News Lima vs. Mousasi on Oct 29

[careto]

Yeah, the Cotton camp backed out and Rosta saw it as a cowardly move but...it was absolutely the right move, and as a camp you should take care of your fighters like that.

I really hope they don't match Eblen and Vanderford if Vanderford takes this next fight. That's what I'd be more afraid of. I think if they stick to their gameplans, both could probably push the top of the division. Vanderford was trying too hard to strike with Bozinyan in the last fight, so he didn't dominate until round 3. But he had Bonzinyan pretty dazed and bloodied in the 3rd round, if he went out and did that in the first round he probably finishes late first or early second. And Eblen also said in post-fight that he wanted to strike more. These guys aren't strikers, either in terms of base or by the way they've developed, some wrestlers pick up striking easily but these two didn't and they should absolutely keep working on that but they shouldn't try too hard to be something they're not. That said, behind Gegard, the division really doesn't have a lot going for it. Especially after seeing what Salter was able to do to Van Steenis. Behind Mousasi there's maybe Anatoly Tokov, he's the 2nd biggest threat, but he's overseas. Salter always has a chance for a sub against Vanderford or Eblen but that's about it, they're better wrestlers, they might even be better on the feet. But I think Mousasi wants him. If Van Steenis couldn't stop Salter from playing his game, he probably can't stop Vanderford or Eblen. But he's also overseas. You could definitely feed one of them Kapel but he broke his hand in the last fight. Vanderford was booked for Madrid, you could definitely still make that fight. And Tony Johnson would be a decent fight for Eblen, he would be a terrible fight if Eblen wants to stand.

For Rosta, if they could still get that Petroski fight that might be nice. You probably want him to get his 5th fight down before he starts fighting world beaters.

Eblen and Vanderford seem to train out of ATT in Florida, so I doubt they will fight each other, much less at this point of their careers. Vanderford is another grappling beast in the MW division that people should be watching out for. Save for Mousasi and van Steenis (who are training partners) mostly the entire MW division is filled with grappling beasts, I think the division needs a couple of strikers. Although, I understand the division worldwide is lacking with some real talent lately. TBH I believe Tokov is the biggest threat to Mousasi, I actually believe Tokov will lbe MW champ by 2021. Bellator has a pretty decent MW division, considering MW is a bit lacking worldwide.
The roster includes: Gegard Mousasi, John Salter, Anatoly Tokov, Costello van Steenis, Mike Shipman, Fabian Edwards, Austin Vanderford, Fabio Aguiar, Khalid Murtazaliev, Will Fleury and great prospects in Johnny Eblen, Taylor Johnson, Norbert Novenyi, Dalton Rosta, Romero Cotton and Jordan Newman.
Noventy and Rosta being the best prospects in the division IMO.

 

[CorninginChristianburg]

Eblen and Vanderford seem to train out of ATT in Florida, so I doubt they will fight each other, much less at this point of their careers. Vanderford is another grappling beast in the MW division that people should be watching out for. Save for Mousasi and van Steenis (who are training partners) mostly the entire MW division is filled with grappling beasts, I think the division needs a couple of strikers. Although, I understand the division worldwide is lacking with some real talent lately. TBH I believe Tokov is the biggest threat to Mousasi, I actually believe Tokov will lbe MW champ by 2021. Bellator has a pretty decent MW division, considering MW is a bit lacking worldwide.
The roster includes: Gegard Mousasi, John Salter, Anatoly Tokov, Costello van Steenis, Mike Shipman, Fabian Edwards, Austin Vanderford, Fabio Aguiar, Khalid Murtazaliev, Will Fleury and great prospects in Johnny Eblen, Taylor Johnson, Norbert Novenyi, Dalton Rosta, Romero Cotton and Jordan Newman.
Noventy and Rosta being the best prospects in the division IMO.

That's true. I think he used to train up in portland or regularly trains there but came to ATT for camps? I hope they don't of course.

Mmh, yeah, MW worldwide is pretty thin. I also think Tokov can take down Mousasi. I realize I phrased things really weird, he's the 2nd biggest threat in the division with Mousasi being the first, not the 2nd biggest threat to Mousasi. I think Eblen, Vanderford, and maybe even Johnson are better than any of the Euros. Schengen zone MMA in general hasn't done well recently between MVP losing and Van Steenis losing. I don't think they're highly competitive with Russia or American MMA at this point. Taylor Johnson's only loss was to Andre Muniz, who was 17-4 coming in with a DCS win the prior year too and since Muniz is 2-0 in the UFC. And now Eblen, and he beat Ruth in between. So he's quietly very good. Aguiar may be actually very good but he's a bit unknown at the moment, Murtazaliev is good but we will have to see when he fights because of COVID. I'm not sure Salter is actually that amazing, he's taken on 3 fighters in a row who were significantly worse wrestlers than him. He's certainly not bad, he's had quality wins and is a good fighter, but as a #1 or #2 contender I find him a bit underwhelming and is way more likely to be caught from behind soon than win a belt soon. Rosta is a very exciting prospect, I think he'll have one more fight before he goes next level. I don't think he's ready to fight the more experienced guys right now.

 

[Pitbull95]

I'm very confused what Bellator is trying to do. Dalton Rosta said that he had 2 fights turned down in his post-fight interviews. The first was Andre Petroski. That makes sense, a good, big step up for Rosta. The second was Romero Cotton. What? Why? I wonder if they're trying to trim the roster. Why does one of Rosta or Cotton need to pick up an L right now? It's so early in both their careers, one was 3-0 at the time the other was 4-0. Maybe they're both coming to the end of contracts and Bellator wants to drive down price? I know Rosta is, not sure about Cotton. It's ridiculous, they're both talented young fighters, they shouldn't be fighting each other. Perhaps, if they're looking to trim, they will give Gwerder to Cotton next, and if Gwerder takes another L, he gets the axe. No matter what, Romero Cotton and Jordan Newman need to look to fight very soon, or the organization may move on from them. Rosta is a beast, he may have a bit longer of a layoff for contract negotiations but hopefully he fights soon again because he could rise very fast.

The Eblen fight was amazing. What, did he get 15 mat returns? Maybe more? It was so beautiful to watch. He ragdolled Johnson around the cage. But for me it also highlights how weak Ruth is. And by weak, I mean in terms of physical strength, not skill. I thought he looked small vs. Gracie, and had a hard time really winning battles for position with Gracie, who looked visibly bigger even at 170. And then he looked smaller than Amosov, and looked like he was having a rough time matching the strength of Amosov. Then he moved up to 185, for no apparent reason because he already looked small at 170. And there, albeit he got caught in a trap a bit, but he still couldn't fight for position with Johnson. And Johnson is not a small heavyweight. Johnson is a good grappler, good wrestler in his own right, I believe formerly D1 then transferred and became an NAIA all american. Contender series headliner, subbed Ed Ruth. Eblen threw him around for 15 minutes like he was a toy. I think the fact that he was able to do that...Ruth has absolutely no business at middleweight. He should stay in welterweight, and even there I think his body shape disadvantages him. He has a distinctly V-shaped body, which looks nice, girls find it attractive, but it's not functionally the best configuration. I don't think he is behind Johnson in skill, but he does not have Johnson's strength, and Johnson doesn't have Eblen's strength. Ruth needs to move back down. But Eblen...what a beast.

Cody Law got the job done. Your first pro fight, also facing a rookie, if you're the blue chip people say you are, you better take care of business, and he did. It'll be a solid 2 or 3 more fights before he starts to face some real challenges. And Law should be aiming for a fast turnaround. When you're a veteran who's already made it to UFC stardom, then you can fight once a year. If you're a rookie trying to make it, you gotta fight once every couple of months, especially that this fight was not very taxing. If he could get in one more fight before New Years that would be good.

I actually disagree, I think it's a good idea to match some of the newer younger guys up already now so that they can get the chance to prove themselfes, people like Timothy Johnson, Minakov, Tyrell Fortune have all earned their spot, while Rosta is good he still has to prove that in the cage, I also think you are overestimating how many HW's that are freely walking around to fight who are at the same time at a decent level. In a coronasituation we just kinda gotta accept the fights we get, I for one can easily cut Rich Chou and the rest of the bellator matchmaking team some slack.

Also saying that Ed Ruth doesn't have natural strenght seems kinda irrelevant, the truth is just that Ed wasn't as prepared for the leg lock, you gotta remember the fact that Dean Lister is his coach.

 

[CorninginChristianburg]

I actually disagree, I think it's a good idea to match some of the newer younger guys up already now so that they can get the chance to prove themselfes, people like Timothy Johnson, Minakov, Tyrell Fortune have all earned their spot, while Rosta is good he still has to prove that in the cage, I also think you are overestimating how many HW's that are freely walking around to fight who are at the same time at a decent level. In a coronasituation we just kinda gotta accept the fights we get, I for one can easily cut Rich Chou and the rest of the bellator matchmaking team some slack.

Also saying that Ed Ruth doesn't have natural strenght seems kinda irrelevant, the truth is just that Ed wasn't as prepared for the leg lock, you gotta remember the fact that Dean Lister is his coach.

I'm a bit confused because Rosta isn't a heavyweight...Heavyweights have to get put on the accelerated track because the division is always very thin. So Fortune had to start fighting real opponents very quickly.

I don't generally mind the matchmaking that much. I dislike some matches that I think put fighters in a place where they have to lose unnecessarily. But like Gwerder Rosta turned out to be a perfect fight, a perfect step up for Rosta, and Petroski would have been as well. And if they bring in a vet with like 10 fights, maybe a 7-3 record, that's cool too. It's only specifically the Cotton fight, matching up two undefeated fighters early in their careers, that I don't think is a good idea. If they met further down the line like Amosov-Storley, that would be way more hype.

Well despite Ruth actually being relatively slippery, they hit the ground at 15 seconds and Johnson was able to transition from position to position relatively easily for 45 seconds before the sub. I mean, maybe Ruth has never learned to defend a leg lock before. He's still a purple belt I suppose.

 

[Pitbull95]

I'm a bit confused because Rosta isn't a heavyweight...Heavyweights have to get put on the accelerated track because the division is always very thin. So Fortune had to start fighting real opponents very quickly.

I don't generally mind the matchmaking that much. I dislike some matches that I think put fighters in a place where they have to lose unnecessarily. But like Gwerder Rosta turned out to be a perfect fight, a perfect step up for Rosta, and Petroski would have been as well. And if they bring in a vet with like 10 fights, maybe a 7-3 record, that's cool too. It's only specifically the Cotton fight, matching up two undefeated fighters early in their careers, that I don't think is a good idea. If they met further down the line like Amosov-Storley, that would be way more hype.

Well despite Ruth actually being relatively slippery, they hit the ground at 15 seconds and Johnson was able to transition from position to position relatively easily for 45 seconds before the sub. I mean, maybe Ruth has never learned to defend a leg lock before. He's still a purple belt I suppose.

My mistake Obviously hes a natural LHW who fought at MW (Right? I mean Ty is usually MW), LHW is kinda a division that's pretty often forgotten. I actually knew he wasn't HW, but I forgot when i thought about how swole he is.

Well I guess I got nothing to say in terms of that argument anymore : ).

And in regards to Ruth, that is true, which is why there is a difference in grappling and wrestling, even though wrestlers often think they can still dominate most grapplers, things like leg locks are just not something you experience to use offensively or defend against in neither greco or freestyle wrestling.

 

[CorninginChristianburg]

My mistake Obviously hes a natural LHW who fought at MW (Right? I mean Ty is usually MW), LHW is kinda a division that's pretty often forgotten. I actually knew he wasn't HW, but I forgot when i thought about how swole he is.

Well I guess I got nothing to say in terms of that argument anymore : ).

Yeah, his last 2 fights have been at MW, he feels like this is his division. He is above average size (clearly) in this division, he would be average or below average sized at LHW.

And in regards to Ruth, that is true, which is why there is a difference in grappling and wrestling, even though wrestlers often think they can still dominate most grapplers, things like leg locks are just not something you experience to use offensively or defend against in neither greco or freestyle wrestling.

Yeah, I mean leg locks are a weird thing so you might have to carve out an exception due to them. They're a bit like spinning kicks and flying knees in that you more of get caught.

That said, the way I see it is that you cannot possibly prepare for every submission that your opponent might know. You have to be able to control position and just fight to positions where you're less vulnerable. MMA fighters as a whole tend to not be very good at jiu jitsu. I think the median fighter in the UFC or Bellator is probably a blue or purple belt because most often they either transition from wrestling or transition from boxing/kickboxing or they just pick up MMA really late in general. And they go to these gyms were they train jiu jitsu every 3rd day or so (1 day wrestling, striking, jiu jitsu). Johnson is like that, Eblen is like that, Ruth even is like that. Obviously...one way to not get in trouble is just to not let the fight get to the ground. But another way is to be in control on the ground. Leg locks are definitely like a rarer sub that fighters are less adept at defending. But Johnson is a wrestler who is probably a worse jiu jitsu artist than Ruth in general. It's part the cheekiness of leg locks for sure. But Ruth, whether it be because he wasn't stronger than his opponent or because he had no clue what to do with leg locks, didn't defend it particularly well.

 

[careto]

That's true. I think he used to train up in portland or regularly trains there but came to ATT for camps? I hope they don't of course.

Mmh, yeah, MW worldwide is pretty thin. I also think Tokov can take down Mousasi. I realize I phrased things really weird, he's the 2nd biggest threat in the division with Mousasi being the first, not the 2nd biggest threat to Mousasi. I think Eblen, Vanderford, and maybe even Johnson are better than any of the Euros. Schengen zone MMA in general hasn't done well recently between MVP losing and Van Steenis losing. I don't think they're highly competitive with Russia or American MMA at this point. Taylor Johnson's only loss was to Andre Muniz, who was 17-4 coming in with a DCS win the prior year too and since Muniz is 2-0 in the UFC. And now Eblen, and he beat Ruth in between. So he's quietly very good. Aguiar may be actually very good but he's a bit unknown at the moment, Murtazaliev is good but we will have to see when he fights because of COVID. I'm not sure Salter is actually that amazing, he's taken on 3 fighters in a row who were significantly worse wrestlers than him. He's certainly not bad, he's had quality wins and is a good fighter, but as a #1 or #2 contender I find him a bit underwhelming and is way more likely to be caught from behind soon than win a belt soon. Rosta is a very exciting prospect, I think he'll have one more fight before he goes next level. I don't think he's ready to fight the more experienced guys right now.

Mousasi seems pretty sure Salter is next and Im OK with Salter getting the next title shot because its been long overdue. Plus, he has a nice winning streak going in. They can build up Tokov with a title eliminator and make him next for the title. I think Tokov will beat Mousasi in 2021 to become the MW champ.

 

[Reb]

Mousasi vs Salter... I am not so hyped for this fight. Salter fought Mousasi's trainingspartner Costello van Steenis and hardly won. Van Steenis destroyed him in the stand up. Mousasi will KO him.

 

[careto]

Mousasi vs Salter... I am not so hyped for this fight. Salter fought Mousasi's trainingspartner Costello van Steenis and hardly won. Van Steenis destroyed him in the stand up. Mousasi will KO him.

I think it gives time for Mousasi to cement himself as the MW king before a true test against Tokov. Tokov should be a fight away from title contention and he will present a real test for Mousasi, more than Lima. I doubt Mousasi is able to cruise to a W against Tokov who is a freaking massive MW and very well rounded.

 

[CorninginChristianburg]

Mousasi seems pretty sure Salter is next and Im OK with Salter getting the next title shot because its been long overdue. Plus, he has a nice winning streak going in. They can build up Tokov with a title eliminator and make him next for the title. I think Tokov will beat Mousasi in 2021 to become the MW champ.

For sure. I think he earned it when he upset Van Steenis at the least. But there's no question that Tokov is the real #1 contender, whether Salter is more of the placeholder contender, as much as I like him.

 

[careto]

Is it me or Hommasi has looked freaking phenomenal in his last 2 fights. I did not have much stock in him before but these last 2 fights I think have cemented him easily in the top 15 or maybe even fringe top 10. I would really like to see him fight Paul Daley, which they were scheduled to fight before, or someone like J. Jackson or Koreshkov.

 

[careto]

For sure. I think he earned it when he upset Van Steenis at the least. But there's no question that Tokov is the real #1 contender, whether Salter is more of the placeholder contender, as much as I like him.

Yes, Mousasi will have his hands full after John Salter, every other contender in the Bellator MW division are heavy heavy grapplers (Mousasi's kryptonite). Tokov and Vanderford should be following Salter, and coming strong for in the next few years Johnny Eblen, Norbert Novenyi, Dalton Rosta, and Romero Cotton.