max holloway has shown again jiu jitsu has major flaws

thanks OP, time for all the ufc champions - including max - to stop training jiu jitsu
 
Alot of martial arts across the globe never really allow their full potential to be displayed due to being: rule and regulation heavy. Muay Thai has a grappling game we never see, and is not practiced anymore because it doesn't help those who are trying to escape poverty by fighting in all the events and tournaments they can. So the full potential of the art is never on display and will eventually be lost if it isnt already, unless it gets partially rescued like Jiu Jitsu and Judo did after their split, when MMA came about, allowing Jiu Jitsu and Judo specialists to round out their game.

Of course, UFC highlighted Gracie Jiu Jitsu first, but we are talking about after the race to be the most complete MMArtist began.

Gracie Jiu Jitsu is supposed to be a complete self defense system, and effective enough of a well rounded martial art that they are supposed to teach you what works and doesn't work in the context of self defense and MMA competition/sparring. Because Gracie Jiu Jitsu, is more like the original jujutsu which is the art where all forms of modern Jiu Jitsu and Judo come from, in that it does/is supposed to teach you how to strike, the striking (Muay Thai & Dirty Boxing) and grappling grind of the clinch game, and how to grapple on the ground, which also includes wrestling influence, not just Jiu Jitsu.

Didn't Royce throw kicks to the knee from Savate like JacksonWink fighters and others do? If it wasn't that Gracie I'm sure it was some other one or maybe more than one. Maybe not just the side kick, he might've thrown oblique kicks too, but I wouldn't blame him if he didn't, you kinda have to see that move work before you think it's worth trying, such a funky kick.

MMA means we should be practicing everything that works, right? We don't practice kneeing grounded opponents in the head anymore, or soccer kicks, or eyepokes unless we are Jon Jones, like we don't practice kicking nuts unless we are Cheick Kongo.

That's because none of those moves (if you want to recognize barbarism as more than simple barbarism) are allowed by our rules.


The soccer kick is only allowed with those new rules on an opponent who only has one glove on the mat, as in getting up and not falling down, right?

Probably not while seating with one arm on the knee or anywhere that isn't on the ground, because if one is seated, then they are counted as a downed opponent or w/e, right?

Regardless, Max Holloway needs to train his Jiu Jitsu some more, he didn't expose Jiu Jitsu as obsolete, everyone needs it and that's why every top fighter is hard to sub and if you think they aren't, you don't know what you are watching. If he had better Jiu Jitsu, he would've had quicker finishes against Aldo when it came time for G&P coffin nails.

You train No-Gi jiujitsu for MMA, and you train it with G&P allowed in order to be able to keep your black belt level ground game strong while under pressure.
 
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propaganda. Even fucking askeren said there are flaws.

Of course there are flaws, bjj is not enough alone, stills every single mma camp has bjj. So I don’t know where the propaganda is at
 
you're an idiot. A wrestling that doesn't know anything about bjj will get sub in under a min. A judo person would easily wreck them all tho.

Not like it didn’t happen before, I guess you missed Royce vs remco, Renzo Ben spikers or even Royce taking on 50 ponds heavier yoshida...
 
The problem with a lot of BJJ practitioners is that the current MMA landscape is saturated with wrestling heavy based fighters.

BJJ is the reason there are so many wrestling based fighters.

Don't want to play BJJ? Learn to wrestle.

Don't want to play wrestling? Learn BJJ.
 
not what imm saying, there are flaws in bjj, and its probably obsolete.
Are you really calling BJJ obsolete?!?! It's the one art that's universally considered a prerequisite to all MMA. The best wrestlers in the world tap to BJJ black belts if they've never studied any bjj. No matter what you're background is, when you enter a MMA gym, you WILL be learning bjj.
 
Everyone trains it. But how useful is it? Most of th3 founding guy A were jiu jitsu guy A made a pretty penny

It’s so useful that people doesn’t get subbed anymore, it’s so use full that a 40 years old unayhletic as my mom demian Maia could wrecked his way to the ww title, beating Quite a few wrestlers on its way, and making the elite fear for their life if the fight touched the ground... there’s how useful it it’s, and unless you’ve had your hard stuck in a bottle for the past 20 years, there’s a shit ton of subs going on, and guess which is the art responsable for those subs...
 
BJJ is the reason there are so many wrestling based fighters.

Don't want to play BJJ? Learn to wrestle.

Don't want to play wrestling? Learn BJJ.
I think it's more down the lines as Folkstyle wrestling is very common in America as a sport rather than anything else. BJJ, boxing, karate, etc. Aren't school sports from middle school to colleg, wrestling is.
 
Pure BJJ guys would be super well served to cross train in wrestling.

They have great ground games, but todays fighters have much evolved TDD.

I often wonder what would happen if we saw a legit Olympic caliber wrestler cross-train in BJJ, and achieve a high level black belt game. That would be seriously scary imo.
imagine if GSP had taken subs seriously. just imagine.
 
FFS pages of this stuff when the reality is that every legit gym with good pros are training MMA specific grappling. Yeah there are breakout sessions with specific coaches but to read these comments you'd think that pro fighters abandon wrestling principles when training bjj or vice versa. Or if they train catch wrestling that grappling fundamentals change.

Guys may have different styles but almost all grappling fundamentals are universal.

If the point of the thread was that the guard pulling "I'm happy to fight you off my back for 15 or 25 minutes" attitude is gone, then yeah sure. But we already knew that right? Even guys from bjj backgrounds immediately look for the switch or to get an underhook when threatened with a takedown. And it's been that way for awhile.
 
I often wonder what would happen if we saw a legit Olympic caliber wrestler cross-train in BJJ, and achieve a high level black belt game. That would be seriously scary imo.

So maybe this guy? (AJ Agazarm)

aj-2.jpg


 
It’s so useful that people doesn’t get subbed anymore, it’s so use full that a 40 years old unayhletic as my mom demian Maia could wrecked his way to the ww title, beating Quite a few wrestlers on its way, and making the elite fear for their life if the fight touched the ground... there’s how useful it it’s, and unless you’ve had your hard stuck in a bottle for the past 20 years, there’s a shit ton of subs going on, and guess which is the art responsable for those subs...
Usman
 
Are you really calling BJJ obsolete?!?! It's the one art that's universally considered a prerequisite to all MMA. The best wrestlers in the world tap to BJJ black belts if they've never studied any bjj. No matter what you're background is, when you enter a MMA gym, you WILL be learning bjj.
Yes I am
 
The question, I think, is not if BJJ should still be a part of a MMA fighter's curriculum, but if it's effective to be a major part of it.
 
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