lack of offense in training

Dr. BadAss said:
There's a training we do called "S training" (Submission training). They way it goes is that one guy does 3 subs (any of his chosing), then his oppenent does three. Back and forth. Your opponent lets you get the sub with little restraint, he taps, you loosen (but not release) the sub so that he can esacape. As he escapes he usually puts himself in a bad position, so you shift over to a new sub (i.e. armbar to omoplata).

The main key is to ALWAYS keep moving. The goal is fluidity, definitely not strength and not necessarily speed.
Click to expand...

We do this quite a bit on the instructional days. In fact, just last night, we worked on it so when you are in an armbar you walk out of it or compress them, then leave your arm open for them to work with. It is really good for getting a feel for the movements.

Don't get discouraged for not tapping people right away. It takes time.
 
Keep a diary of the submission techniques you learn - if you can't get them right away, come back to them later.
Ask the higher belts for advice. Listen to (most of) the advice on here.
Having an iron defence will help you out in the long run.
Like Stoic said, there's always gonna be someone who can tap you.
 
I felt the same way early on, I thought I would never tap anyone.

I've been training for 7 months now, and I'm finally at a point where I can catch people who have been there a year or more, it comes in time.

I personally did what a poster above mentioned, set small goals when rolling. I did things like just pulling guard and trying to not let them pass. Or just trying for one position than I never seem to get, or trying to maintain the mount when I get it.

After a while, I could work subs from the guard because people didn't pass it so easilly, I could work subs from the top because I wasn't getting rolled as easilly.
 
You need to roll with people who are equal to you in skill, and also those worse then you.

Always rolling with guys vastly better then you will indeed improve your defense, but you cant win with defense only. I've been in that situation so I know. I used to roll with a few guys who were heavier and knew more then me. I was always on the run and while my reversals and sub-defense improved a lot I never felt like I got to learn how I could best string together my subs and get my offensive game going.

So when I started rolling with guys my level and weight-class I learned a lot of stuff about what works for me and improved my ability to finish.

Then teaching people below my ability really improved my technique and helped me understand the subs and techniques a lot better and fine-tune them. teaching other stuff you know will do that.

So all three dynamics should be experienced. If you can't find people not vastly better then you at your school, try recruiting some people and roll with them on your own time. Teach some n00bs out of your garage, whatever...
 
By threee weeks of practice you won't be able to get offense going unless you are Tony Bonello. Try to just be aggressive and keep working at it, it takes time but it is worth the wait when you arrive.
 
Just stay positive. You won't be tapping guys over night, if you do you aren't training in the right place. When I started at my current academy I had a decent background. Had tapped blue belts from other schools with ease. When I came to my current academy I was respective, though I did expect to do well. My first BJJ class I rolled with two guys who completely dominated me. One was a D-1 national champion wrestler with a good BJJ background (blue belts, imho should be purple) the other was a purple belt and damn good.. Those two guys kicked my ass, they only trained that day though and within the week I tapped some blues and one purple (with a leglock). Now every class I rolled and trained with the best guys. I couldn't sub them like clockwork as I could with some blues, and they kicked my ass positionally wise.. But started rolling with Judo/BJJ purples BBs and State/national champion wrestlers I always got taken down.. (I am the type of guy who likes getting the takedown and working from top position) so what do you know.. my guard got REALLY fucking good.. I mean it is very difficult for an experienced guy to pass my open guard, if I get passed, or let them pass I reclaim guard immediatly.. Since then my takedowns and takedown defense has improved greatly so I can actually take down most of the guys (aside from the REALLY good wrestlers). So now I have smooth subs and transitions, pass most peoples guard like it isn't there, have a godlike guard, have awesome submission defense.. Yesterday (FINALLY) lol I caught the purple belt who tapped me my second day, got him with a leglock (which I wasn't too proud of since it is my specialty) and a americana from sidecontrol.. Rolling with him now I defend his subs and he defends mine (aside from yesterday)..

Moral of that longass story is training with people who kick your ass or are on your level will only help you improve and become a awesome grappler in the long rung (as I'm sure some guys on here have noticed those who avoid rolling with the good guys to save their ego do not improve hardly and just are not good on the ground) Patience is a virtue, in time you will be not getting tapped, keeping guard, and even passing..

Another thing, when I roll with Allan Goes. I expect to have a chance and even catch something (lmfao) of course he just toys with me and kicks my ass.. But rolling with him for one straight 40minute round (back when I was in good shape) I LEARNED more than I had probably learned in weeks of hard training 6 days a week 3-5 hours a day. Just stay positive, don't expect to lose and knowledge will come.

Goodluck in your journey
 
FStep said:
... its one thing if i was at least able to get a mount on someone and go for an armbar and have them escape because they're better
Click to expand...

After 3 weeks, doubtful you'll get full mount either.....but you never know.
3 weeks is nothing.
 
Don't worry.
I felt the same way as you when I first started BJJ. I sucked harder than Jenna Jameson on a vivid gangbang. But I kept at it and kept practicing, and kept getting my ass kicked everyday. I can still remember how sloppy my submission attempts were. But now whenever I roll with people, I am the one who feels confident because I know that I will be able to submit my opponents or at least be evenly matched with them. And I'm usually right...
 
u said u cant pass the guard? well there you go...everyone wants to learn submission...double flying armbars...use your training time to work on guard passes and positioning...it doesnt matter about your offensive game if you cant pass a guard, so make that your number one priority right now...and then later we'll worry about subbing anyone

but yea, its frustrating as hell
 
The guy who said that it is a constantly humbling experience is right. Just when you start to feel pretty good about yourself, you spend an entire match squirming underneath someone's sidemount...

Hang in there...
 
More experienced guys should be LETTING you start in superior position. There's absolutely no reason besides ego in the training environment for 1 year+ guys to just be crushing you over and over. I've never understood this deal where newer guys are forced to do nothing but defend until finally someone newer than them shows up.

I've been at it 2 years and I was the first student at my academy. Of course as such I have the most experience. Some of the others are pretty close.

I'm more than happy to let the white belts start with me in their guard, or under their side mount or mount and let them work while I defend at 50%. Once in a while one of them gets the tap before I can escape. It happened today in fact. An 8 month student started mounted and worked to side control and got the armbar. I just fiddled around until he almost had it sunk and only then really tried to escape. But he was nice and tight and got the tap.

Do they know that this happens because I go 1/2 speed? I think most do, but I stopped caring long ago.
 
iclimb513 said:
More experienced guys should be LETTING you start in superior position. There's absolutely no reason besides ego in the training environment for 1 year+ guys to just be crushing you over and over. I've never understood this deal where newer guys are forced to do nothing but defend until finally someone newer than them shows up.

I've been at it 2 years and I was the first student at my academy. Of course as such I have the most experience. Some of the others are pretty close.

I'm more than happy to let the white belts start with me in their guard, or under their side mount or mount and let them work while I defend at 50%. Once in a while one of them gets the tap before I can escape. It happened today in fact. An 8 month student started mounted and worked to side control and got the armbar. I just fiddled around until he almost had it sunk and only then really tried to escape. But he was nice and tight and got the tap.

Do they know that this happens because I go 1/2 speed? I think most do, but I stopped caring long ago.
Click to expand...

I do agree here with ya mate but my school has sort of the best of both worlds. Their defensive is strong & so is their offensive which I like. I think as newbie you need to drill basic guard passing again & again & again to ultimately master your offensive. Similarly, I'm glad that my opponents go at me hard because it works my defensive better. You do get a few guys with egos and you can tell even as a white belt, that JJ is EVERYTHING to them. They happily give advice, drill an escape, teach you a move they subbed you with, but if you come close to subbing em, get em with a nice sweep or keep up a really good defend & escape style, they'll get PISSSSSSSED!
 
u really need to work more technique and drill what you have learned-

maybe you are sparring just a little too much
 
i ve never been tapped because i'm the geatest of all time. i was walking down the street and tapped Rickson just by scratching myself. can't relate to you guys because i'm a special breed of fighter like chuck norris (the "sidekicks" one not the "texas ranger" one) or blanca. also, bjj dosen't work, only harcore karate taught by chuck norris's brother borris.
 
rolling with decent bjjers will quickly teach you what shit only works on 3 week white belts and save you time in the long run.

also, you need them to give you subs, not try to muscle it out. learn to set up subs or wait for them to make a mistake. better guys make less mistakes so you've just got to get better to compete with that.
 
Just more of the same from me. As time passed your defense will improve. Also, you will learn that the first step to getting a sub is positioning. When people first start they think, "If I only knew the arm bar I'd be tapping people all the time." Nope. You can only sink subs if you have a dominate position or if you're so good/experience that you can spot opportunities in an instant during a transition.

I tapped to everybody at first. We even had a girl (she got second at ADCC) that tapped me both of the times we rolled even though I was a lot bigger. Eventually I found that I knew which subs were coming and I was able to get position during people's failed sub attemps. Then I was able to get position with good sweeps against guys that were smaller than me. With that came chokes against people that had more skill. I've found that 30 lbs is worth about one belt (if you're not brand new).

As time passed new people joined the gym and I started getting joint locks. Now when a guy is a new to BJJ I decide going into it that I won't hit certain chokes because that's not what I need to work on. I'm far from a star. I'm a 7 month white belt and a decent athelte. But I have all three levels of people. Guys that own me, guys that are about the same, and guy that I can tool.
 
where do i fall in that listing? i'm so going to stack you in guard next time we go. i might even pass it too.

my bike went flat so i wont be tired when i show up either.

whatcha gonna do... BROTHER? when fight_songamania goes wild on YOU?!!
 
Fight_Song said:
where do i fall in that listing? i'm so going to stack you in guard next time we go. i might even pass it too.
Click to expand...
You're a good athelete so I've decided to beat you anyway I can. Once you get your first sub on me I'll lose the mental advantage so I hang on to it as long as I can. You have me scared. :p

One time I did let the guillotine go because I sort of know that already and I need to work something else. But for the most part I rank you as about equal and I give you my best game.

Edit: If things get really ugly and you start beating me a lot I know exactly how to defeat you. I'll stop washing my gi. :)
 
FStep said:
i've been doing bjj for about 3 weeks now and i love it and seem to be learning a lot etc but the problem i have is that the only class i'm able to make is all people with over a year experience so obviously i get my ass kicked by everyone in there ... i think my sub defense is improving from this as it is taking people longer and longer to tap me now but i don't feel like my offensive game is getting anywhere when we roll because i'm just unable to get any of the guys in my class with any subs that we are shown in training or really even get in position to try to sub them, can't pass anyones guard, etc the only thing i'm really able to work on when we roll is trying to avoid/get out of subs ... i'm not necessarily frustrated from getting tapped i know thats part of the learning process but i don't think i'll ever get my offense going this way

is this the wrong class for me to be taking or ... ?
Click to expand...

We are always taught position before submission. We focus more on getting out of bad positions than anything else at this stage, that is until blue belt.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,236,714
Messages
55,436,727
Members
174,775
Latest member
Ruckus245

Share this page

Back
Top