep galloping for hundreds of meters, squirting blood at every beat, suddenly collapsing only a while after their actual death.[4] After having crossed just about half of the Soviet line the strength of the squadron was already reduced by half, and the commander himself was grounded.

Realizing that the 2nd squadron was taking heavy casualties, and perceiving through his binoculars that the Soviet riflemen, after the horsemen had jumped over their holes, would get up and shoot at their backs, Colonel Bettoni ordered the 4th squadron to dismount and launch a frontal attack. This would allow the 2nd squadron to regroup behind Soviet lines and perform a return charge. The 4th squadron was led by Captain Silvano Abbà, who was killed while leading his men. He was posthumously awarded the Gold Medal of Military Valour. Once the 2nd squadron was back, its commander urged a new attack. This was performed by 3rd squadron, led by the impatient Captain Marchio, who rushed frontally at the Soviets without taking the detour through the gorge at the side of the battlefield. Major Modignani decided on his own accord to join the 3rd squadron charge, together with the remaining dozen horsemen of the command.

All action ceased by 9:30 am, six hours after the engagement had commenced.

700 vs 2,500 entrenched infantry.
Shortly afterwards German liaison cavalry officers arrived. They were deployed at the left of the Savoia and they had witnessed everything from the neighbouring heights. They expressed their wonder and admiration for the anachronistic episode to Alessandro, saying: "Colonel, these kinds of things, we cannot do them anymore"
 
I'm a little unsure how vulnerable horses actually were to single shot or bolt action rifles. At first I was under the impression they were useless, a giant unarmored target. But I've read that in many cases when charged by rifle wielding horseman many people would panic and miss their shot and get killed.
Of course, well trained troops would just take their time and pick off the horsemen but otherwise you see it time and time again successful horse attacks against guys with rifles. Pancho Villa had lots of success with that tactic, Frederick Selous in South Africa, Semyon Buddiony in Russia etc.

Of course, the faster your follow-up shot the worse for the horseman and in WW2 when you had lots of guys with automatic weapons it got hard.
Something primeval about being charged. Yes even with civil war era rifles it was very disconcerting to be charged by unarmored cab. I couldn’t imagine what it’d be like to be charged by knights while you only had spears and the such.

the charge of the light brigade. There were many saddles emptied and the horses instinctively dressed ranks. So there was a lot more oneness I guess between the rider and the horses than we normally think
 
Battle of Nu'uanu
46458055214_cef749722d_b.jpg


Battle of Nuʻuanu
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Battle of Nuʻuanu (Hawaiian: Kalelekaʻanae; literally the leaping mullet), fought in May 1795 on the southern part of the island of Oʻahu, was a key battle in the final days of King Kamehameha I's wars to unify the Hawaiian Islands. It is known in the Hawaiian language as Kalelekaʻanae, which means "the leaping mullet", and refers to a number of Oʻahu warriors driven off the cliff in the final phase of the battle.[2] There are "varied and sometimes conflicting histories of the Battle of Nuʻuanu."[3]

Prior to the battle
Oʻahu
Around the year 1792 (the exact date is unknown; the landing could have been as late as February 1795), Captain William Brown, an English merchant, landed in the harbor of Honolulu. As a maritime fur trader and gun seller, he made several voyages before from the Pacific Northwest coast to the Hawaiian islands in command of the Butterworth Squadron. Captain Brown landed several vessels on the island; the ones noted are the two sloops Prince Lee Boo and the Jackall.[4]

After landing, he made an agreement with Kahekili II (the chief of the island at that time) that he would offer his military assistance against Kamehameha for use of the harbor. Likewise, Kamehameha requested military assistance and the use of artillery from Captain George Vancouver and in exchange "ceded" the island of Hawaiʻi to Great Britain in February 1794.[citation needed]

The two rival chiefs never met again, as Kahekili II died in mid-1794. At this point, Kahekili's son, Kalanikupule, had control of the island of Oʻahu and his half-brother, Kaʻeokulani, had control of the islands of Kauaʻi (through his wife), Maui, Lanaʻi, and Molokaʻi.

After Kahekili's death, Kaʻeokulani decided to visit Kauaʻi, his home island. In order to accomplish this, he had to travel through the way of Oʻahu. Kalanikupule then set up trenches and earthworks on the windward side of Oʻahu, where Kaʻeokulani's canoes would pass. Both sides fought, but the battle was stopped by Kalanikupule and the two chiefs met to mourn over the death of Kahekili.

Kaʻeokulani then discovered a plot to be thrown overboard by his chiefs on the way to Kauaʻi. To resolve the issue, he proposed war against Kalanikupule. This war was called Kukiʻiahu and lasted from November 16 until December 12, 1794. He ordered his men to make a land march to where Kalanikupule was stationed. In the early part of December 1794, Kaʻeokulani's army was confronted by Kalanikupule's, along with the artillery of Captain Brown's ships. With Kaʻeokulani being outnumbered and outmaneuvered, his forces fled and scattered to the mountains. Nevertheless, Kaʻeokulani's army was destroyed.

After Kaʻeokulani's defeat, a dispute arose with Captain Brown over payment. Brown and several of his men were killed, and Kalanikupule took possession of the Jackal and the Prince Lee Boo, together with all their arms. After 3 weeks of preparation, on January 4, 1795 Kalanikupule set sail for Hawaii with a fleet of canoes and the two ships, intending to make war on Kamehameha.

But the ships' crews recaptured the vessels while they were at anchor off Waikīkī. They sailed for Hawaiʻi where they told Kamehameha all that had happened. They traded Kamehameha all of Kalanikupule's weapons, which had remained in the ships, in return for supplies.[5]

Kalanikupule had received prior warnings of the impending invasion from the chiefs of Maui and Molokaʻi and had begun building several lines of fortifications on Oʻahu. He had already begun buying muskets and cannons from European traders, but had far fewer than Kamehameha. He was also assisted by one of Kamehameha's chiefs, Kaʻiana, who defected before the battle began. Kaʻiana had fallen out of favor with Kamehameha's inner circle and feared that he was being plotted against. On the voyage to Oʻahu, his army split off from the Hawaiian armada and landed on the north side of the island. There, they began cutting notches into the Nuʻuanu mountain ridge, which would serve as gunports for Kalanikupule's cannons.

Kamehameha
Kamehameha I had begun his campaign to unify Hawaii in 1783, but prior to 1795 had only managed to unify the Big Island. However, the civil war on Oʻahu, after Kahekili II's death left that kingdom greatly weakened.

During this time, Kamehameha had been equipping his army with modern muskets and cannon, as well as training his men in their use under direction of British sailor John Young.[6] In February 1795 he assembled the largest army the Hawaiian islands had ever seen, with about 12,000 men and 1,200 war canoes (at this time, the British estimated the entire population of the Hawaiian Islands at less than 300,000; modern anthropologists believe it was closer to one million[citation needed]). Kamehameha initially moved against the southern islands of Maui and Molokaʻi, conquering them in the early spring. Then he invaded Oʻahu.

Battle
The Battle of Nuʻuanu began when Kamehameha's forces landed on the southeastern portion of Oʻahu near Waiʻalae and Waikiki. After spending several days gathering supplies and scouting Kalanikupule's positions, Kamehameha's army advanced westward, encountering Kalanikupule's first line of defense near the Punchbowl Crater. Splitting his army into two, Kamehameha sent one half in a flanking maneuver around the crater and the other straight at Kalanikupule. Pressed from both sides, the Oʻahu forces retreated to Kalanikupule's next line of defense near Laʻimi. While Kamehameha pursued, he secretly detached a portion of his army to clear the surrounding heights of the Nuʻuanu Valley of Kalanikupule's cannons. Kamehameha also brought up his own cannons to shell Laʻimi. During this part of the battle, both Kalanikupule and Kaiana were wounded, Kaiana fatally. With its leadership in chaos, the Oʻahu army slowly fell back north through the Nuʻuanu Valley to the cliffs at Nuʻuanu Pali. Caught between the Hawaiian Army and a 1000-foot drop, over 700 Oʻahu warriors either jumped or were pushed over the edge of the Pali (cliff). In 1898 construction workers working on the Pali road discovered 800 skulls which were believed to be the remains of the warriors that fell to their deaths from the cliff above.[7]

Aftermath

Cliffs of the Koʻolau Range as seen from Nu‘uanu Pali in 1996
Though he escaped the battle, Kalanikupule was later captured. This battle was the climax of Kamehameha's campaign, after this battle his kingdom was for the first time referred to as the Kingdom of Hawaiʻi. The islands were still not united.[8] He had to capture the remaining neighboring islands of Kauaʻi and Niʻihau. First he had to put down an uprising on the Big Island, and then he began his preparations for the conquest of Kauaʻi. However, before this battle could be fought the king Kaumualiʻi of Kauaʻi submitted to Kamehameha, giving him effective control over the Hawaiian Islands.
 
My father was an officer in the Americal division from 70 to 71 in Vietnam. He was located in or near, I don't remember, Chu Lai and was in Charlie company. His main station was LZ Dottie. Saw this video below of Alpha company that was there during the same time.

The other day dad was showing me a report paper he had received written up a Colonel in Vietnam detailing all activities my father had participated in while in Vietnam. Brought back memories for dad, in particular the time when General Abrams came to visit. General Abrams was in charge of military operations in Vietnam. Dad was called to the meeting, and while there to his surprise was asked some hard questions, which made him quite nervous and worried he might be reprimanded. Dad answered best he could and that pleased others in the meeting.

The colonel in Vietnam that wrote the report went on to become a general himself and later a TV commentator for one of the cable news networks. He would always give my father glowing reviews, which dad appreciated.

Chu Lai, Vietnam, Americal division (1970 - 1971) - Filmed by my Father


https://video.search.yahoo.com/sear...=bf5f0e38c6a4b4889822159ae6fc10a8&action=view
 

#OnThisDay in 1305, Wallace was found guilty of treason and sentenced to death.

Wallace was killed using one of the most brutal punishments in the medieval era: he was to be hung, drawn, and quartered. He was dragged naked behind a horse to the place of execution at Smithfield. Wallace was hanged but will have been cut down while still alive. After this his insides were removed then burned, his head cut off and his body divided into quarters.

To warn others away from rebellion, Wallace’s head was dipped in tar and placed on a pike on London Bridge. His four limbs were sent to be displayed in Newcastle, Berwick, Stirling, and Perth. He would never receive a proper Christian burial.

Edward I had hoped to make a statement. There is no doubt Wallace’s death was painful and cruel. Some will have feared meeting the same fate. However, this was not the end of Wallace’s dream. In the years that followed others would rise up to free Scotland.
 
An engraving by Claes Visscher showing Old London Bridge in 1616, with what is now Southwark Cathedral in the foreground. The spiked heads of executed criminals can be seen above the Southwark gatehouse.
The head of William Wallace was the first recorded as appearing, in 1305, starting a long tradition. Other famous heads on pikes included those of Jack Cade in 1450, Thomas More in 1535, Bishop John Fisher in the same year, and Thomas Cromwell in 1540. In 1598, a German visitor to London, Paul Hentzner, counted over 30 heads on the bridge:[20]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Londo...ondon_Bridge_(1616)_by_Claes_Van_Visscher.jpg
 
Do you guys like tanks?

Tank Encyclopedia

https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/

Amazing site one can browse for hours. The info and structure is great, but the real impressive part is all the gosh darn vehicle illustrations. There must be literally hundreds of them, all high quality. Making illustrations for famous tanks like the Tiger, Churchill et cetera is one thing, but going all the way down to obscure WW1-era danish armored cars takes dedication.

Gideon_2_T-edited-e1622146277946.png
 
Do you guys like tanks?

Tank Encyclopedia

https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/

Amazing site one can browse for hours. The info and structure is great, but the real impressive part is all the gosh darn vehicle illustrations. There must be literally hundreds of them, all high quality. Making illustrations for famous tanks like the Tiger, Churchill et cetera is one thing, but going all the way down to obscure WW1-era danish armored cars takes dedication.

Gideon_2_T-edited-e1622146277946.png
This looks like a decent page watched a bit about Rommells Panzers and the Churchill .The tank museam .

 
German 7th Panzer Division on the Russian Front | WW2 HD combat Footage (Remastered)
 
The most FEARED tank of WW2 - the Churchill Crocodile .

The Second World War was a conflict that saw many of history's greatest military vehicles deployed. Many consider the Tiger Tank or the Panther to be the most feared tanks deployed during World War 2, however there was one British vehicle that would instantly strike fear into the hearts of the Wehrmacht or German Army, the Churchill Crocodile. The Churchill may not have been the fastest tank, however it was reliable and could get through pretty much any terrain that it needed to. It was a versatile vehicle, with a powerful weapon that could knock out many of the best enemy vehicles. However with D-Day around the corner, and the ill-fated raid on Dieppe in the mind, General Hobart decided to tweak tanks to make more specialist weapons that could handle a beach landing. Many vehicles were created, however the most notorious has to be the brutal Crocodile. By using a Churchill and mounting a brutal and devastating flamethrower on the front, the Crocodile would become an incredible powerful, brutal and devastating weapon. It would cause so much fear in the enemy, that they would simply just scatter at the sight of the vehicle on the horizon as they would not want the horrific burning death that the Crocodile was capable of inflicting. Because of this modification it was excellent at clearing bunkers and causing horror and terror on the battlefield.
 
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