Elections Leftwing commentator Kim Iversen explains why she likes Ron DeSantis

[lilelvis]

Personally, I think being a fascist today is pretty insane.

Yeah, his ultra-nationalism and advocating for government control of corporate industry is off the charts.. I heard he hates the gays, too.
The best memes write themselves..

 

[Jack V Savage]

That's the thing. Why engage with someone so deranged they would call Greenwald a Fascist. Then follow it up with word salads essentially saying nothing of substance. Then following that with everyone is an idiot or liar.

A word salad? I pointed out that he came to prominence defending Matthew Hale. He has been cheerleading for Putin. He openly defends Carlson and less openly defends Trump.

 

[giusti825]

Dave Rubin identifies as a conservative libertarian who openly shilled for Trump and you're denying that he's a right winger? At this point it seems you guys think there are no such thing as right wingers.

Dave Rubin is a grifter. He is going to say whatever he thinks will make him the most money. He was with TYT and pretended to be a progressive until they wouldn't give him a pay raise for a once a week show. Then, he decided to be a conservative because that was what gets the most clicks on youtube. He is possibly the least principled actor in new media space. I honestly have no idea what he actually believes.

She's so consistent with her principles like being pro-choice that she...voted for the pro-life party? Huh? And you guys think its weird for us to call someone like that, who votes GOP down the line, a right winger? What does make someone a right winger?

Right-wing and Left-wing represent political ideologies that don't directly line up with the views of either political party in the United States. The two major parties in the United States are both right wing parties. They both endorse capitalist platforms and both take bribes from the corporate class and do the bidding of the 1%.

Left-wing ideology is about flattening social hierarchies. I would argue that being pro-censorship is the most egregious possible violation of that principle, as it will be the private companies, acting at the behest of the state that will decide what people are allowed to say. Censorship by proxy is still censorship, and it still only strengthens social hierarchies.

Neither political party has any principles and will change their views on a dime at the behest of their donors. Biden just privatized Medicare. The "defund the police" crowd decided to give the capitol police an extra $2B and turn them into a domestic surveillance and intelligence organization. Biden didn't fulfill a single campaign promise nor did anyone paying attention actually expect him to.

There is no left-wing party in this country.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Right-wing and Left-wing represent political ideologies that don't directly line up with the views of either political party in the United States. The two major parties in the United States are both right wing parties. They both endorse capitalist platforms and both take bribes from the corporate class and do the bidding of the 1%.

Left-wing ideology is about flattening social hierarchies. I would argue that being pro-censorship is the most egregious possible violation of that principle, as it will be the private companies, acting at the behest of the state that will decide what people are allowed to say. Censorship by proxy is still censorship, and it still only strengthens social hierarchies.

Neither political party has any principles and will change their views on a dime at the behest of their donors. Biden just privatized Medicare. The "defund the police" crowd decided to give the capitol police an extra $2B and turn them into a domestic surveillance and intelligence organization. Biden didn't fulfill a single campaign promise nor did anyone paying attention actually expect him to.

There is no left-wing party in this country.

Again, more "b-both sides!" nonsense. Anyone who is a genuine leftist can see that the Democrat party is to the left of the GOP on numerous issues. Are they as left as the Labour parties you see across Europe? No but their Liberal parties aren't as right wing as the GOP is either.

Fact is it makes zero sense for a leftist to vote GOP down the line, especially if you support something like abortion which Iversen claims to. If someone is voting for GOP down the line I think its more than fair to assume they're right wing.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Again, more "b-both sides!" nonsense. Anyone who is a genuine leftist can see that the Democrat party is to the left of the GOP on numerous issues. Are they as left as the Labour parties you see across Europe? No but their Liberal parties aren't as right wing as the GOP is either.

Fact is it makes zero sense for a leftist to vote GOP down the line, especially if you support something like abortion which Iversen claims to. If someone is voting for GOP down the line I think its more than fair to assume they're right wing.

It's also a myth that the Democratic Party is to the right of most mainstream left parties in Europe. A lot of leftists have this idea of Europe as some kind of leftist paradise.

 

[Islam Imamate]

It's also a myth that the Democratic Party is to the right of most mainstream left parties in Europe. A lot of leftists have this idea of Europe as some kind of leftist paradise.

Well its always been my impression. Not that I think the Dems are some far right party but we're still fighting tooth and nail for things like public healthcare which parties in Europe take for granted.

 

[giusti825]

Again, more "b-both sides!" nonsense. Anyone who is a genuine leftist can see that the Democrat party is to the left of the GOP on numerous issues. Are they as left as the Labour parties you see across Europe? No but their Liberal parties aren't as right wing as the GOP is either.

Fact is it makes zero sense for a leftist to vote GOP down the line, especially if you support something like abortion which Iversen claims to. If someone is voting for GOP down the line I think its more than fair to assume they're right wing.

Dude. The democrats have a democratically controlled presidency, house, and senate. Clinton said he would codify Roe when the democrats had control, he didn't (but he did pass the crime bill). When Obama was campaigning, he said he would "codify Roe on day 1;" he didn't. Obama had a supermajority in the Senate and after the election he said "codifying Roe is not my top legislative priority." The democrats can codify Roe right now, ffs. They don't actually care about a woman's right to choose. They just feel like they can use it as a wedge issue to scare women into voting democrat. They have no principles and try to use fear for political strategy.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Dude. The democrats have a democratically controlled presidency, house, and senate. Clinton said he would codify Roe when the democrats had control, he didn't (but he did pass the crime bill). When Obama was campaigning, he said he would "codify Roe on day 1;" he didn't. Obama had a supermajority in the Senate and after the election he said "codifying Roe is not my top legislative priority." The democrats can codify Roe right now, ffs. They don't actually care about a woman's right to choose. They just feel like they can use it as a wedge issue to scare women into voting democrat. They have no principles and try to use fear for political strategy.

Well why would they have to codify Roe? If both parties are the same there was no need for that right? Oh wait, the GOP is in fact vehemently pro-life and worked tirelessly to overturn Roe. Almost like both parties aren't the same, weird how that is.

 

[giusti825]

Well why would they have to codify Roe? If both parties are the same there was no need for that right? Oh wait, the GOP is in fact vehemently pro-life and worked tirelessly to overturn Roe. Almost like both parties aren't the same, weird how that is.

On this issue there is no practical difference. Neither of the parties actually cares to legislatively protect a woman's right to choose as evidenced by decades of history. The difference is that one side lies to your face about it.

The democrat leadership are actively backing pro-life candidates over pro-choice candidates in numerous primary elections around the country right now.

 

[Islam Imamate]

On this issue there is no practical difference. Neither of the parties actually cares to legislatively protect a woman's right to choose as evidenced by decades of history. The difference is that one side lies to your face about it.

The democrat leadership are actively backing pro-life candidates over pro-choice candidates in numerous primary elections around the country right now.

Hmm good point, I guess that's why Dem controlled Cali and NY have state amendments enshrining the constitutional right to abortion while GOP controlled states like Texas ban abortion at six weeks. Practically the same policy approach.

 

[giusti825]

Hmm good point, I guess that's why Dem controlled Cali and NY have state amendments enshrining the constitutional right to abortion while GOP controlled states like Texas ban abortion at six weeks. Practically the same policy approach.

Local and state elections are an entirely different issue, but at the federal level, no matter what party is in power, we will generally get the same policy outcomes as there are billions of dollars targeting 537 politicians and a few hundred beurocrats. What the corporatocracy wants, the corporatocracy gets. None of this will change as long as bribery, in the form of 'donations' is still legal.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Local and state elections are an entirely different issue, but at the federal level, no matter what party is in power, we will generally get the same policy outcomes as there are billions of dollars targeting 537 politicians and a few hundred beurocrats. What the corporatocracy wants, the corporatocracy gets. None of this will change as long as bribery, in the form of 'donations' is still legal.

Its very clear that we don't get the same exact policy from both parties. The GOP was pushing SCOTUS judges that would overturn Roe while Dems were doing the opposite and that's just on the abortion issue. None of the Justices that voted to overturn Roe were appointed by Dems, that's not an accident.

Sad thing is this low info analysis obscures the few areas where there is a rough bipartisan consensus which is worthy of criticism like the bipartisan foreign policy consensus.

 

[giusti825]

Its very clear that we don't get the same exact policy from both parties. The GOP was pushing SCOTUS judges that would overturn Roe while Dems were doing the opposite and that's just on the abortion issue. None of the Justices that voted to overturn Roe were appointed by Dems, that's not an accident.

The Democrats had 3 previous opportunities AND an opportunity RIGHT NOW (at least until November) to codify Roe. If they are as pro-choice as you contend, they would do it. They will choose not to because they believe using the fear of loss of rights will push women to vote democrat in November. It will not make a difference, because Biden fulfilled NONE of his campaign promises because he doesn't actually care about any of the issues he campaigned on.

The democrats will lose in November and then try to push a bill to codify Roe and blame the Republicans for voting it down. Its the democrat playbook from the Obama presidency: Do little to nothing while your party has power, then lose the power for doing nothing and spend the next 6 years calling the republicans obstructionists so you can spend the rest of the presidency doing a whole lot more nothing.

What you seem to be caught up on is campaign promises and political rhetoric. I focus on voting records and the actions politicians actually take while in power.

Ill give you this: The democrats sure do spend a whole lot of time saying that they are pro-choice, but when it comes to taking the action necessary to legislate that choice, they don't actually do anything.

Sad thing is this low info analysis obscures the few areas where there is a rough bipartisan consensus which is worthy of criticism like the bipartisan foreign policy consensus.

Low-info? I gave you the campaign positions and the actual governance of at least 3 different presidential administrations. That covers 20 years of potential federal political policy.

The bipartisan consensus on war and imperialism is both the biggest example and the inevitable result of the rampant bribery corrupting DC. I'd bet at least $1B of the $54B we just "sent to Ukraine" ends up back in the campaign coffers of both parties. I'd also be willing to bet at least 3/4 of that money never leaves the United States; it just goes to our weapons manufacturers so they could keep sending weapons that the Russians will blow up or confiscate in a war the Ukranians have no hope of winning.

Why'd we leave our weapons in Afghanistan? So we could buy replacements.
Why do we send Ukraine just enough weapons so they won't make a strategic difference in the outcome? To drag the war out as long as possible so we can keep buying more and more from the nations top campaign financiers: the weapons industry.

 

[SBJJ]

A word salad? I pointed out that he came to prominence defending Matthew Hale. He has been cheerleading for Putin. He openly defends Carlson and less openly defends Trump.

And he has been right. Some of us warned you partisan drones that this war and the Russian sanctions would hurt our country immensely. Drones like you called us Putin Bots.

We were right. You were wrong.
Russia is recording record revenues while we are entering a recession.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Well its always been my impression. Not that I think the Dems are some far right party but we're still fighting tooth and nail for things like public healthcare which parties in Europe take for granted.

That's more about the GOP being more extreme on that stuff and path dependence.

 

[Jack V Savage]

And he has been right. Some of us warned you partisan drones that this war and the Russian sanctions would hurt our country immensely. Drones like you called us Putin Bots.

We were right. You were wrong.
Russia is recording record revenues while we are entering a recession.

Huh? We had off the charts growth last year, and Russia's economy is in shambles. And anyway, what do you call people who cheerlead for ethnonationalist dictators while opposing democracy and liberalism at home? I think it would be more honorable (still contemptible, though) if you guys would just state your views honestly and defend them.

 

[Day Drinking]

Yet another business the Federal Government shouldn't be involved in. It's a tough market in Florida. Good News: More underwriters are coming in, for instance, Allstate started underwriting their own policies in Florida earlier this year. Before you bash Desantis: https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/florida/articles/2022-05-26/florida-gov-desantis-signs-property-insurance-legislation#:~:text=Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis has signed into a,| May 26, 2022, at 6:47 p.m. Save

He can do Media and govern his state.. Imagine that!

Do you seriously think DeSantis is part of the federal government?

 

[SmilinDesperado]

Biden is implementing lots of progressive policies and is far from a status quo president, problem is he's not hitting the arbitrary check marks set by more-left-than-thou progressives. But idc if some childless corporate lawyer in her early 30s making six figures struggles to pay off her student debt because the rent for her upscale Manhattan apartment is just sooo high.

Strong boomer energy here, my dude.
This is a contradiction, and it doesn't represent the reality of the situation, or addresses what the "more-left-than-thou progressives" are actually talking about.

What percentage of student loan debt is crippling "childless corporate lawyers" ? How many of these people even exist? If you have a 6 figure position as a corporate lawyer then you're likely not struggling--so this isn't about whatever tiny percentage of them exist.
How many people make 6 figures in the US? It's like 9% of all people, whether they went to college and took out student loans or not.

If middle class starts around 50K, that isn't anything in a major city/state with prices and rent as high as it is, and then tacking on student debt on top of that...which is why we see more young people living at home later , not having families, and not being able to afford houses.

Actual poor students are more likely to have gotten more government assistance and a free ride.
It's exactly the so-called middle class that gets fucked the most. Their family made enough money to not be "poor", but "too much" money for their kids to qualify for aid. Even if you come from an upper middleclass/rich family, it doesn't mean that your family is/did help you pay for college.
And then factor in that 40% of people drop out, so you have people from all economic backgrounds saddled with student debt and no high paying corporate job to pay them off.

And does hiring the transgendered and black women count as progressive policy?

 

[SmilinDesperado]

lol at Kim Iverson being a "leftwing commentator".
We need to get rid of these stupid labels because they almost always are fucking useless and don't paint an accurate picture of people, or their views.

There are CLEAR grifters like Dave Rubin and Candace Owens. These people don't believe in anything, and are in it for the money.
And then there are people in the sort of middle like Tim Pool, Dore, and Tulsi....they want the money, but there is some issue or principle they seem to care about as well.
And then there are people like Rogan and Iverson....these people are different, and they don't really have a coherent political ideology, but I think they are generally sincere in their beliefs.

It makes no logical sense that you can go from Bernie, to Tulsi, to Bernie, to Trump, to DeSantis. You can't say you're on the left----Bernie Sanders left at that, and then say you're voting for Ron DeSantis 2 years later. It makes no sense. These people have wildly different ideas and philosophies.
You can't have a firm grasp on politics, the beliefs of these politicians, or your own beliefs and priorities to make such giant leaps.

 

[SBJJ]

Huh? We had off the charts growth last year, and Russia's economy is in shambles. And anyway, what do you call people who cheerlead for ethnonationalist dictators while opposing democracy and liberalism at home? I think it would be more honorable (still contemptible, though) if you guys would just state your views honestly and defend them.

Did you miss the last GDP number? We are at this moment entering a recession. While Russia is CURRENTLY hitting record revenues.

Your grasp on the economy as a whole seems to be in line with your grasp on inflation the last year.

Real wages are actually decreasing and we have one of the lowest labor participation rates ever. Meanwhile the productivity rate is dangerously low while the cost for most essential goods is up 30 to 50%.