Loma vs Duran???

The only top guy De Jesus ever finished at Lightweight was Mijares. He also holds a stoppage win over Frazer but that was at Junior Welterweight. Those are the only two top guys he's ever finished in a 63-fight career. Loma is very small at Lightweight where guys like Campbell dwarf him. While they have advantages in size, strength and power he holds significant advantages in speed, cardio, defense, and mobility. If we're talking how he stacks up against natural Lightweight ATGs then I agree but it also applies to any naturally smaller great fighter when pitted against a larger great fighter to some extent or another.

I'm not saying that Lomachenko stacks up poorly against FW ATGs. I think he gives most of them very real trouble and has chances of winning in certain fights, but I don't think he travels up in weight all that well. I don't think he possesses the proper physical abilities coupled with skills to do so. That's not a knock as a very select few in a very old sport do possess said qualities.
 
I'm not saying that Lomachenko stacks up poorly against FW ATGs. I think he gives most of them very real trouble and has chances of winning in certain fights, but I don't think he travels up in weight all that well. I don't think he possesses the proper physical abilities coupled with skills to do so. That's not a knock as a very select few in a very old sport do possess said qualities.

It's a pity he didn't rack a bunch of great wins at FW and SFW and is now stuck in a division in which he's undersized, and bound to get himself in trouble when he slows down.
 
I'm not saying that Lomachenko stacks up poorly against FW ATGs. I think he gives most of them very real trouble and has chances of winning in certain fights, but I don't think he travels up in weight all that well. I don't think he possesses the proper physical abilities coupled with skills to do so. That's not a knock as a very select few in a very old sport do possess said qualities.
I think he's likely maxed out at Lightweight but we've only seen him fight there 4 times and he's added a little more mass. As he ages he could very well adopt a more professional style with a defensive-minded approach. He's mentioned Mikey before specifically at 140 even though he's closer in size to a natural Lightweight. As many fighters get older the more crafty ones often out of necessity prioritize defense more and sit back to potshot and counter. He'd still need enough durability and power to discourage the top guys at Junior Welter but it isn't out of the realm of possibility that he has both.

While it's not the pro game it's worth noting that he had success competing against some of the very best boxers in the world well above his natural weight in the amateurs at Light Welterweight (141 pounds) when he was only a natural Featherweight (125 pounds). He started his amateur career at Junior Strawweight (101 pounds) and climbed as high as Light Welterweight which is a 40 pound difference. I think too many people tend to forget that he was already mid-twenties when he got his start in the pros.
 
I think he's likely maxed out at Lightweight but we've only seen him fight there 4 times and he's added a little more mass. As he ages he could very well adopt a more professional style with a defensive-minded approach. He's mentioned Mikey before specifically at 140 even though he's closer in size to a natural Lightweight. As many fighters get older the more crafty ones often out of necessity prioritize defense more and sit back to potshot and counter. He'd still need enough durability and power to discourage the top guys at Junior Welter but it isn't out of the realm of possibility that he has both.

While it's not the pro game it's worth noting that he had success competing against some of the very best boxers in the world well above his natural weight in the amateurs at Light Welterweight (141 pounds) when he was only a natural Featherweight (125 pounds). He started his amateur career at Junior Strawweight (101 pounds) and climbed as high as Light Welterweight which is a 40 pound difference. I think too many people tend to forget that he was already mid-twenties when he got his start in the pros.
That's how I feel at this point. He has already gone up quite a ways in weight, and has looked more human as a result. I personally believe the way he fights these bigger men more or less is a stylistic adjustment and he feels a need to stand his ground more to earn respect and keep larger opponents honest. He can't toy with bigger men as much, and has to tap into the inner dog more and competitor side of himself, and I actually appreciate his willingness to climb in weight to push himself further because like you said, he's maxed out and if he goes higher up, it only becomes more dangerous for him. He's also getting older, we ALL slow down eventually. Even if he stays 135 or even ventures back to 130 the possibility of slowing down is looming and waiting. If he fought Berchelt, Davis, Haney, Lopez, Stevenson today, I actually think he beats all their asses barring maybe an ugly fight with Berchelt maybe, but in the next few yrs those guys are gonna peak and he's gonna have to tap deep down to hang tough with any of them, which he may still very well do. It will be very interesting to see if Loma can survive the guys waiting for him to fall off, you know they aren't getting in there with him until.he does, but maybe that's how he'll cement his resume and prove his greatness.

Oh, and if he meets Mikey at 140, he wins that, because I think Mikey really sees Loma in his dreams pulling smoke and mirrors on his ass to a comfy UD... Mikey should be first one to want fight with Loma, and he just seems to avoid it and I think we all know why.
 
the one thing loma truly impresses me with, is his ability to adapt and over come adversity. the way he adjusted his game against gary russel when he realised that russel was too fast for him (walked him down and stood on the inside (cough) countering) or the way he started hunting linares's body to get the finish, when linares was giving him trouble was really impressive. the guy has a heart and a mind for boxing. all that being said i wouldn't favour him to beat duran, and would put the odds at about 3-1 against him.
I wouldn't bet against Duran. Too big, too tough and rough. But I just want to see the strategy that Loma would come up with. Loma and his father have shown a very pronounced ability to implement a game plan to a tee. They fell short against Salido because they never imagined such a situation could exist.
 
He was a full-sized LW who peaked very high and fell very abruptly, for obvious reasons. He's appreciably better and a bigger hitter than any LW Lomachenko fought. It was silly of me to bring up who would be favoured in terms of betting odds between men who existed on the earth at the same time for a year or maybe two, but De Jesus would be a much more interesting proposition than anyone Lomachenko has fought to date, and it's completely reasonable to think he could beat a guy like Lomachenko. Lomachenko is a rather small LW, and he's not the kind of guy with the abilities to overcome considerable size and strength disadvantages against guys who are properly elite, at least, that's my opinion.

At his best weightclass (in my mind likely FW even if he'd be a bit tested to make it at his age now), he'd give most guys, even ATGs, all kinds of fits, but LW is a different kind of beast.
IMO Loma's best weight class was SFW. He had his Salido experience and seemed much more comfortable with his style at that point. I remember watching his KO of Martinez and that was the first time I was truly impressed with him.
 
durán catches him by the 5th or 6th. hands are too fast, he applied great pressure with wonderful footwork when necessary, massive power. i can’t think of anything loma does better than durán other than maybe head movement.
 
durán catches him by the 5th or 6th. hands are too fast, he applied great pressure with wonderful footwork when necessary, massive power. i can’t think of anything loma does better than durán other than maybe head movement.
Faster feet and better stamina. And Loma would never do No Mas. Loma will fight to the bitter end. He's boxed nearly a whole fight with a dislocated shoulder, fought another a busted hand, and took over 100 low blows in another. Loma makes other fighters quit just like Leonard did to Duran.
 
Faster feet and better stamina. And Loma would never do No Mas. Loma will fight to the bitter end. He's boxed nearly a whole fight with a dislocated shoulder, fought another a busted hand, and took over 100 low blows in another. Loma makes other fighters quit just like Leonard did to Duran.
the dude has a heart. his style seems to be adjusting to the pro game a bit also. i just think it's a bit too little, too late. i would have liked to have seen him make the transition into the pro's a few years earlier. maybe then he would have been in contention for all time great status.
 
Faster feet and better stamina. And Loma would never do No Mas. Loma will fight to the bitter end. He's boxed nearly a whole fight with a dislocated shoulder, fought another a busted hand, and took over 100 low blows in another. Loma makes other fighters quit just like Leonard did to Duran.
haha, ‘over 100’!

sounds so legit when you put it that way
 
Faster feet and better stamina. And Loma would never do No Mas. Loma will fight to the bitter end. He's boxed nearly a whole fight with a dislocated shoulder, fought another a busted hand, and took over 100 low blows in another. Loma makes other fighters quit just like Leonard did to Duran.
Loma would never fight anyone like Leonard either.
 
the dude has a heart. his style seems to be adjusting to the pro game a bit also. i just think it's a bit too little, too late. i would have liked to have seen him make the transition into the pro's a few years earlier. maybe then he would have been in contention for all time great status.
Loma could age very well, we haven't seen him sit back and not rush, he's always been 100 miles per hour offense, but he's shown some incredible speed and defensive skills like against GRJ. He has fast feet today and is a 12 rd fighter despite fighting at an insane tempo... He might be able to adjust to a much more methodical style as time goes on. I just think with his power he'd be better suited staying at LW or even at 130 again. I think he will be a different fighter in 3-4 yrs. But he's so used to one speed, Maybe not. Dude has a lot of tools, and I'd like to see him start using them and taking his foot off the gas a little bit.
 
considering that a lot of people consider modern boxers to be more evolved (and loma being some kind of culmination of modern boxing) i was interested in what people thought loma chances would have been against duran.

I'm not gonna dig too deep into this.

Undersized at LW Loma when asked about crawford: "I'm too small for welterweight, sorry to the fans but wont happen"

Meanwhile Duran: "Limme win a world title at middleweight at age 37 after 93 pro fights and get back to you on that"


Faster feet and better stamina. And Loma would never do No Mas. Loma will fight to the bitter end. He's boxed nearly a whole fight with a dislocated shoulder, fought another a busted hand, and took over 100 low blows in another. Loma makes other fighters quit just like Leonard did to Duran.
Pfft, "would never do a no mas" dumbest shit to critique Duran that only noobs do. I expected better from u.

When was the last time Loma fought a WW champ so we compare how he handles it to Duran's umm.. oh he didn't.

Loma would get slaughtered at WW worse than Mikey Garcia did. Loma is listed with a reach 2 and a half inches smaller than Mikey.
 
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Duran wrecks him. Come on, this is the guy who couldn't beat Salido vs one of the roughest, toughest lightweights to ever live.
I completely agree - Salido was first thing that came in mind for me
 
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