Knee Stability, Shoulder Joint Strength

[Monger]

Do you have a diagram for this measurement? =)

I think if you look up the 4 or 5 part article, Neanderthal No More, on T-Nation, they'll cover this with most other postural issues.

Also, if you want more reading material...

Check out Eric Cressey's site for tons of shoulder stuff and Mike Robertson has a few articles in terms of knee health.

 

[bacon]

Bacon, when you say "shoulder" in terms of being in front or in line with the collar bone, at which point do you measure? Top of shoulder or front of shoulder? I have some muscle in the front of my shoulder that's in front of the collar bone, but the collar itself drifts a little back from the chest to the shoulder. Do you have a diagram for this measurement? =)

Also, how about dumbbell bench pressing for a couple of months, then switching to barbell for a week or two before attempting a max?

In the same vein, though, I don't think I can give up cleans/snatches...

No diagram, but from what I've read (and I can't remember where) your entire shoulder should be behind your collar bone. The point of reference on the collar bone is near the center of you chest where it juts forward. I think I read this in a Cressey article or something...

As far as benching goes, I'm not qualified to say either way. Try it and see what happens.

You don't have to give up snatches or cleans, but you might want to try the one-armed versions for awhile.

 

[Monger]

I don't have an internal rotation problem. If anything, I have the opposite. I haven't benched since the beginning of last year. My problem according to an azn PT named Doug, is mostly a stability problem.

I gave up benching as well. I haven't done it in probably at least 6 months and my shoulders feel a lot better for it. I still do OHP'ing and some dumbbell pressing without issue. And I agree with your therapist big time with the neutral grip thing. It makes rowing, chins, and pressing much easier on the shoulders and, in my opinion, feels more natural as well.

 

[Donut62]

Knee issues can be similar in terms of looking at the big picture. Mobility or other issues with the surrounding joints (hips, ankles) can lead to knee issues and vice versa. Doing a lot of single leg exercise variations will be more specific in terms of strengthening the knee.

This is a great point and a very important one. The knee is a simple joint with a singular plane of motion, is more or less a slave to what happens above it and below it. Focusing on hip and ankle mobility are the two most important parts of keeping healthy knees.

 

[Donut62]

I gave up benching as well. I haven't done it in probably at least 6 months and my shoulders feel a lot better for it. I still do OHP'ing and some dumbbell pressing without issue. And I agree with your therapist big time with the neutral grip thing. It makes rowing, chins, and pressing much easier on the shoulders and, in my opinion, feels more natural as well.

I know from reading Dave Tate's log with all his shoulder problems he started doing bench work with one of these:

http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=212&pid=2468

There are probably cheaper ones out there, but it lets you still do full ROM barbell benching, but with the safer neutral grip.

 

[Cap'n]

I must be a freak then. DB rows hurt my shoulders more than conventional BB ones.

Benching feels better on my shoulders than OHP.

 

[REKillzone]

1) Are parallel squats dangerous for your knees, as opposed to say, ATG squats? I've heard ATG is both bad for your knees OR better for them than quarter or parallel squats.

i've had knee and ankle issues during football season so usually i just stick with doing powerlifter stance squats hitting parallel. i usually just go to ATG when doing squat cleans.

 

[statisticool]

So as you all know I play rugby.
...
I have had:

Knee meniscus torn
Knee ligaments strained/torn
Shoulder Labrum torn (right and left)
AC joint separation

all in 1.5 years of rugby and 9 months of serious lifting.
...
my injury rate is getting annoying. I need stable, strong, WELL BALANCED, and diesel joints.

Quit rugby which is getting you injured?

That's what some people would say.

Did you get injured mostly from rugby? And of the injury from the weightlifting?

 

[Richmond_Hrvat]

I'll stop playing rugby and grappling when I physically can't get up to go train. I really don't think I would lift at all if I didn't have sports to test my strength/flexibility/power/agility.

All the injuries I've gotten beyond strains/tweaks have been from rugby and grappling. I've never seriously hurt myself in the weight room, but improper lifting has given me an imbalance or two.

 

[joshetc]

Squats and variations (at least OHS and FS)
Pull-ups (and chin-ups)
Overhead Press (strict, military, push)
Shoulder Dislocations
Lots of dynamic stretching

That should help a lot.. and the workouts happen to be very effective for overall strength at the same time.